Dollhouse 2x2 "Instinct" tonight 10/2 Grade-Discuss **Spoilers**

[Worf2DS9]

I found this episode to be absolutely uninteresting. Who cares about a fake one shot character worrying about her fake one shot baby?

Yeah, that's pretty much how I felt as well. I was pretty much bored by most of this episode. Why should we care about Echo freaking out over a baby that isn't hers?

I'm the most conflicted over this show than any other I can remember. I feel that I want to like the show, but after season 1 I'm still not sure if I want to invest my time in it, yet I keep tuning in hoping I'll make a decision one way or another. I almost wish it would be cancelled so the decision would no longer be in my hands.

 

[Mr Light]

Yeah, I want to love anything by Whedon, but this show is just completely morose and slow and uninteresting. It's so out of character for him. Trying something different I suppose. Buffy... Angel... Firefly... Astonishing X-Men... Buffy Season Eight... I love all these things!

 

[Ayelbourne]

Why should we care about Echo freaking out over a baby that isn't hers?

Because, like Adelle said, for all intends and purposes this is her baby.
Her feelings, while being made up, are absolutely genuine. Just like those of the biological mother would be.
Emotionally there is no difference.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Well, not quite to themselves: November had her grief cut out from her; she remembers losing her child, but doesn't feel it. And if these people are wealthy, one wonders why she didn't just pay the Dollhouse to excise that part of her in the first place instead of going through the ringamarolle of being a doll for five years

Well, "restored to themselves" was shorthand on my part - I noted that Mellie now functions in an emotionally limited fashion. And by "wealthy" I meant the apparent wealth that they acquire in exchange for their five years as Actives, not anything they might have brought with them.

I'm not conflicted about the series at all any more - I really like it. It's unsettling and continually raises all sorts of questions about how and why people live and think about the world and our lives as we do - for me it does, anyway. In a bizarre kind of off-kilter way Dollhouse reflects more of the moral reality of this world than anything I can remember watching on television. So it's provocative and disturbing.

There's a lot more depth and ambiguity here than in Firefly. While I liked that series a lot I never considered it Whedon's best. This is a more fully "grown-up" fantasy than most of his previous output.

And the ratings suck, and Dollhouse will be gone very soon, and I'll miss it.

 

[Checkmate]

Yeah, I want to love anything by Whedon, but this show is just completely morose and slow and uninteresting. It's so out of character for him.

<shrugs>

That's how I've seen most of his shows. Dollhouse is coming along just as well as all of his other shows have. Not really sure why people think this one is so different from the others beyond the rose-colored glasses.

 

[Mr Light]

Whedon's work (for me) has always been defined by the hilariously clever dialogue with funny wordplay, which elevates it above being just another genre drama where people suffer. You take away the funny, you take away what makes his work unique and interesting.

 

[DarthPipes]

Could Mellie's "acceptance" of her daughter's death have anything to do with that great "Needs" episode last season?

 

[Chaos Descending]

...And if these people are wealthy, one wonders why she didn't just pay the Dollhouse to excise that part of her in the first place instead of going through the ringamarolle of being a doll for five years (from the number of actives walking around in the background, it doesn't seem like there's a dearth of candidates). Although, come to think of it, isn't one of the contract's provisos that dolls are well renumerated at the end of their contracts? So perhaps November wasn't wealthy before, and had only herself to bargain with; whereas now she's been paid for her (abortive) service.

Fictitiously yours, Trent Roman

As I understand it, she's wealthy BECAUSE she was a doll. Five years of service as a a high priced meat-mannequin pays a lot of bank.

 

[Chaos Descending]

Yeah, I want to love anything by Whedon, but this show is just completely morose and slow and uninteresting. It's so out of character for him.

<shrugs>

That's how I've seen most of his shows. Dollhouse is coming along just as well as all of his other shows have. Not really sure why people think this one is so different from the others beyond the rose-colored glasses.

I can't speak for others, but Buffy and Firefly had me hooked from episode one.

Angel, meh.

I almost gave up on Dollhouse after the first three or four episodes. I only stuck with it because my wife wanted to see where it was going.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Could Mellie's "acceptance" of her daughter's death have anything to do with that great "Needs" episode last season?

I would doubt it, because Echo, Sierra, November, and Victor were all dolls during that episode. They weren't actually their original selves; they were programmed to be like their original selves.

 

[Ayelbourne]

No they really got their original personalities back in that episode. The only thing missing where their memories.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

They were edited versions of themselves; that doesn't make them what they were originally were, just like what they originally were.

Maybe it's semantic nitpicking. But they weren't exactly who they were before they became Dolls.

 

[Lindley]

When is Topher's genius going to catch up to him? His overly programming of the maternal drive led to this Echo malfunction. Topher may be the most accidental dangerous person in the house.

May be? It was strongly implied that he's the one who came up with the concept that ultimately destroyed civilization in Los Angeles, and possibly on a wider scale.

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yn2wxdwFDSw[/yt]

 

[Snaploud]

Topher is the most dangerous person who ever lived.

 

[Tomato]

^

Holy smokes.. that is brutal.

 

[Forbin]

I like that he has an Etcha-Sketch.

 

[Ayelbourne]

May be? It was strongly implied that he's the one who came up with the concept that ultimately destroyed civilization in Los Angeles, and possibly on a wider scale.

Very possible, I'd say. Why stop at L.A. when all you have to do is to make a phone call?

 

[Forbin]

Aaaand in some kind of speed record, Zodcaps.com has caps of the breast feeding scene up already.
http://forum.zodcaps.com/showthread.php?t=5450

 

[Captain Craig]

When is Topher's genius going to catch up to him? His overly programming of the maternal drive led to this Echo malfunction. Topher may be the most accidental dangerous person in the house.

May be? It was strongly implied that he's the one who came up with the concept that ultimately destroyed civilization in Los Angeles, and possibly on a wider scale.

And this is why we talk. To remind each other of details. I had totally forgotten this scene.

Therefore I retract my motion of "may be most dangerous" and insisit that he is the most dangerous.

 

[Technobuilder]

I really want to see where the shows larger story is going.

The element that I found very interesting from this episode was that Topher said he couldn't tweak a human brain without wiping the mind first (otherwise it would collapse like a house of cards), however, he seemed to have no issues with putting "Upgrades" into November/Madeline... Even though she's her again, she's still technically an active with an imprint... it just happens to be her original (slightly modified imprint)

I'd wager, that Rossum Virus from Season 1 would affect her just like it would an active now too.