Sound in outer space

[urbandk]

alright, i'll weigh in one more time on this topic. i know trek isn't hard sci-fi... in my minority opinion, i think it would be cool to make space silent. i think it would be more shocking for the audience to witness a battle in total silence. then cut to the bridge and let them hear the impact of the weapons.

IMHO, the contrast with established sci-fi action convention would be stark and adventurous.

i know you guys will eat me alive and say this is stupid, but i recall the other TWOK moment when they wait for the torpedo's impact when khan first ambushes the enterprise. no torpedo sound, you just see it approaching, silent and deadly. then it hits and all hell breaks loose. very foreboding. very effective.

 

[apenpaap]

I hope they have sound in space in Trek XI. (BTW, if sound WAS able to travel through space, average sound levels on Earth would be around 120 decibel thanks to the noise the Sun would make)

 

[M'Sharak]

alright, i'll weigh in one more time on this topic. i know trek isn't hard sci-fi... in my minority opinion, i think it would be cool to make space silent. i think it would be more shocking for the audience to witness a battle in total silence. then cut to the bridge and let them hear the impact of the weapons.

IMHO, the contrast with established sci-fi action convention would be stark and adventurous.

i know you guys will eat me alive and say this is stupid, but i recall the other TWOK moment when they wait for the torpedo's impact when khan first ambushes the enterprise. no torpedo sound, you just see it approaching, silent and deadly. then it hits and all hell breaks loose. very foreboding. very effective.

Very foreboding and very effective but, you must admit, very much not the norm for Trek on television or on film. Yes, it would be a neat effect, and yes, it would be a somewhat more realistic depiction of what a real third-party observer might perceive in such a situation, but I can see just as many arguments in favor of not doing it that way, from a creative standpoint -- more, if part of the object is to draw (and, it is to be hoped, hold) the attention of a larger audience.

See? Not even any bite-marks.

 

[miraclefan]

Big difference, Galactica has muted sounds because space battles without sound = epic fail. Firefly never had any gun fights, and I don't really remember that episode cause I only watched Firefly once.

^Yeah everybody saw Firefly once...and ''that'' was the problem.

 

[clint g]

*puts on flame proof suit*

I know firefly is a good show, and I'm glad it has such a strong fan base....but should Trek really be looking for creative ideas from a show that essentially failed? Now I know Firelfy had alot of great moments but at the same time Trek is at a point where its trying to expand its audience, not lose viewers.

 

[trevanian]

*puts on flame proof suit*

I know firefly is a good show, and I'm glad it has such a strong fan base....but should Trek really be looking for creative ideas from a show that essentially failed? Now I know Firelfy had alot of great moments but at the same time Trek is at a point where its trying to expand its audience, not lose viewers.

Didn't fail for me. I've rewatched those episodes a helluva lot more than any post TOS Trek show, DS9 included. And that is in spite of the paucity of legit SF content in them.

 

[trevanian]

What? Can't you enjoy totally different types of sci-fi-movies?
I can get enjoyment out of TMP and Armageddon, Star Wars and Event Horizon, Starship Troopers and Contact.

Sure I can, and do. But this is a TREK discussion. With that in mind ... if I want to watch a dumb space opera with lotsa noise in vacuum, I'll see the last half-hour of STAR WARS or catch BATTLE BEYOND THE STARS.

Yeah... lets discuss Trek then:

TMP - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwLrEcwtFM4
TWOK - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAAl2zfk684
TSFS - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpNhTsnu87g
....

Need I go on?

If you like. I think some of the sound in TMP is fairly subdued, but the sound in the others is way over the top. That doesn't make them good or right, but they're less obnoxious than the banshee TIEs in SW.

 

[john titor]

If sci fi films were scientifically accurate they wouldn't be any fun. Although it would be possible for fans to basically edit the sound out in the space battle scenes and upload them.

 

[Rii]

I know firefly is a good show, and I'm glad it has such a strong fan base....but should Trek really be looking for creative ideas from a show that essentially failed? Now I know Firelfy had alot of great moments but at the same time Trek is at a point where its trying to expand its audience, not lose viewers.

I doubt that Firefly lost (or gained) any viewers due to its lack of sound in space.

 

[clint g]

I know firefly is a good show, and I'm glad it has such a strong fan base....but should Trek really be looking for creative ideas from a show that essentially failed? Now I know Firelfy had alot of great moments but at the same time Trek is at a point where its trying to expand its audience, not lose viewers.

I doubt that Firefly lost (or gained) any viewers due to its lack of sound in space.

Maybe, but maybe not. There are things worth taking a risk on and things that aren't. I am willing to bet that the average viewer is expecting 'splosions and sound in Trek XI's space battles and it is up to the powers that be to deliver.

*puts on flame proof suit*

I know firefly is a good show, and I'm glad it has such a strong fan base....but should Trek really be looking for creative ideas from a show that essentially failed? Now I know Firelfy had alot of great moments but at the same time Trek is at a point where its trying to expand its audience, not lose viewers.

Didn't fail for me. I've rewatched those episodes a helluva lot more than any post TOS Trek show, DS9 included. And that is in spite of the paucity of legit SF content in them.

Unfortunatly, you (and me for that mater) arent who they are trying to target. Fact is, it failed commercially and thats what Paramount cares about.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

What? Can't you enjoy totally different types of sci-fi-movies?
I can get enjoyment out of TMP and Armageddon, Star Wars and Event Horizon, Starship Troopers and Contact.

Sure I can, and do. But this is a TREK discussion. With that in mind ... if I want to watch a dumb space opera with lotsa noise in vacuum, I'll see the last half-hour of STAR WARS or catch BATTLE BEYOND THE STARS.

Yeah... lets discuss Trek then:

TMP - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwLrEcwtFM4
TWOK - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAAl2zfk684
TSFS - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpNhTsnu87g
....

Need I go on?

Exactly. Star Trek is famous for sound in space. How anyone could criticize Abrams and company on the one hand for changing things and on the other hand expect them to change something that's so consistent about Star Trek is rather mystifying.

 

[CorporalClegg]

There's a whole different way of doing the nosoundinspace thing that nobody has done in a big feature (outside of 2001, such as the Pool retrieval sequence), which surprises me ... where you use the cutting of interiorsound / exteriornosound to create the dynamic. Lots of folks do the no sound/justmusic to stylize a sequence (QUANTUM OF SOLACE does something like that during their night at the opera), but the intercut thing would be really effective if you had the right blend of sound fx for the interiors and did it right.

I think a good way to do this would be during some kind of fight scene. Like have exterior shots of two guys beating the shit out of each other with dead silence; then cut to an interior shot looking at them through a porthole while hearing their bodies bang up against the hull.

 

[trevanian]

There's a whole different way of doing the nosoundinspace thing that nobody has done in a big feature (outside of 2001, such as the Pool retrieval sequence), which surprises me ... where you use the cutting of interiorsound / exteriornosound to create the dynamic. Lots of folks do the no sound/justmusic to stylize a sequence (QUANTUM OF SOLACE does something like that during their night at the opera), but the intercut thing would be really effective if you had the right blend of sound fx for the interiors and did it right.

I think a good way to do this would be during some kind of fight scene. Like have exterior shots of two guys beating the shit out of each other with dead silence; then cut to an interior shot looking at them through a porthole while hearing their bodies bang up against the hull.

Depending on how tricky you get with your camera, you can go one further. You can do what they did in FROM EARTH TO THE MOON (and I think in DEEP IMPACT) and put the camera INSIDE one of the guy's helmets, so you hear/feel the contact of a head impact. Mix that up with a few wide views where somebody is winding up to hit but not connecting yet, and you have contrast and real oomph when you DO get the sound.

 

[trevanian]

Sure I can, and do. But this is a TREK discussion. With that in mind ... if I want to watch a dumb space opera with lotsa noise in vacuum, I'll see the last half-hour of STAR WARS or catch BATTLE BEYOND THE STARS.

Yeah... lets discuss Trek then:

TMP - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwLrEcwtFM4
TWOK - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAAl2zfk684
TSFS - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpNhTsnu87g
....

Need I go on?

Exactly. Star Trek is famous for sound in space. How anyone could criticize Abrams and company on the one hand for changing things and on the other hand expect them to change something that's so consistent about Star Trek is rather mystifying.

You might care to go back and actually read the thread. Comparing an ARMGADDEON style sound mix to a typical trekflick is still apples and oranges when it comes to excess, and what the other guy preferred was the ARMAGGEDON sound. He just got panties more bunched over my ARMAGEDDON tagline for TREK and is more itchy for a fight than usual.