Marian
I'm now waiting for the first "that's what you get for having gays in the military" post...
Note from a cranky editor
- Thread starter Greg Cox
- Start date
I'm now waiting for the first "that's what you get for having gays in the military" post...
NO! NO! NO! IT WILL NEVER BE!
Also, this really is a great thread.
I'm not trying to offend anyone here, but I have to agree. I'm not exactly perfect myself, but I must admit I was shocked at how bad American spelling, particularly among the youth seemed to be when I went to college there about a decade ago.
.... sequal.
Does that come after the originel??
Anyone have any thoughts from my comment upthread about "wrack" vs. "rack"?
Definately!
I blame texting to some extent. You wouldn't believe the amount of papers I received from students that had texting spelling in it. When I marked them off for it, they had no idea why.
I mean, I know I am not the world's greatest speller, but even I know that there is something wrong with, "If u r reading...".
Texting has added a lot of shortcuts to the written word, but I think the rapid decline has more to do with the Internet and e-mail. So many people post messages or send e-mails and they apparently can't be bothered to proofread anything they write - they just hit "Send" and their words, right or wrong, are on their way. I'd also include word processors in the pile of blame - people assume that their spell checker is somehow infallible, and they don't care whether a "where" becomes "were," whether "their" escapes as "there" or "they're," and certainly not whether (or is it "weather?") "it's" should be "its" - it passed the spellcheck, it must be right! Right? Write? And rather than ("then?") take responsibility for either poor education or simply laziness, they defend their mistakes as 'language yearning to evolve.'
Bullshit!
Language evolves because it has to in order to facilitate communication, or because cultures mingle, or even because cultures become isolated. The very thing people use to excuse the 'evolution' of language is what should be slowing that "evolution" down: the Internet. Cultures are becoming less isolated, and communication is nearly instantaneous - it doesn't need to be translated or explained any more. Adding words from one language into another, or adapting them to the receiver's linguistic rules, is the way languages evolve now - primarily by addition and expansion. There's no excuse and no need to accept lazy spelling or grammar as somehow "acceptable" when both parties, as well as anyone else exposed to the message, know full well the right spelling and grammar. We're not adapting our language in order to communicate - we're ignoring the basics that allow that to happen in the first place. People aren't too stupid to know better - they're just too lazy and selfish to do things properly, and too full of their own vanity to realize that everything they type isn't gold.
The Internet has allowed a culture of verbal masturbation, where people get off on how many other people they can reach with their words, and the faster the better. And, yes, I realize my post here is as good an example of it as anything else
.
Bullshit!
Language evolves because it has to in order to facilitate communication, or because cultures mingle, or even because cultures become isolated. The very thing people use to excuse the 'evolution' of language is what should be slowing that "evolution" down: the Internet. Cultures are becoming less isolated, and communication is nearly instantaneous - it doesn't need to be translated or explained any more. Adding words from one language into another, or adapting them to the receiver's linguistic rules, is the way languages evolve now - primarily by addition and expansion. There's no excuse and no need to accept lazy spelling or grammar as somehow "acceptable" when both parties, as well as anyone else exposed to the message, know full well the right spelling and grammar. We're not adapting our language in order to communicate - we're ignoring the basics that allow that to happen in the first place. People aren't too stupid to know better - they're just too lazy and selfish to do things properly, and too full of their own vanity to realize that everything they type isn't gold.
The Internet has allowed a culture of verbal masturbation, where people get off on how many other people they can reach with their words, and the faster the better. And, yes, I realize my post here is as good an example of it as anything else
.
^Can I quote you on the "verbal masturbation?"
Thank goodness it's not referring to speaking, or it'd be "oral masturbation".^Can I quote you on the "verbal masturbation?"
I'd like to defend the word processor. I had never received any formal schooling in English until the collegiate level, at which point basics like spelling and syntax were assumed knowledge; watching the word processor correct my mistakes was extremely useful for self-instruction. And, of course, a word processor is objective. You wouldn't believe how many years I spent, for instance, spelling 'only' as 'olny' until the spell check got on my case; other people have to have realized these errors, but I can only assume were too reticent or didn't think it worth the effort to correct me. Used correctly, I think it's a valuable tool.
Fictitiously yours, Trent Roman
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Precisely, it's a tool, not a catch-all. Most people tend to use it as the first, last and only line of defence in the fight against misspelling and bad grammar.
From the point of view of an immigrant who watched American shows at an early age and learned the English language while growing up in a foreign country, the grammar and usage problems that some Americans seem to have stem from the quality of instruction they're given in school.
When I first came to the U.S. in my teens, I was no stranger to English, but all my English classes basically focused on reading and literature. I mean, students were given a lot of reading assignments (from pocket-book novels to literary classics like Shakespeare and Dickens); I practically got sick of reading.
(Even to this day, I read very little fiction.) When asked about the parts of speech, my classmates--all native-born Americans or immigrants who came to America at a very young age and spoke fluent English--were ... absolutely ... clueless! 
I thought, "Wow! Is something wrong with the secondary education system in this country?!?"
In college there was a lot of writing involved--or should I say, more critical literary writing--but the focus on grammar and writing mechanics was only secondary. There should be a whole freakin' curriculum on Spelling, Grammar, and Punctuation!
When I first came to the U.S. in my teens, I was no stranger to English, but all my English classes basically focused on reading and literature. I mean, students were given a lot of reading assignments (from pocket-book novels to literary classics like Shakespeare and Dickens); I practically got sick of reading.
(Even to this day, I read very little fiction.) When asked about the parts of speech, my classmates--all native-born Americans or immigrants who came to America at a very young age and spoke fluent English--were ... absolutely ... clueless! I thought, "Wow! Is something wrong with the secondary education system in this country?!?"In college there was a lot of writing involved--or should I say, more critical literary writing--but the focus on grammar and writing mechanics was only secondary. There should be a whole freakin' curriculum on Spelling, Grammar, and Punctuation!
Thank goodness it's not referring to speaking, or it'd be "oral masturbation".^Can I quote you on the "verbal masturbation?"
Autofellatio by any other name.
A mistake I often come across: "cachet" (pronounced "cashay"), which means a seal of approval, a mark of distinction or prestige, getting misspelled as "cache" or "caché." I suppose this is an understandable mistake since the t at the end is silent, and the French word endings -et and -é sound interchangeable to Anglophone ears. Still, it's a mistake nonetheless.
Worse, I sometimes hear "cache" (a hiding place or the goods stored therein) mispronounced as "cashay" when it should be homophonous with "cash." This is presumably a case of people confusing it with "cachet." It probably gets misspelled as "caché" sometimes too. There is no such English word as "caché," although it is a French word meaning "hidden" (or the past participle of the verb meaning "to hide").
Oh, and I was just reminded of another misspelling for "definitely." Sometimes I see it spelled "defiantly!"
Worse, I sometimes hear "cache" (a hiding place or the goods stored therein) mispronounced as "cashay" when it should be homophonous with "cash." This is presumably a case of people confusing it with "cachet." It probably gets misspelled as "caché" sometimes too. There is no such English word as "caché," although it is a French word meaning "hidden" (or the past participle of the verb meaning "to hide").
Oh, and I was just reminded of another misspelling for "definitely." Sometimes I see it spelled "defiantly!"
I have a great editor. No, it's not OpenOffice for MS Word, or even my eagle eye.
My fiancée uses her sharp eyes and catches everything I miss, both spelling and grammar. And the worst thing is that she's a natural with no special training. She is a Kindergarten teacher though so that probably helps.
But I make some seriously dumb amateur mistakes. double words, missing letters and words, etc. She also picks me up on my word choice and tells me that since I'm writing it for the US market, it might be an idea to stop using words that the majority of Americans are unfamiliar with, British colloquialisms and the like.
Keeps me on my toes.
My fiancée uses her sharp eyes and catches everything I miss, both spelling and grammar. And the worst thing is that she's a natural with no special training. She is a Kindergarten teacher though so that probably helps.
But I make some seriously dumb amateur mistakes. double words, missing letters and words, etc. She also picks me up on my word choice and tells me that since I'm writing it for the US market, it might be an idea to stop using words that the majority of Americans are unfamiliar with, British colloquialisms and the like.
Keeps me on my toes.
May I whine a bit to my fellow grammaristas? Ah, thanks - I don't know how I'd manage without you.
What is the Deal with People who capitalize Things that don't Need to be Capped? It's bad enough when they cap Titles and Ranks for no real reason - OK, at least those are capped sometimes, and different style guides have different rules for capping them.
But for some people, it's as though their keyboards have some sort of Random Word capping Feature and they can't figure out how to turn it Off.
I sat through a three-hour meeting yesterday (thanks to all of you for your condolences) during which we went through several written reports, and every single one, including from people I would have thought knew better, had all this weird capping. Some actual examples, none of which, I swear, were part of a proper name: Member, Group, Staff, Issue, Kit (kit?), Activity (no, please, nooo), Successful (you are kidding me, right?) and, last but certainly not least, Phone Call.
What with one thing and another, it was a very long meeting. Or should I say Long Meeting?
What is the Deal with People who capitalize Things that don't Need to be Capped? It's bad enough when they cap Titles and Ranks for no real reason - OK, at least those are capped sometimes, and different style guides have different rules for capping them.
But for some people, it's as though their keyboards have some sort of Random Word capping Feature and they can't figure out how to turn it Off.
I sat through a three-hour meeting yesterday (thanks to all of you for your condolences) during which we went through several written reports, and every single one, including from people I would have thought knew better, had all this weird capping. Some actual examples, none of which, I swear, were part of a proper name: Member, Group, Staff, Issue, Kit (kit?), Activity (no, please, nooo), Successful (you are kidding me, right?) and, last but certainly not least, Phone Call.
What with one thing and another, it was a very long meeting. Or should I say Long Meeting?
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