Do we hate Harry Potter and Twilight?

[Daneel]

I've quite enjoyed the Harry Potter movies; haven't read the books, but I'm sure they're fine.

With Twilight, I haven't read the books or seen the movies, so I guess I can't really judge it... but from what I have seen/heard of the series, I'm inclined to think that it wouldn't be to my liking, to put it mildly.

 

[Arpy]

I'm indifferent.

But here's something though. I'm a bit disconcerted today's kids, and I can no longer group myself in with/near them, are more interested in fantasy - magic and vampires - than science fiction. I wonder if it's a sign of our decline as a society. Having achieved material success, we now look to mysticism for fulfillment. We don't have patience for the future and are too individualistic and alienated for community, so we dream about being willful sorcerers and sexy detached undead.

I dunno. I've seen and enjoyed all the Harry Potters though, and I think its messages are good for kids for the most part. ...Alas there is no perfect dream school that teaches you everything you need to know when you need to know it to become a master of great supernatural powers with which you may defeat all the hardship of life personified in a powerful evil man. I fear kids go through the loss of Santa all over again, and teens search for villains were there is only strife and distance.

I'm less forgiving of Twilight. No sex? People need physical intimacy. It's not bad, and yes it is scary but that fear is actually understanding of how important it all is to us. Sure 14 year olds may not need intercourse, but fetish-izing abstinence only distorts one's world-view.

"Bella my whole life is about protecting you," negates one's own responsibility in taking care of one's self, not from the physical threat of evil monsters you'd do well to ally with good monsters against, but from exploring one's own being. Love should be symbiosis, not Bella leaching off Edward because she's too frightened to live. Again, I can see how this is powerful stuff for early teens, but they need to, you know, make it to their late-teens.

One thing I did like about Twilight was that it was sincere. There was no irony or sarcasm or snark with regard to these intense emotions we've all had in our own ways. Kids feel serious shit and it means something. Thank God we live in this "don't harsh my mellow, bra" age, but lets forgive ourselves when we do need to take things a little seriously. If for no other reason than if we don't, we'll have no way to deal with those people who, like myself I admit, too often take themselves too seriously.

 

[CaptainCanada]

But here's something though. I'm a bit disconcerted today's kids, and I can no longer group myself in with/near them, are more interested in fantasy - magic and vampires - than science fiction. I wonder if it's a sign of our decline as a society. Having achieved material success, we now look to mysticism for fulfillment. We don't have patience for the future and are too individualistic and alienated for community, so we dream about being willful sorcerers and sexy detached undead.

That strikes as pretty silly.

I've seen and enjoyed all the Harry Potters though, and I think its messages are good for kids for the most part. ...Alas there is no perfect dream school that teaches you everything you need to know when you need to know it to become a master of great supernatural powers with which you may defeat all the hardship of life personified in a powerful evil man.

There's also no starships; so what?

Kids know that.

 

[Kegg]

Yes. Yes, we do.

But we hate Stargate a lot more.

Works for me.

Can we see more Harry Potter hate, actually?

I mean, Twilight hate is all well and good and fun to read, but it's somewhat dying down in steam (or getting tiring to me) and Harry Potter hate still seems the more iconoclastic nerdy thing to do since there hasn't been as big a backlash (or has there?)

Certainly the Twilight hate about it being damaging to girls and misogynistic is considerably more entertaining than Potter being a portal to witchcraft, but I suppose one's tastes vary there. Any brave souls willing to offer the notion Harry Potter is misogynistic? Or racist? Or picks on little kids at school and calls them names? Work with me here.

...and I seriously do not have an opinion because I've never read the books or seen the films of the respective franchises. They were just never my bag, clearly.

Does this mean there's a shift in geek pop culture? Very likely, and it does at times seem to be a shift away from me. Sure, Star Trek picks me back up for the ride and Avatar is pointed in my general direction of 'cool exotic alien things ALSO EXPLOSIONS', but these stories about teen wizards and vampires... bleh. I'd rather be seeing a movie about a teen Kwisatz Haderach!

Ahem.

 

[SeerSGB]

Harry Potter, I kind of enjoy. The second movie I saw when me and the wife were first married, especially...though I didn't see a lot of the movie at that night

Twilight, I tried to read one of the books, and couldn't make it past the first few pages. The more I read up on it online-- thinking there was something I wasn't "getting" about-- the more I got to the point that I just can't stand the franchise or its fans. It isn't a "hate" as much as "Would you please shut up and go away, you're annoying".

 

[Icemizer]

I like the Potter movies(never read the books)My taste in vampires runs more towards the horrific so I go with Brian Lumleys Necroscope series. Twilight is just not in the same league.

 

[iguana_tonante]

Actually, I like Harry Potter's books (the movies are a-ok, but nothing special). The first two are easily for kids, but from Azkaban onward, it's good stuff for every age (as many have noted, pretty standard Hero's Journey, but still good stuff: I would put it in the same league as Star Wars). At least, its heart is on the right place.

Twilight, on the other hand, is bad literature, misogynistic drivel written by women for women. Honestly, I'm baffled.

 

[MeanJoePhaser]

I don't hate them, I have no interest in them.

Harry Potter is cutesy and pushes fantasy nerd chic for children and people who aren't necessarily nerds or fantasy enthusiasts. (Like the people who love The Wizard of Oz, but wouldn't like or admit to liking other fantasy or sci-fi.) I couldn't make it through the first movie. I generally don't like kid protagonist stories, not even when I was a kid. (Not too big on talking animals, either.) I'm glad, there's too only so much pop culture a person should like.

Twilight is a (relatively) new form of schmaltz aimed at women from what I gather. I might try to watch it for free, not gonna seek it out.

 

[Awesome Possum]

Harry Potter got better as it went on. I saw the movies first, at least the first two and didn't care for them. After the third film, I read the books and got into it.

Twilight is a Lifetime movie where the woman stays with the abusive boyfriend in the end, but he's a vampire instead of a jerk. I can't begin to comprehend why it is so popular.

 

[barnaclelapse]

I've become kind of indifferent about HP, but I've certainly enjoyed what I've read and seen (although that isn't very much--the first four books, and I've only seen all of the first film and bits of the two after that).

Twilight has honestly struck me as poor writing that has yielded an even crappier pop culture phenomenon with movies that I have tried to watch with an open mind and have still found nothing in them that's even remotely halfway decent in any sense of judging a film.

Stuff like Twilight is always on the pop culture map. This isn't a new thing. I just ignore it as best as I can and stick to my old, sad-bastard movies and books.

 

[Holoaddict]

I have seen all the Harry Potter movies so far. I am currently about a third of the way through book 5, Order of the Pheonix. I have never read the Twilight books, but I did see the first movie. This is just to show where I am coming from.

Regarding Harry Potter: I like the movies quite a bit. They are very fun and engaging. Plus the look spectacular to me. I am beginning to like the books even more. The first two books and movies are pretty similar to each other. But by the third entry the books just seem to add so much more to the story. Things are given time to develope and it really works. Book five is almost 1000 pages, and I am loving every bit of it. I have never actually looked forward to reading a book that long before. I am anxious to read the final two.

As for Twilight: I have two strikes againgst me already.

1. I am in my thirties.
2. I am a man.

I love vampire movies and TV shows. I grew up watching Buffy, Angel, and Forever Knight. I love the Fright Night movies, Blade, Love at First Bite, Underworld, and many others. But Twilight just does not work for me. It just seems too "teeny" for me. The angst is just a little too much. While watching the trailers for New Moon I had the strong urge to punch Bella in the mouth. I decided it was not a good idea to go see a movie that made me feel like that toward a main character I was supposed to identify with. Luckily for the franchise I am not the target demographic.

 

[JustKate]

No, we don't - at least we don't hate both of them. We like Harry Potter, movies and books (although we are less enthusiastic about the later movies and books), because we consider them a lot of fun. We think Twilight is pure, undiluted dreck, however.

 

[SeerSGB]

One of the things with Harry Potter is that the Hero has the classic "here cycle" sort of story. He's, for want a term, a "Luke Skywalker" / Joseph Campbell style character that we watch mature and mold into a inescapable destiny. There's a...almost sorrowful quality to Harry's life as the story goes on-- beyond the death of his parents.

 

[Chaos Descending]

I love the Harry Potter movies, though I haven't read the books.

I don't really hate Twilight; I just have no interest in it. If I want vampires, I'll watch Buffy.

In this, you and I are as one.

 

[paudemge]

I don't hate Harry Potter, I could never get in to the books, but I enjoy the movies well enough. I am amazed at how popular the books are.

Twilight, I watched the first movie because I heard it had vampires in it and it was super popular. The vampires don't really seem to be vampires but something else, the scene of the guy saving the girl from the suv, could have come straight out of smallville. I could hardly watch the entire movie.

And both franchises seem to me to have the same problem, that they don't seem realistic within there own world, if that makes sense. We have super ambitious wizards, why haven't they take over the world? The twilight vampires are so powerful they should have also taken over there world.

 

[Lapis Exilis]

I'm interested in both as pop culture phenomenon, much as I've kept my eye on Star Wars for the same reason. Plainly they are all satisfying entertainment for a lot of people. I think all three share a certain broad appeal via mediocrity of writing (not unlike the way The DaVinci Code did for a more adult audience), though HP has by far the cleverest world building. All three follow highly simplified basic mythic forms, rely on schmaltzy romance to a certain degree (obviously Twilight makes this far more central than the other two), build very clear Black Hats and White Hats that are comforting in their shallowness, and all three lack any sort of thematic depth that keep them well out of the literature range. Star Wars is adolescent male fantasy wish fulfillment, Twilight is adolescent female fantasy wish fulfillment, and HP probably achieves the best balance between the two. I don't hate or love any of them, but I find them interesting each in their own way, and I find their popularity to be of note for a variety of reasons.

 

[coolghoul]

^ You're an equal opportunity hater?!

Just kidding.

I understand some of the criticism about mediocrity of writing - High Literature these ain't. But Dan Brown - whose way of writing exposition all the time (the characters launch into these long lectures at each other at the drop of a hat!) - might certainly be used in "how-not-to-write" classes but the basic puzzlebox structure that he used with DaVinci really really worked. And for any author, you have to publish the book at some time. You can't keep polishing the work due to the economics of writing bestseller fiction.

 

[SeerSGB]

Ugh...Brown. Another one that gives me a headache when trying to read his books-- have yet to make it through one yet.

 

[Bob The Skutter]

I've read the whole lot of both of them.
Harry Potter I really like, both the books and the movies.
Twilight, eh, guilty pleasure reading even though I recognise it's pretty horrible, the movies are even worse.

 

[JustKate]

Ugh...Brown. Another one that gives me a headache when trying to read his books-- have yet to make it through one yet.

Me, too. I mean, I know it's not supposed to be great literature, and I do sometimes enjoy mindless froth, but when I have tried to read Brown as mindless froth - you know, just sit back, shut down my critical faculties and enjoy the ride - the gigantic gaping plotholes just reached out and whacked me right across the head, just hard enough to bring the horrible writing into sharp relief.

But honestly, I might be able to forgive all that except that I guessed the mystery oh, less than halfway through the book. How disappointing was that?