Trek book Relaunch questions

[Deranged Nasat]

So, is it Andor or Andoria? Or are they using both as acceptable names?

Apparently both. I suspect that Andoria is the more Anglicized version.

Apparently so. I did hear an argument that the writers of "Enterprise" Season Four intended the gas giant to be Andoria and the moon Andor, but this doesn't work as canonical sources have clearly referred to both "Andoria" and "Andor" in terms meaning that each must be terrestrial. The books simply go with the reasonable assumption that Andor and Andoria are the same world. In "Paradigm", a human asks an Andorian about the duel name; he points out "Terra" and "Earth" are the same planet (although why they'd translate different I'm not sure, I don't know if "Terra" has complexities of meaning the English word doesn't). Also, "Tellar Prime" is the same world as "Tellar", only seemingly more formal. So, "Andoria" as a formal and/or (ouch ) Anglicized version of "Andor" works for me.

 

[Therin of Andor]

he points out "Terra" and "Earth" are the same planet (although why they'd translate different I'm not sure, I don't know if "Terra" has complexities of meaning the English word doesn't).

Britain / United Kingdom / England & Northern Ireland / British Isles.

 

[Deranged Nasat]

he points out "Terra" and "Earth" are the same planet (although why they'd translate different I'm not sure, I don't know if "Terra" has complexities of meaning the English word doesn't).

Britain / United Kingdom / England & Northern Ireland / British Isles.

Indeed. Good answer, Therin

 

[Christopher]

Maybe Andor is the planet (or rather, moon) and Andoria is the nation that resides upon it? Analogously to how the United Kingdom is the name of a political body while the British Isles is the name of a geographical entity.

And that could explain why the nation called Andoria in the 22nd century is just called Andor in later eras -- they could've changed the name of the political entity. (Although I would assume that "Andoria" is an Anglicization of whatever the indigenous name for the nation is.)

 

[Deranged Nasat]

Maybe Andor is the planet (or rather, moon) and Andoria is the nation that resides upon it? Analogously to how the United Kingdom is the name of a political body while the British Isles is the name of a geographical entity.

And that could explain why the nation called Andoria in the 22nd century is just called Andor in later eras -- they could've changed the name of the political entity. (Although I would assume that "Andoria" is an Anglicization of whatever the indigenous name for the nation is.)

Hmmm, that's an interesting idea, Christopher.

 

[Sci]

Maybe Andor is the planet (or rather, moon) and Andoria is the nation that resides upon it? Analogously to how the United Kingdom is the name of a political body while the British Isles is the name of a geographical entity.

Memory Alpha and Memory Beta both operate on the presumption that the formal name of the Andorian state is the Andorian Empire.

Of course, it's possible that the Andorian Empire is the name of the state, whilst "Andoria" is the name for the Andorian nation ("nation" in the sense of the collection of people sharing a common culture, not in the sense of the state), and "Andor" is the name of the planet.

But I think it's easier just to assume that Andor and Andoria are both valid names for the Andorian homeworld and "the Andorian Empire" is the name of the Andorian state.

 

[captcalhoun]

he points out "Terra" and "Earth" are the same planet (although why they'd translate different I'm not sure, I don't know if "Terra" has complexities of meaning the English word doesn't).

Britain / United Kingdom / England & Northern Ireland / British Isles.

that doesn't really work because those are all different things.

Britain is the nation formed of England, Scotland and Wales.

The United Kingdom is the nation formed of Britain and Northern Ireland

England and Northern Ireland are two seperate nations in the UK.

the British Isles is a geographic term for several islands which includes two different nations, the UK and the Republic of Ireland.

the terms are far from synonomous.

 

[DimesDan]

Although you are correct pretty much in all of that, the United Kingdom is made up of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland even though it's full title is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

 

[Deranged Nasat]

he points out "Terra" and "Earth" are the same planet (although why they'd translate different I'm not sure, I don't know if "Terra" has complexities of meaning the English word doesn't).

Britain / United Kingdom / England & Northern Ireland / British Isles.

that doesn't really work because those are all different things.

Britain is the nation formed of England, Scotland and Wales.

The United Kingdom is the nation formed of Britain and Northern Ireland

England and Northern Ireland are two seperate nations in the UK.

the British Isles is a geographic term for several islands which includes two different nations, the UK and the Republic of Ireland.

the terms are far from synonomous.

I thought that was exactly what Therin was arguing- that words which may translate pretty much the same on the surface actually feature some significant variation in meaning to those with a more detailed understanding.

 

[Christopher]

^Exactly. The point isn't that they're synonymous, the point is that people in casual conversation might use them interchangeably even though there's a reason why multiple different names exist. For instance, a lot of people would say "Britain" rather than "The United Kingdom" even though they're technically two different things. So it's just as possible that "Andor" and "Andoria" might mean two different things but still get used interchangeably in casual discussion.

 

[Rosalind]

I found it pretty funny that at the opening ceremony of the Beijing Olympics, UK term came in as 英国, i.e. England, instead of the Chinese translation of the actual name. Probably because most people in China don't know the difference, and don't know the word Britain.

 

[Therin of Andor]

I thought that was exactly what Therin was arguing- that words which may translate pretty much the same on the surface actually feature some significant variation in meaning to those with a more detailed understanding.

In fact, I went to Wikipedia, which gave me more variations than I expected. The terms are used, rightly or wrongly, as interchangeable by many people.

 

[KRAD]

Just to throw something else in there....

Until 1848, "Italy" was solely a geographic term referring to a peninsula. It was either part of a larger political body or made up of a bunch of smaller nations. But "Italy" did not refer to a country until the mid-19th century.

(For that matter, "Rome" has meant a whole bunch of different things over the millennia....)

 

[ToddCam]

Just to go back to PAD, he had mirror Selar appear in his short story in the third Mirror Universe anthology. The fact that she died in "The Worst of Both Worlds" really should have been addressed. The editors really should have caught this.

There are plenty of explanations once could give, there are two Selars, it's yet another alternate reality, etc., but it is clearly an error.

 

[Therin of Andor]

There are plenty of explanations once could give, there are two Selars, it's yet another alternate reality, etc., but it is clearly an error.

Actually, knowing PAD, he'll find a way to incorporate the "correction". He did this for Robin Lefler's incorrect rank, the Repulse's male and female related captains, Calhoun missing the Dominion War, and numerous other "fixes" over the years.

 

[ToddCam]

Yet, knowing PAD, he is unaware that Selar appeared in another story. He's great at fixing it, if he's aware of it.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Yet, knowing PAD, he is unaware that Selar appeared in another story. He's great at fixing it, if he's aware of it.

Believe me, people do go to his web pages and tell him. That's how he knew to fix those other corrections I mentioned: Robin Lefler's incorrect rank, the Repulse's male and female related captains, Calhoun missing the Dominion War, etc.

I'll bet he's already planning the Selar/Selar/Selar solution.

Spoiler: Selar

Didn't our Selar recently die in a cloning factory?

 

[William Leisner]

Just to go back to PAD, he had mirror Selar appear in his short story in the third Mirror Universe anthology. The fact that she died in "The Worst of Both Worlds" really should have been addressed. The editors really should have caught this.

Actually, no. Re-read page 401 of Glass Empires: the implication is that Selar had been captured alive, and given over to the tender mercies of Gul Madred.

You really should have caught that.

 

[T'Ressa Dax]

So we can just pretend she got away from Madred?