Betrayed by a kiss? *Movie Spoiler alert*

[indranee]

you need to 'shop that ava

 

[Bobatiel]

I think Crusher Disciple said the same thing earlier today.

Methinks Crusher Disciple is experiencing Plak Tow.

Either that, or it's a nuance that I'm not familiar with.

In human words, it's "Wanting to get into Dr. Mc Coy's pants."

Wha happened to nuance?

He's a doctor, not a boy toy!

 

[Crusher Disciple]

He's a doctor, not a boy toy!

Not in this alternate reality.

 

[zambingo]

Where's that dudes named Dennis? Someones as a jokes should edit all replies to anyones that has a problem with Uhuras/Spock and insert his avatar. LOL

 

[Minuialeth]

I'm a 34 years old woman and I completely missed the true meaning behind the assignement scene! But I was so overwhelmed at my first viewing of the movie that I missed lots of things (yeah, that's my excuse).
In the (so wonderful) turbolift scene, it took Uhura to kiss Spock on the lips and him not slapping her for me to catch up that they were already an item I was so unspoiled before seeing the movie I totally didn't see that one coming. In a way, I'm glad I was blindsided until the turbolift scene. It made it even more enjoyable. It is so well written and so well acted.

And don't forget the two Sareks. The new Sarek admits to Spock that he married for love. That's startling in itself. It practically gives Spock permission to engage his emotions.

Hence the transporter kiss after, I think. Sarek's admission really freed Spock, that and his high emotional state after the loss of both his planet and his mother. But I trust the writers to not push it too far and while not having a more-Vulcan-than-the-Vulcans reset in the next movie, I think we'll see a more "controled" Spock. But we'll never see a young Prime Spock, they are two different characters. I'm so glad I love both of them, I was worried about how I was going to receive nuSpock before seeing the movie.

The original Sarek never made that admission. Clearly the death of Amanda and the destruction of Vulcan also had a profound, and yes emotional, affect on Sarek.

In the transporter room just after Amanda's death and Vulcan's destruction, I was able to concentrate more on Sarek's face at my third viewing of the movie. Granted, it shows less on his face that on poor Spock's, but you see he's devastated in his eyes.

 

[Trilliam]

I'm a 34 years old woman and I completely missed the true meaning behind the assignement scene! But I was so overwhelmed at my first viewing of the movie that I missed lots of things (yeah, that's my excuse).

Either that or you didn't get to read enough Barbara Cartland/ Mills and Boon/ Harlequin Romance (I think) novels as a teenager. Not to mention classics like "The Wolf and the Dove" or "The Lion and the Lamb" (and other bodice rippers).

 

[Jeri]

^ ^ Yeah, it's Silhouette/Harlequin here. I have an Aussie friend and asked her to send me some Mills & Boon one time, just to see what they looked like.

 

[Nimthim]

Not jumping down anyone's throat. In fact, I agree with the generalization.

oh, so you agree that men, in general, miss the nuances of life?

Nope.

I agree that men, in general, miss the nuances in life that women perceive and vice versa. Like that emotional thingy.

Absolutely - that's why I love watching movies with my husband - we each get what the other misses.

 

[Koinek]

Sweet Jesus here we go again............

Dude, he gave a reasoned explanation of why he didn't like the movie. He even went so far as to say that he didn't mind differing viewpoints. I can understand if you don't want to see annoying rants but you can't insulate yourself from all criticism without turning into a STXI fanboy akin to the bashers writing all those rants.

 

[Minuialeth]

Either that or you didn't get to read enough Barbara Cartland/ Mills and Boon/ Harlequin Romance (I think) novels as a teenager. Not to mention classics like "The Wolf and the Dove" or "The Lion and the Lamb" (and other bodice rippers).

Read tons of them, still do from time to time
I'm still puzzled by the fact I've missed the subtext in that scene because usually I immediately spot that kind of stuff. Of course it was glaringly obvious at my second viewing
I think it's because I so didn't expect Spock to be in a relationship with anyone that I interpreted the scene as a instructor/student case of favoritism. I've just realised it could also be a French dubbing/translation problem, as in it would be less obvious if they changed the lines too much (apparently there's some innuendo when she lists the competences he said she had that isn't there in French) or if the dubbing actors didn't use the same tone of voice. Wouldn't be the first time it happened.

I like that scene, especially how Uhura corners Spock. He said himself that she was competent and gifted and he knew she wanted to be on the Enterprise. He can't justify affecting her on the Farragut by any other reason that an emotional one and she knows that Spock will never admit to that. He realises he can't logically justify depriving the Enterprise of a very good cadet.
Come to think of it, Spock most probably affected her on another ship than his so he wouldn't be in constant contact with her. Easier to deal with his emotions that way, isn't it?

 

[seven14]

First time poster

The first time I went to the theater, I went alone and as I was watching the movie, I was first so captured by the opening events of USS Kelvin and just loving the story. As we progressed, to the portion of ship assignments, I must admit that I was sort of comfortable in my seat and just going along with the story. THEN, I felt like a bolt struck me...first to see Uhura being very assertive to not only a Commanding Officer, but one of her Instructors...then when Spock said that he didn't want to appear to be granting favoritism (paraphrase), I actually sat up...because once Uhura made her case and in essence told him she was in fact assigned to the Enterprise, he didn't reprimand her, scold her denigrate her, he gave her a tiny smile and then said, "Yes, indeed you are."

Well, I filed away, but I just knew it meant something Then second, and I hope I don't get my sequence of events mixed up, when he was leaving the ship to aid the leaders on Vulcan including his parents, she jumps out of her seat and sort of demands to know where he is going...Then I knew....Oh yeah, something is going on between those two

Because of this buildup (and I do admit I was watching the Spock/Uhura movie at this point...not ST XI) this made the embrace in the tubolift all the more poignant and believable. It's necessaey to listen to what Uhura says as well...she knows her man..and he IS her man...In the Turbolift, when Spock says everyone should continue being their professional selves (again paraphrase), she accepts his words, she doesn't argue or fight or push herself on him...she accepts because she loves and if this will make him happy, she will do it....then once again in the Transporter room...she knows the danger, so he tell her firstly, "I will be Ok." because he loves her and knows she needs some words of comfort herself, and she says with meaning, " You better be" and rather then exclaiming her love for him or getting him to respond in kind..she says something that tells us all ...these are kindred spirits...they are truly menat to be together....she says "I'll be monitoring your frequency." and with those bland words, kisses, intimate touches, these two were screaming their love!!

There were no laughing/snickering at my theater either---I still am amazed the poster previously stated that happened each time he/she? saw the movie....how ridiculous for anyone to react in that way....but anyway, the way the story was written for me, was JUST right...I think the problem I always had with Spock...was that he was too much Vulcan...not enough Human and so this alternate reality is perfect for me. I like the emotion. I do still see him as Half Vulcan not just in appearance, but in his attempt to control his emotions, and I am just happy his Human half is engaged in the fight this go around!

I will be going back to see the movie again as I want to experience it on IMAX...I'll enjoy the opening sequence again...the first view of the Enterprise...and Kirk's hands the size of baseball gloves...Kirk/Sulu/RedSuit hurtling down to the drill...and the Enterprise coming out of warp with lasers blazing.....but most importantly, I will be most intently watching and loving every scene of Uhura and Spock.

Extremely long post from a new person...promise it won't happen again (the length that is)

 

[Sharr Khan]

"Vulcans have emotions, they just do... or like to believe they do... a better job at not being ruled by their emotions than other species."

Sarek in this very movie made that point and I CHEERED for at last a group of writers seemed to understand the heart of Vulcans! Though it seems even some fans can't grasp this information.

Plus though its true Vulcans get the urge every 7 years nowhere does int preclude doing it at other times - Also Sarek proves that a desire for companionship exits in out logical intentioned friends given the man has had at least three wives in his time. In short I liked the Spock/Uhura relationship.

Sharr

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

"Vulcans have emotions, they just do... or like to believe they do... a better job at not being ruled by their emotions than other species."

Sarek in this very movie made that point and I CHEERED for at last a group of writers seemed to understand the heart of Vulcans! Though it seems even some fans can't grasp this information.

OH there is plenty of this in ENT. And Sarek says the same thing in Yesteryear (TAS). Spock was bent on proving he was Vulcan to his crewmates in TOS and any emotional outbursts had to blamed on spores or rays or drugs. But that is part of Spock's story and you can see that Old Prime Spock is much more at peace with himself than TOS Spock. And well he should be, the benefits of age and wisdom.

Oh and welcome to the forum seven14 I enjoyed reading your post.

 

[Doghead]

<snip>

Spock's character as revealed during the movie is not Vulcan in his behavior, which is just not consistent with who Spock and Vulcans have developed into over the course of the many shows and movies. Vulcans never - repeat NEVER - display affection in public. It is completely alien (drum riff) to their way of life - <snip>

Heh, good one.

I'm reminded, however, of an interview Quinto gave a year ago, more or less, in which he offered the then-somewhat-cryptic explanation that the story takes place at a time when Spock "is not in control of his balance," which suggests that it was intended to be seen as atypical Vulcan behavior.

Hmmm...I'll have to think about that one. Although what about in front of a superior officer? I just wonder about how "loose" Starfleet regs seem here.

Spock shouted, grinned, yelled at subordinates, laughed and smiled at Captain Kirk IN FRONT of Nurse Chapel and McCoy and so on. It always was inconsistent, and it always will be. Nitpicking like this is just dumb. Watch through the original series again and be amazed, given your current position.

 

[seven14]

Oh and welcome to the forum seven14 I enjoyed reading your post.

Thank you so much Teacake...I'm so glad to have found this forum...so many threads and a few more on Spock and Uhura...so I'm checking those out as well I'm am enjoying reading so many people's informed posts...learning a lot as well

 

[Minuialeth]

Welcome seven14, liked your post

Then second, and I hope I don't get my sequence of events mixed up, when he was leaving the ship to aid the leaders on Vulcan including his parents, she jumps out of her seat and sort of demands to know where he is going...Then I knew....Oh yeah, something is going on between those two

You know, I don't know where my brain was at my first viewing because I realise I should have seen at this point that there was something between them. All was going so fast I just chalked it up to Uhura only being very worried for Spock's safety. At least I should have thought that she seemed to have feelings for him
This was my first ST movie in a theater, my first viewing, what can I say, I was overwhelmed

 

[indranee]

First time poster

The first time I went to the theater, I went alone and as I was watching the movie, I was first so captured by the opening events of USS Kelvin and just loving the story. As we progressed, to the portion of ship assignments, I must admit that I was sort of comfortable in my seat and just going along with the story. THEN, I felt like a bolt struck me...first to see Uhura being very assertive to not only a Commanding Officer, but one of her Instructors...then when Spock said that he didn't want to appear to be granting favoritism (paraphrase), I actually sat up...because once Uhura made her case and in essence told him she was in fact assigned to the Enterprise, he didn't reprimand her, scold her denigrate her, he gave her a tiny smile and then said, "Yes, indeed you are."

Well, I filed away, but I just knew it meant something Then second, and I hope I don't get my sequence of events mixed up, when he was leaving the ship to aid the leaders on Vulcan including his parents, she jumps out of her seat and sort of demands to know where he is going...Then I knew....Oh yeah, something is going on between those two

Because of this buildup (and I do admit I was watching the Spock/Uhura movie at this point...not ST XI) this made the embrace in the tubolift all the more poignant and believable. It's necessaey to listen to what Uhura says as well...she knows her man..and he IS her man...In the Turbolift, when Spock says everyone should continue being their professional selves (again paraphrase), she accepts his words, she doesn't argue or fight or push herself on him...she accepts because she loves and if this will make him happy, she will do it....then once again in the Transporter room...she knows the danger, so he tell her firstly, "I will be Ok." because he loves her and knows she needs some words of comfort herself, and she says with meaning, " You better be" and rather then exclaiming her love for him or getting him to respond in kind..she says something that tells us all ...these are kindred spirits...they are truly menat to be together....she says "I'll be monitoring your frequency." and with those bland words, kisses, intimate touches, these two were screaming their love!!

There were no laughing/snickering at my theater either---I still am amazed the poster previously stated that happened each time he/she? saw the movie....how ridiculous for anyone to react in that way....but anyway, the way the story was written for me, was JUST right...I think the problem I always had with Spock...was that he was too much Vulcan...not enough Human and so this alternate reality is perfect for me. I like the emotion. I do still see him as Half Vulcan not just in appearance, but in his attempt to control his emotions, and I am just happy his Human half is engaged in the fight this go around!

I will be going back to see the movie again as I want to experience it on IMAX...I'll enjoy the opening sequence again...the first view of the Enterprise...and Kirk's hands the size of baseball gloves...Kirk/Sulu/RedSuit hurtling down to the drill...and the Enterprise coming out of warp with lasers blazing.....but most importantly, I will be most intently watching and loving every scene of Uhura and Spock.

Extremely long post from a new person...promise it won't happen again (the length that is)

great post!

I remember feeling some of the same things when I saw it the first time.

oh and please don't worry about the length of your posts! that's what we're here for -- to read each other's thoughts about something we all love.

 

[FlapJoy]

Destroying Vulcan, losing his mother, and displaying emotion is the rebooted movie versions way of making up for 20 years of character growth that originally made who we see in a very balanced Spock prime. (That Nimoy plays so brilliantly in the film). Young Spock is on a new journey, just like Kirk, his history is changed. And we'll see their evolution in the next few films instead of 20 years of televison and movies... we'll get there and we'll see it happen. Their histories are rewritten so that the new fans can see them evolve. Just like we have been for the last 40 years.

 

[Sci]

About the "nuTrek" as some are starting to label this movie: it has done what no other "reboot" has done - attacked and destroyed foundations (literally) by destroying Vulcan and betraying Vulcan culture with a kiss.

This is absolute nonsense. D.C. Fontana, writer of episodes like "Journey to Babel" and a primary creative influence on Vulcans and Spock in TOS, always wrote that Vulcans who are in love can and will display affection -- it's just that they do it privately, in a controlled manner. Don't believe me? Read her 1988 Star Trek novel Vulcan's Glory. Spock has a relationship with another Vulcan in it -- and he's far more emotional about it, when in private, than he ever is in this new film.

It basically has eliminated all the TV series and movies that have gone before it with its time travel plot.

No, it has not. As Orci and Kurtzman have noted repeatedly, the primary Trek timeline still exists. It's "running on a different channel," as another poster here once put it, and there's nothing stopping future Trek creators from setting stories in that continuity again.

Spock's character as revealed during the movie is not Vulcan in his behavior, which is just not consistent with who Spock and Vulcans have developed into over the course of the many shows and movies. Vulcans never - repeat NEVER - display affection in public.

Yes, they do. Re-watch "Journey to Babel" and tell me with a straight face that Sarek wasn't displaying affection to Amanda in public with that finger-touching thing. Or, for that matter, that he wasn't displaying affection towards Amanda at the very end with his teasing of her.

Secondly: Yes, Spock displayed more affection towards Uhura on the transporter pad.... right after having had the extreme emotional trauma of losing his mother and his homeworld, and right before he was about to beam into a firefight that he didn't know he'd escape from alive. Even the most stoic of Vulcan might be moved to display affection to a loved one, especially when they find themselves realizing that they don't want to risk dying this loved one, whom they might never see again, understanding how they feel.

I feel that this movie gave up on the thought and character development in favor of the quick joke, the grand special effects, and something that would appeal to a wider audience.

Yes, but you're wrong.

The question that I have then is: Was Star Trek ever supposed to appeal to a wider audience?

Yes. Please don't try to take Star Trek and turn it into a little club to use to make yourself feel better than other people. That's self-serving, egotistical nonsense.

 

[FlapJoy]

Please don't try to take Star Trek and turn it into a little club to use to make yourself feel better than other people. That's self-serving, egotistical nonsense.

Well said my friend !!