was Spock famous before he joined Starfleet?

[Temis the Vorta]

I don't know if there is even semi-canon on this, but as (presumably) one of the first human-alien hybrid babies, who must have required advanced medical science in his conception, and the son of the Vulcan Ambassador to Earth, was Spock generally well known long before he ever joined Starfleet? A mini-celebrity of sorts?

 

[Nerys Myk]

Thats the real reason his schoolmates taunted him.

 

[Ronald Held]

For his work and professional reputation, i would think not.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Well, if you go by the album Inside Star Trek, then yes he was as the first successful human-Vulcan hybrid. This was stated in Roddenberry's "interview" of Ambassador Sarek.

And I kinda like that idea.

 

[ManOnTheWave]

If he was indeed the first human-Vulcan hybrid, he'd certainly be newsworthy, especially on Vulcan where he was raised.

 

[Timo]

Of course, ENT would have us believe otherwise. If an unsuccessful hybrid of those species were created in the 2150s by shady characters, this would almost certainly act as an incentive for respectable researchers to perfect the technique and to create a successful proof-of-concept demonstration.

There's certainly room in Spock's backstory for a wunderkind or freak show past, whichever is the more interesting.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[GSchnitzer]

Even in 1976's Inside Star Trek, Roddenberry makes reference to the fact that there were earlier human/Vulcan hybrid attempts before Mister Spock:

Roddenberry: "And Spock was the result. The first Human-Vulcan mixture."

Sarek: "No, not the first. But the first to survive. As you must know, an Earth-Vulcan conception will abort during the end of the first month. The fetus is unable to continue life once it begins to develop its primary organs. The fetus Spock was removed from Amanda's body at this time--first such experiment ever attempted. His tiny form resided in a test tube for the following two Earth months, while our physicians performed delicate chemical engineering, introducing over a hundred subtle changes that we hoped would sustain life. At the end of this time, the fetus was returned to Amanda's womb. At the ninth Earth month, the tiny form was again removed from Amanda, prematurely by Vulcan standards, and spent the following four months Vulcan term pregnancy in a specially designed incubator. The infant Spock proved surprisingly resilient--there seems to be something about the Earth-Vulcan mixture, which created in that.. tiny body.. a fierce determination to survive."

 

[SheliakBob]

Don't forget T'Pring's speech in "Amok Time" where she explains that she didn't want to be the wife of a legend etc. I always took part of that to mean that Spock was well known for leaving Vulcan and joining Starfleet, despite all the cultural pressure against it.

 

[Anwar]

Even in 1976's Inside Star Trek, Roddenberry makes reference to the fact that there were earlier human/Vulcan hybrid attempts before Mister Spock:

Roddenberry: "And Spock was the result. The first Human-Vulcan mixture."

Sarek: "No, not the first. But the first to survive. As you must know, an Earth-Vulcan conception will abort during the end of the first month. The fetus is unable to continue life once it begins to develop its primary organs. The fetus Spock was removed from Amanda's body at this time--first such experiment ever attempted. His tiny form resided in a test tube for the following two Earth months, while our physicians performed delicate chemical engineering, introducing over a hundred subtle changes that we hoped would sustain life. At the end of this time, the fetus was returned to Amanda's womb. At the ninth Earth month, the tiny form was again removed from Amanda, prematurely by Vulcan standards, and spent the following four months Vulcan term pregnancy in a specially designed incubator. The infant Spock proved surprisingly resilient--there seems to be something about the Earth-Vulcan mixture, which created in that.. tiny body.. a fierce determination to survive."

That exactly jive with the birthing scene we saw in Star Trek V.

 

[KeepOnTrekking]

I would say yes in light of T'Pring's comment about Spock becoming a legend among his people.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I thought T'Prings implication was Spock had become famous after joining Starfleet.

 

[Praetor]

Even in 1976's Inside Star Trek, Roddenberry makes reference to the fact that there were earlier human/Vulcan hybrid attempts before Mister Spock:

Roddenberry: "And Spock was the result. The first Human-Vulcan mixture."

Sarek: "No, not the first. But the first to survive. As you must know, an Earth-Vulcan conception will abort during the end of the first month. The fetus is unable to continue life once it begins to develop its primary organs. The fetus Spock was removed from Amanda's body at this time--first such experiment ever attempted. His tiny form resided in a test tube for the following two Earth months, while our physicians performed delicate chemical engineering, introducing over a hundred subtle changes that we hoped would sustain life. At the end of this time, the fetus was returned to Amanda's womb. At the ninth Earth month, the tiny form was again removed from Amanda, prematurely by Vulcan standards, and spent the following four months Vulcan term pregnancy in a specially designed incubator. The infant Spock proved surprisingly resilient--there seems to be something about the Earth-Vulcan mixture, which created in that.. tiny body.. a fierce determination to survive."

That exactly jive with the birthing scene we saw in Star Trek V.

Most things don't. Technically, that information isn't canon, even though it comes from the mouth of the Creator. Yet a 78-deck Enterprise technically is. YMMV indeed.

I thought T'Prings implication was Spock had become famous after joining Starfleet.

I think a little of both. I bet he made headlines when he was born (however it was accomplished) as I presume that he was the first successful Vulcan/Terran hybrid and was in turn quickly forgotten everywhere but in his hometown. (Think 'Octomom.') Then, he became famous again for his accomplishments in Starfleet, and maybe some people recognized him as the Vulcan-Terran wunderkind.

(Incidentally, does anyone here believe that Spock was the first Vulcan in Starfleet? If so, how do you reconcile that with Starfleet being a Federation organization and Vulcan being a founding UFP member? Just curious as it I think it is somewhat relevant to the OP.)

 

[conza]

Dead on the money there Sheliak Bob, Nerys Myk is also correct in affirming T'prings implication - however Praetor probably has a point in the end, without further information, we can only assume that Spock was the first Human/Vulcan hybrid, and a scientific miracle, even of their time.
Replying to your question Praetor, I believe Starfleet was, and will always remain to be primarily an Earth or rather Human dominated institution, due to its location – further more initially, it was probably 100% Human, before it became popular for other species to join it, perhaps in the late 23rd Century (on a consistent basis that is).

 

[Ronald Held]

I would say Starfleet was a mostly Human dominated institution up to the 23d century..

 

[the 4th hanson bro]

(Incidentally, does anyone here believe that Spock was the first Vulcan in Starfleet? If so, how do you reconcile that with Starfleet being a Federation organization and Vulcan being a founding UFP member? Just curious as it I think it is somewhat relevant to the OP.)

I think that Spock was the first Vulcan to graduate Starfleet academy and serve on a ship that wasn't solely a Vulcan ship. That's what made him a trendsetter, as well as caused the friction with his father.

 

[Praetor]

(Incidentally, does anyone here believe that Spock was the first Vulcan in Starfleet? If so, how do you reconcile that with Starfleet being a Federation organization and Vulcan being a founding UFP member? Just curious as it I think it is somewhat relevant to the OP.)

I would say Starfleet was a mostly Human dominated institution up to the 23d century..

I think that Spock was the first Vulcan to graduate Starfleet academy and serve on a ship that wasn't solely a Vulcan ship. That's what made him a trendsetter, as well as caused the friction with his father.

I agree with these two assessments. I'm thinking that Vulcans (and other member worlds) probably had their own Academy that their people who staffed their ships went to. They probably shared technology and uniforms, but staffed and operated their 'own' ships, sort of like how Galactica 'belonged' to Caprica on BSG.

So in short, I think Spock was also the first (half-)Vulcan to go to the Earth Starfleet Academy rather than the Vulcan Science Academy (which was no doubt its equivalent), and then serve among humans on an Earth vessel. So that made him that much more famous.

 

[Temis the Vorta]

Well, if you go by the album Inside Star Trek, then yes he was as the first successful human-Vulcan hybrid. This was stated in Roddenberry's "interview" of Ambassador Sarek.

Wouldn't he be particularly interesting to McCoy as a medical phenomenon? If their first meeting had McCoy treating him even just slightly as a lab specimen, that might be the source of the ongoing tension between them. Of course Spock wouldn't seem outwardly annoyed, so McCoy would never have a clue what he did "wrong."

I thought T'Prings implication was Spock had become famous after joining Starfleet.

She was probably peeved about that sort of fame because it makes Spock "better" than her - it seemed to be an ego issue. But for Spock to previously be famous for being a medical marvel wouldn't have been annoying.

Sarek: "No, not the first. But the first to survive.

Interesting that ENT picked up the thread with poor little Elizabeth. Probably just the first of many failures.

 

[Captain Robert April]

I'm still trying to figure out where that "first Vulcan in Starfleet" bit came from, since I don't think even "The Making of Star Trek" has that claim. Pure fanon based on nuthin', especially when you figure in the USS Intrepid, a starship crewed entirely of Vulcans. The only way that works is if Spock was one of roughly five hundred Vulcans in his Academy class and Spock just happened to be the first one to receive his diploma, and that's the sort of cutesy sleight of hand that Peter David specializes in.

So, no.

Having Spock be the first surviving human/Vulcan hybrid, the son of a prominent ambassador, and serving on the Enterprise during the height of its accomplishments is more than enough. Let some shmuck personnel officer around the time of the Romulan War be the first Vulcan in the Federation Starfleet, or just hand the title over to T'Pol and be done with it.

As for the birthing scene in ST V, that's the best proof that the whole movie is just a drunken ghost story being told by Kirk and McCoy, i.e., a misguided attempt at another of the Earth rituals associated with "camping out."

I suppose another title for the movie could be "Star Trek V: All Jacked Up", with an alternate commentary track letting you hear the story as Kirk and McCoy are telling it, with occasional objections from Spock.

 

[Praetor]

I'm still trying to figure out where that "first Vulcan in Starfleet" bit came from, since I don't think even "The Making of Star Trek" has that claim. Pure fanon based on nuthin', especially when you figure in the USS Intrepid, a starship crewed entirely of Vulcans. The only way that works is if Spock was one of roughly five hundred Vulcans in his Academy class and Spock just happened to be the first one to receive his diploma, and that's the sort of cutesy sleight of hand that Peter David specializes in.

So, no.

Says you.

I honestly don't know where it came from either, and would sincerely like to know.

Having Spock be the first surviving human/Vulcan hybrid, the son of a prominent ambassador, and serving on the Enterprise during the height of its accomplishments is more than enough. Let some shmuck personnel officer around the time of the Romulan War be the first Vulcan in the Federation Starfleet, or just hand the title over to T'Pol and be done with it.

I'd actually be fine with that.

As for the birthing scene in ST V, that's the best proof that the whole movie is just a drunken ghost story being told by Kirk and McCoy, i.e., a misguided attempt at another of the Earth rituals associated with "camping out."

I suppose another title for the movie could be "Star Trek V: All Jacked Up", with an alternate commentary track letting you hear the story as Kirk and McCoy are telling it, with occasional objections from Spock.

The description of Spock's in vitro and longer maturation term as mentioned with Sarek is no more canon than the assertion that Spock is the first Vulcan in Starfleet, yet the latter has decades of wider acceptance to bac it up.

You can't have it both ways.

However, why don't assume that what we saw was Sybok's ill-informed (or purposeful) dramatization meant to illicit an emotional response from the half human? The whole scenario might not have happened. Spock certainly wouldn't have been likely to remember it.

 

[Nerys Myk]

(Incidentally, does anyone here believe that Spock was the first Vulcan in Starfleet? If so, how do you reconcile that with Starfleet being a Federation organization and Vulcan being a founding UFP member? Just curious as it I think it is somewhat relevant to the OP.)

I would say Starfleet was a mostly Human dominated institution up to the 23d century..

I think that Spock was the first Vulcan to graduate Starfleet academy and serve on a ship that wasn't solely a Vulcan ship. That's what made him a trendsetter, as well as caused the friction with his father.

I agree with these two assessments. I'm thinking that Vulcans (and other member worlds) probably had their own Academy that their people who staffed their ships went to. They probably shared technology and uniforms, but staffed and operated their 'own' ships, sort of like how Galactica 'belonged' to Caprica on BSG.

So in short, I think Spock was also the first (half-)Vulcan to go to the Earth Starfleet Academy rather than the Vulcan Science Academy (which was no doubt its equivalent), and then serve among humans on an Earth vessel. So that made him that much more famous.

Is there any reason to belive that Starfleet Academy on Earth was a humans only school? Early on the producers shifted from the idea that the Enterprise was an Earth ship to it being a Federation ship. So a Starfleet Academy would be a school for the entire UFP not just for Earth.