Have you ever been turned off of an author's books...

[Julio Angel Ortiz]

I stopped reading Trek books after I went to Shore Leave and every single author stabbed me in the face with their pens.

-sniffle-

God I miss it...

................................................................................


Oh, pens.

 

[Dayton Ward]

I believe you were the one who told me the story about a rather large-breasted woman at a renaissance fair sitting beneath a 'free milk' sign... but... I could be wrong.

Getting stabbed in the face really screws with my memory.

Let me rephrase. If I'd stabbed you, you wouldn't be able to complain about it.

 

[Lorraine Anderson]

...I've been writing novel-length fiction since I was 12. Seriously. I had to learn to write short fiction for Trek....

Funny. I'm just starting on my first novel length fiction at age 50. Everybody's different!

Precisely. I still am writing the occasional short story when they hit me. I've even got one to finish this weekend that was requested for an anthology coming out next year. But I'm so happy to be back writing long fiction it's kinda scary.

I guess it's my short attention span. If I spend too long on a story, I tend to want to end it. But I've been learning quite a bit about novel writing from a fantastic group I'm in!

 

[Vance]

Well, there's a reason I don't buy Star Trek books anymore... :P

More seriously, I generally find that an author really can't seperate himself too far from what he writes (try as he might, at times). If I find books objectionable, I'm likely not going to get along with the writer. If I find a writer objectionable for some reason, chances are strong that I won't like the books either.

This isn't always true, of course, but it happens an awful lot... enough that I consider it a fairly strong rule of thumb.

 

[Marie1]

@ Dayton's post...

I know, I mean there are some people around here who think I'm nice!

Stop insulting people's intellgence!!

Seriously, this started out as a "serious" type thing and turned into one of the funniest things I've read in a long time... mixed still with... wow...

 

[TerriO]

I guess it's my short attention span. If I spend too long on a story, I tend to want to end it. But I've been learning quite a bit about novel writing from a fantastic group I'm in!

As opposed to me, who had to learn to curb my urge to throw a change-up at the plot.

I stopped reading Trek books after I went to Shore Leave and every single author stabbed me in the face with their pens.

-sniffle-

God I miss it...

................................................................................


Oh, pens.

Honey, totally the wrong equipment. And believe me when I say if I wielded a pen in that manner, the result would be much the same as Dayton's.

Don't need that piece of equipment to be, well, me.

 

[wizkid]

How many writers, I wonder, have been turned off writing because their fans are a bunch of dicks? I'd be surprised if it hasn't happened.

I'm certain of it. With any kind of entertainment, be it music, movies, books, whatever, some fans seem to have this sense of entitlement, as if everything the artist does should conform to the fans' personal preferences.

The whole entitlement thing only goes one way?

 

[Kelso]

It's one thing to be knowledgeable about certain areas. It's quite different to spout off Wikipedia type facts in every post. I like having conversations on the TrekBBS, not being lectured.

Try being wrong less often. The problem might sort itself out.

 

[rahullak]

I think most of you guys who are objecting to Christopher are taking his posts too seriously and too personally. Christopher reminds me of Mr. Spock in a lot of ways -- he's usually not trying to offend anyone or to make anyone feel bad, it's just that he's a rigorously logical person who holds every statement he encounters to that same standard of logic. That can come across as being rude at times, but I don't think that's intentional -- he's just a very frank, very linear, very "If A then B: A, therefore B," kind of guy, and if someone tries to claim, "If A then B: B, therefore A," he's going to pick that apart.

I see nothing wrong for a poster to pick things apart if they appear untrue or incorrect to him/her. The problem arises when a poster assumes something not actually said (usually like an assumption of a lack of some knowledge or morality or ethics) , or misinterprets/reads a post in a way that suits the argument in the worst possible way when there are ways of reading the post to suit the opposite argument in the best possible way or attempts to "win" the argument by being borderline personal or insulting another's intelligence.

This either a) Scares some people away b) pisses off other people c) enlightens and amuses others as to the way people can behave d) enlightens people with just the facts/information; in increasing order of the ability of the receiver to remain impersonal.

And I'm sure people who do these would not want someone to do these same things to them or their posts.

Sometimes things really are a matter of opinion or a differing world view with a different set of assumptions. Not to mention the existence of vagueness in the use and meaning of language and the lack of voice and tone on a BBS, or our inability to spell out every minor detail and assumption we make when we write.

By and large, I have found Christopher's posts to be enlightening. But I have been at the receiving end a few times of unwarranted assumptions (such as being a warmonger , or someone who doesn't know the Second Law of Thermodynamics), but I've usually not pursued it, because I have met people in real life who are sometimes needlessly argumentative, and who are not half as smart or erudite as Christopher is.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

It's one thing to be knowledgeable about certain areas. It's quite different to spout off Wikipedia type facts in every post. I like having conversations on the TrekBBS, not being lectured.

Try being wrong less often. The problem might sort itself out.

Of course, when people put things that way, it's not exactly the way to win friends and influence people. Which is, I believe, the point that several are making here. You can be smart all day, but if you can't wield it properly, then all that intelligence ends up going to waste because no one feels like they have any incentive to want to listen. For me, it's especially glaring for an author because if your craft is your words, and you have to write characters convincingly, then you should KNOW how your words affect people.

 

[Lonemagpie]

Oh, pens.

Honey, totally the wrong equipment. And believe me when I say if I wielded a pen in that manner, the result would be much the same as Dayton's.

Some people need to visit the self defence workshops I sometimes do, where I demonstrate that yes, the pen *can* be Wardier than the sword if used correctly and aimed at the right part of the body...

 

[donners22]

I think most of you guys who are objecting to Christopher are taking his posts too seriously and too personally. Christopher reminds me of Mr. Spock in a lot of ways -- he's usually not trying to offend anyone or to make anyone feel bad, it's just that he's a rigorously logical person who holds every statement he encounters to that same standard of logic. That can come across as being rude at times, but I don't think that's intentional -- he's just a very frank, very linear, very "If A then B: A, therefore B," kind of guy, and if someone tries to claim, "If A then B: B, therefore A," he's going to pick that apart.

Indeed. I can see how it would be annoying, but it's a rather Aspergian thing to do. Hence, I just let it go, the same way people ignore me (politely, for the most part) when I do something similar.

 

[Count Zero]

Of course, when people put things that way, it's not exactly the way to win friends and influence people. Which is, I believe, the point that several are making here. You can be smart all day, but if you can't wield it properly, then all that intelligence ends up going to waste because no one feels like they have any incentive to want to listen.

I think that's silly behaviour, though all too common these days where people expect knowledge and wisdom to be served to them in a way that's the most comfortable for them. It's their loss, I guess.
There's a professor of Ancient History here at my university who has a bad reputation among students and his seminars are therefore often avoided. He's actually rather nice but somewhat difficult sometimes. I've found he always has very intelligent and worthwhile things to say. I've learned a lot from him. But a lot of people miss out on that because they feel knowledge has to be imparted to them on their own terms.

 

[rahullak]

^
Hmm....I can separate the personality of the teacher from the knowledge being imparted. It's just easier and quicker to understand and appreciate it if the lecturer is less prickly, especially on a bad day. I can accept learning from difficult teachers. But given a choice between them and people who can give me the same information couched in a more elegant and dignified way, I'd choose the latter.

And no, one does not have to be prickly/condescending or presumptuous to be an extremely knowledgeable teacher...I believe that's why teaching is also an art, not just the spouting of information. I think, it's about leading people from what they know to what the lecturer wants them to know, about having discussions on open questions, not about proving that the lecturer knows what he's talking about, nor about winning arguments with students.

I don't know if this is a famous quote or not, but just popped into my head: "Patience is a teacher's best friend."

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

A teacher, to me, is a different case because they are given legitimate authority (to a degree) over their students as far as how they wish to run their class, how they want to grade, etc. As rahullak says, with a teacher I would far prefer to be treated respectfully, but if necessary I can get the information I need under whatever the circumstances short of harassment and I have done well many times in classes under such circumstances.

An author or fellow BBS poster, though--there is no basis upon which authority is grounded. Even if you have knowledge, you do not have such authority that the ordinary rules of respect towards others do not apply.

 

[Nardpuncher]

A teacher, to me, is a different case because they are given legitimate authority (to a degree) over their students as far as how they wish to run their class, how they want to grade, etc. As rahullak says, with a teacher I would far prefer to be treated respectfully, but if necessary I can get the information I need under whatever the circumstances short of harassment and I have done well many times in classes under such circumstances.

An author or fellow BBS poster, though--there is no basis upon which authority is grounded. Even if you have knowledge, you do not have such authority that the ordinary rules of respect towards others do not apply.

True, and to add as I did before, it's the dissecting and ridiculing of innocuous opinions that irks me.
It's like somebody being baffled as to why I don't like the smell of sweaty, dirty old socks but still have a taste for Stilton cheese even though they smell the same.

The really odd thing is that he had a character in Ex Machina that came from an alien race that was incredibly adept at reading people's body language and tones to ascertain their true feelings/state of mind and then think of the proper way to react and interact accordingly. It was supposed to be that large-headed character we see in The Motion Picture that says Decker's been with the Enterprise every minute of her refitting .
How ironic.

 

[Sci]

A teacher, to me, is a different case because they are given legitimate authority (to a degree) over their students as far as how they wish to run their class, how they want to grade, etc. As rahullak says, with a teacher I would far prefer to be treated respectfully, but if necessary I can get the information I need under whatever the circumstances short of harassment and I have done well many times in classes under such circumstances.

An author or fellow BBS poster, though--there is no basis upon which authority is grounded. Even if you have knowledge, you do not have such authority that the ordinary rules of respect towards others do not apply.

True, and to add as I did before, it's the dissecting and ridiculing of innocuous opinions that irks me.

An opinion that can't withstand dissection doesn't deserve any mercy. As for ridicule, I rather think Christopher displays far more personal respect for other posters than anyone complaining about his behavior has shown for him.

 

[JarodRussell]

An opinion that can't withstand dissection doesn't deserve any mercy.

What kind of statement is that? An opinion is exactly that: just an opinion. You can dissect everyone's opinion, because it is not fact.

 

[Snaploud]

Okay, so we've covered Christopher's posting style as well as any possible social disorders...

*checks off items from list*

Now, when are we going to talk about his love life, finances, and political affiliations? Come on, people! We have to get moving if we're going to completely dissect the man's entire existence! I want blood!

 

[Therin of Andor]

The really odd thing is that he had a character in Ex Machina that came from an alien race that was incredibly adept at reading people's body language and tones to ascertain their true feelings/state of mind and then think of the proper way to react and interact accordingly. It was supposed to be that large-headed character we see in The Motion Picture that says Decker's been with the Enterprise every minute of her refitting .

The Rhaandarite bridge ensign, Vaylin Zaand, named for the actor who played him in TMP, Billy Van Zandt.

How ironic.

Ironic that an author might have a character in a novel aspiring to achieve things the author himself is accused of having difficulty doing at times?

Sounds like so many characters in so many novels to me!