If you wanted post apocalyptic conditions, tonight's your night, good people. If you wanted to know what Lucifer is up to, don't miss it. It was penned by Ben Edlund himself. As hilariously psycho as his scripts can be, Edlund has written two of the best, deadly serious episodes of SPN in "On the Head of a Pin" (Dean torturing Alistari) and "Nightshifter" (which introduced the marvelous Victor Henricksen). It's time to reveal the end game plan.
Supernatural 5x4 "The End" discussion thread spoilery
- Thread starter Dorian Thompson
- Start date
I've been rewatching season 2 lately and it's amazing what you pick up with a little bit of hindsight. Especially in what seemed almost like a slightly off-arc, out of character episode like Houses of Holy and how heavily it really foreshadowed what was coming (The priest descrbing Michael as slayer of demons, bringer of light? and how scary the angels were really supposed to be?).
I've seen pictures from tonight's episode and it's a bit spoilery, I guess but I'm guessing some elements of Croatoan are going to play into tonight's episodes. I get the feeling that Sam being immune to that virus is going to be hugely important. Combine that with last week's revelation and I definitely think we'll be seeing an evil Sammy tonight.
I've seen pictures from tonight's episode and it's a bit spoilery, I guess but I'm guessing some elements of Croatoan are going to play into tonight's episodes. I get the feeling that Sam being immune to that virus is going to be hugely important. Combine that with last week's revelation and I definitely think we'll be seeing an evil Sammy tonight.
Oh, Houses of the Holy was full of foreshadowing and then some. This show is pretty expert at planting little clues that you don't realize are clues at the time along the way.
Here's the Canadian SPACE channel promo for tonight. It's a tad spoilery.
The End Space channel promo
Here's the Canadian SPACE channel promo for tonight. It's a tad spoilery.
The End Space channel promo
so im assuming dean will find out that sam is lucifers vessel in this one?
One would presume he would. We shall see.
That's my second favorite line this season. The first being "I assure you, God is not on any type of flat-bread."
Damn, Ben Edlund knows how to bring it with the pain and the maudlin. 
Lucifer telling Dean that it's inevitable--no matter what choices you make, what alterations you make....we'll end up here. And that's supported by Dean's experiences in the past with his mother--she made the deal for John anyway. It's supported by Chuck, too. No matter how much Dean tried to change the story, Sam ended up in the "red motel" with Lilith.
Ackles is so superb at creating an alternate self that's believably different....just "off" enough. I thought Padalecki was pretty chilling as Lucifer, too. I want to see more of him and Pellegrino together. There was no confrontation. I was expecting a confrontation with Lucifer and the two Deans. I like that Edlund curve balled us out of that. Lucifer broke future Dean's neck lickety split without a speech, and then preceded to tell Dean it was hopeless. Now that Lucifer--pure evil. This was a character piece masquerading as an action piece. SPN does that best IMO.
Damn, the angels are worthless. And what, exactly, is Dean supposed to do now? He's right to be wary of Zach's little lesson.
Lucifer telling Dean that it's inevitable--no matter what choices you make, what alterations you make....we'll end up here. And that's supported by Dean's experiences in the past with his mother--she made the deal for John anyway. It's supported by Chuck, too. No matter how much Dean tried to change the story, Sam ended up in the "red motel" with Lilith. Ackles is so superb at creating an alternate self that's believably different....just "off" enough. I thought Padalecki was pretty chilling as Lucifer, too. I want to see more of him and Pellegrino together. There was no confrontation. I was expecting a confrontation with Lucifer and the two Deans. I like that Edlund curve balled us out of that. Lucifer broke future Dean's neck lickety split without a speech, and then preceded to tell Dean it was hopeless. Now that Lucifer--pure evil. This was a character piece masquerading as an action piece. SPN does that best IMO.
Damn, the angels are worthless. And what, exactly, is Dean supposed to do now? He's right to be wary of Zach's little lesson.
This week was much better than last week and is probably the show's best effort so far this season. It isn't what I call solid because it is uneven. And this continued disjointed nature or fluctuations in quality between the various scenes within the hour really hinders the overall quality of the episode.
It certainly wasn't ENT's "Twilight" or Heroes' "Five Years Gone" when it comes to episodes set in the future depicting the fallout and stakes of the Big Threat.
The guest stars were just "there" and I don't have a lot to say good or bad about any of them except for Castiel who I really didn't care for in his future portrayal. Misha was fine I just didn't care for the material.
TYhis show's production has been so limited because of budget that a lot of the time the show feels very empty and superficial at times snapping me right out of the story but I must say the on location shoot at the end really helped add a real feel to the series of being more than just a show shot on a soundstage on the same sets redressed over and over.
And it isn't really SN'sfault but the glut of apocalyptic fare over the last few years really has desensitized me to the attempts at depicting a character having become dark or fatalistic. A lot of times it feels like spectacle just for the sake of the contrived shock value than generating an honest visceral impact. So Dean torturing or shooting some poor fool in cold blood just doesn't carry the dramatic intentions I'm sure the writers have. I blame a lot of that on most notably nBSG where dark creative choices was the norm and it became so predictable that it blunted these sorts of scenes.
The only two scenes that really piqued my interest was the "Sam"/Dean scene in the future and the final scene at the end but those two moments really couldn't elevate the show beyond a B-. I am curious about why Sam agreed to be a vessel.
I will say that next week's episode based on the promo looks entertaining and a bit clever but we'll see.
It certainly wasn't ENT's "Twilight" or Heroes' "Five Years Gone" when it comes to episodes set in the future depicting the fallout and stakes of the Big Threat.
The guest stars were just "there" and I don't have a lot to say good or bad about any of them except for Castiel who I really didn't care for in his future portrayal. Misha was fine I just didn't care for the material.
TYhis show's production has been so limited because of budget that a lot of the time the show feels very empty and superficial at times snapping me right out of the story but I must say the on location shoot at the end really helped add a real feel to the series of being more than just a show shot on a soundstage on the same sets redressed over and over.
And it isn't really SN'sfault but the glut of apocalyptic fare over the last few years really has desensitized me to the attempts at depicting a character having become dark or fatalistic. A lot of times it feels like spectacle just for the sake of the contrived shock value than generating an honest visceral impact. So Dean torturing or shooting some poor fool in cold blood just doesn't carry the dramatic intentions I'm sure the writers have. I blame a lot of that on most notably nBSG where dark creative choices was the norm and it became so predictable that it blunted these sorts of scenes.
The only two scenes that really piqued my interest was the "Sam"/Dean scene in the future and the final scene at the end but those two moments really couldn't elevate the show beyond a B-. I am curious about why Sam agreed to be a vessel.
I will say that next week's episode based on the promo looks entertaining and a bit clever but we'll see.
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Startrekwatcher, you're a tough customer but I'm glad you visit the threads.
The great thing is like it, love it, think its ok, or just don't like it at all. Startrekwatcher gives his/her reasons, and frankly I always love reasonable opinion. We aren't all supposed to like or dislike the same thing, so its always interesting to see someone else's thought out opinion.
I actually really miss Degra, who no matter what are personal opinions were could always have a good discussion with. So many people seem to just get offended if you don't agree with their opinions.
I actually really miss Degra, who no matter what are personal opinions were could always have a good discussion with. So many people seem to just get offended if you don't agree with their opinions.
God, I loved the story nowDean! told futureDean! to convince him that it was really him. 
Despair. Guilt. Being totally alone would be my guess.
Despair. Guilt. Being totally alone would be my guess.
Well i was actually debating whether I should post in the threads since I have been really lukewarm this season on the show and I really haven't had a whole lot I wanted to say about it.
I don't know. I'd like to think I'm not impossible to please. Maybe I just have seen so much television that I'm a bit jaded and harder to please because you've pretty much seen every story. I was talking to a friend of mine the other day about how we were both finding a lot of tv these days just not that good and would actually prefer to stick a DVD of a 80s or 90s show in and watch it over current fare.
Shows burn out so quickly these days usually after a season like Heroes or Damages. Or in their quest to be the next Lost get caught up in being too ambitious with too large a cast or treating plot as merely points in a story or being too fast paced that it is all just too much.
HOnestly the only show that has consistently entertained and surprised me has been LOst. It will definitely go down as one of the all time great shows. It really isn't that much of a character-driven series but as far as plot structure and plot-driven arcs it really is the gold standard.
Sorry about the tangent. I actually did at one time consider SN appointment viewing but I've found my interest waning for various reasons. I think a large part of it can be traced to it being on CW where it seems even decent shows get dirtied by the hands of Ostroff. I hold my head in my hands thinking what SN might have been like in syndication or a different network.
My interest in Lost disappeared after season two. It never got me back. Different strokes for different folks and all that. I tried getting back into it but all I could think was, "Why doesn't someone strangle Kate?" SPN is appointment tv for me because I'm addicted to all this maudlin shit. 
What can I say? I love it. That, and Ben Edlund's psycho sense of humor. I think SPN is tough for some folks because it makes them tired. You really, really feel how much the brothers suffer. You can feel their emotional fatigue. I do, at least.
What can I say? I love it. That, and Ben Edlund's psycho sense of humor. I think SPN is tough for some folks because it makes them tired. You really, really feel how much the brothers suffer. You can feel their emotional fatigue. I do, at least.
The only problems I have with Lost is its 2nd season, the first 6 of season 3, and the occasional flashback of characters that I really don't care that much about (and while I like most of the characters, some I have never really felt any attachment too).
But after that long stretch of episodes that I didn't care for a lot (I didn't hate them but compared to how much I had loved the first season it seemed a severe drop in quality), I gave up watching it when it aired. So now I watch it when a season comes out on DVD and just have a little marathon. So I am eagerly awaiting my bluray of season 5.
But after that long stretch of episodes that I didn't care for a lot (I didn't hate them but compared to how much I had loved the first season it seemed a severe drop in quality), I gave up watching it when it aired. So now I watch it when a season comes out on DVD and just have a little marathon. So I am eagerly awaiting my bluray of season 5.
Yeah like I said Lost has likeable characters but just not very deep ones. They are engaging just enough that you care about them which helps tremendously. They are mostly used to deliver exposition or as action figures for the last few seasons because of the onslaught of advancing the plot and wrapping up the show but that really doesn't bother me since I find the plot strong and entertaining. Same could be said of Heroes in season one. The problem with Heroes now is without a strong backdrop like was present in season one the Heroes characters are absolutely bland and so under-developed that I could care less about any of them and that has really caused Heroes to collapse for me.
That's the thing right there, mswood. It's the characters. That's the deal maker and breaker for me. I am so sucked in with these characters in Supernatural. I feel "attached." For me it's the characters. It always is when push comes to shove. If I'm attached (boy am I attached) and the characters are written poignantly and consistently (BIG YES) and acted superbly (another huge YES) I'm in. That's why so many had a bad reaction to Trip's ludicrous death on ENT. He was the one character they really connected with and to whom they were attached.
Supernatural, Dexter, Mad Men, and HBO's Big Love. That's the big quartet of character goodness in TV right now. Anything else I can take or leave.
Supernatural, Dexter, Mad Men, and HBO's Big Love. That's the big quartet of character goodness in TV right now. Anything else I can take or leave.
LeahBoBo
Commander
I loved that scene. The panic in poor Cass's voice and then he just waits by the side of the road until it's time to look Dean up again. Hilarious!
Yes, it was rather hilarious. No one deadpans like Cass. And he'd just stand there. He would. But I'll never be able to look at Dean again without thinking of panties, though.
But I'll never be able to look at Dean again without thinking of panties, though.