Kzinti in Trek novels?

[James Swallow]

That's a pity that an Okinawa Lost Era novel is unlikely to appear. By the way, would the Okinawa have been yet another Excelsior-class starship as stated in the Star Trek Encyclopedia? Or would it have been another class of starship?

I think Sisko's backstory is a rich vein to mine - certainly, it's a story I'd like to read.

As for the Okinawa herself, yeah, I'd have gone with making her an Excelsior-class (with the Enterprise-B mods).

And Kzinti. They are cool. I remember talking to Daniel Dvorkin at a Trek con years ago about The Captain's Honor, and how the M'Dok in that were originally pitched as Kzinti.

 

[aelius]

Ahh, The Captains Honor. Romans in space. Loved that book.
I especially loved how the author kept commenting on how much the Roman Captain, Lucius Aelius Sejanus, looked like Picard. Very funny considering that Patrick Stewart played Lucius Aelius Sejanus in the BBC production of I Claudius.
And yeah, I read M'Dok and thought Kzin.

 

[mmtz]

Here are a couple of daily strips from The Wristwatch Plantation: 24 May 1982 and 25 May 1982

 

[JD]

Hmm, I didn't get any images there.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Hmm, I didn't get any images there.

They work for me. My TAS site also has a panel.

 

[F. King Daniel]

The Kythari in my story in PROPHECY & CHANGE are a wink at the Kzinthi.

Are Elvis Cawley’s K’ytheri the same as Prophecy and Change’s Kythari? I saw concept art ages ago on the Phase II site and thought it was cool (even though they turned them into giant monkeys). It’s just a shame about the acting :-(

http://www.geocities.com/therinofandor/TAS/TAS2.html


Nice site! So…much…trivia…
It’s amazing just how many refences have snuck in over the years.
(and it was the M’Dok I was thinking of)

 

[Turtletrekker]

Hmm, I didn't get any images there.

Neither do I...?

 

[iarann]

I went to a Larry Niven signing on Saturday, and someone brought up the use of Kzinti in Star Trek. While he is very supportive of people using the Kzinti, such as in the great Man/Kzin War anthology series, Star Trek was a little different. Basically, he adapted his story the Soft Weapon into the Slaver Weapon episode. It was then altered into the script that aired, and then without his knowing novelized. While he didn't necessarily mind having the story novelized, and appreciated being given full credit, he was a bit frustrated with it because he had no control over it whatsoever and it came out competing with his own stuff. I think a large reason there have been no more Kzinti in Trek fiction is not because they don't have the right (I believe they do, otherwise there would have been issues with reprinting the Star Trek Log book, releasing the cartoon on DVD, and the Federation Commander/Star Fleet Battles licensed board games), but out of a courtesy to Larry Niven. Now, he didn't confirm that, I forgot to ask the followup question until it was too late, but he is signing again next month, so I will ask then. Just a thought, but based on what he said I find it likely. After all, as an author, what do Kzin really add to Star Trek that you don't get with the Klingons or Gorn? At the same time, if you love the Kzin as much as I do, there is plenty of fiction available from Baen books to keep you busy for years.

Benjamin Handelman

 

[Therin of Andor]

It was then altered into the script that aired, and then without his knowing novelized.

Niven has discussed this in print. He did know it was to be novelized, and asked to do it himself, but Alan Dean Foster was already contracted to do all episodes. It's probably also why "The Slaver Weapon" was the 22nd episode to be done, appearing in the final volume, "ST Log Ten", well after the rest of the books. ADF left it till last while the dust settled.

The kzin-like creature in "The Time Trap" adaptation was called a "berikazin", although there are other kzinti encounters added as bonus scenes to various Logs, including M'Ress trying to pass herself off as a kzin on an early mission.

In Niven's book Playgrounds of the Mind, a collection of short stories, novel excerpts, and commentary, he discusses TAS, and "The Wristwatch Plantation". He mentions that he and Sharman Di Vono were interested in getting the comicstrip story published, either in novel form or as a collection of the newspaper strips. Neither happened. Niven also says the story, as presented in the strip, featured a rush ending because the artist wanted to quit. The book includes a summary of the originally planned ending. (See pages 507-510 of Niven's book for more information.)

I think a large reason there have been no more Kzinti in Trek fiction is not because they don't have the right

"The Captain's Honor" turned its kzinti into the M'dok at the last minute, IIRC, because Larry Niven was having trouble selling the exclusive RPG rights to "Ringworld" if the kzinti kept popping up in ST.

I believe they do, otherwise there would have been issues with reprinting the Star Trek Log book

Niven's contract covered the novelization and Filmation rights.

the Federation Commander... games

In which they became the Mirak Star League.

What do Kzin really add to Star Trek that you don't get with the Klingons or Gorn?

Plenty!

 

[iarann]

They became the Mirak Star League in the Star Fleet Command video games, but in the original Star Fleed Battles board game, which are still being published and are amazing to play, they are the Kzinti.

Benjamin Handelman

 

[Therin of Andor]

They became the Mirak Star League in the Star Fleet Command video games, but in the original Star Fleed Battles board game, which are still being published and are amazing to play, they are the Kzinti.

Yes, but that game was originally licensed out from Franz Joseph, not Paramount, and neither Niven nor Paramount could stop it happening.

It was my understanding that more recent Star Fleet Battles materials had to make their kzinti less "Known Space" kzin-like.

 

[F. King Daniel]

I guess I can only hope for Kzinti (and Mr Arex!) in Star Trek XII (or Series VI). The technology to do a brilliant job of it has been around for ages now (see: Rubbish Star Wars aliens, BSG’s Cylons or even SG1’s puppet Thor). Wishful thinking.
There’s always that (never gonna happen) Ringworld miniseries to (not) look forward to (ever).

 

[iarann]

They became the Mirak Star League in the Star Fleet Command video games, but in the original Star Fleed Battles board game, which are still being published and are amazing to play, they are the Kzinti.

Yes, but that game was originally licensed out from Franz Joseph, not Paramount, and neither Niven nor Paramount could stop it happening.

It was my understanding that more recent Star Fleet Battles materials had to make their kzinti less "Known Space" kzin-like.

That is partially true. They are licensed from Franz Joseph, but are also licensed from Paramount, otherwise they would not be able to use any of the trademarked terms or images, along with the major fact that it is a derivative work and would be a major violation of copyright otherwise. The license they have with Paramount only allows them to use TOS and TAS, and no characters from the series, plus they cannot use Star Trek in any of their titles. The Kzinti have always been a bit different than Known Space ones, but I believe that has more to do with making things work in the Star Trek world based on the TAS episode and coming up with ships and working things into their overall metaplot. You can check out their official site to get a better idea, just google Federation Commander or Star Fleet Battles. They even answer in their FAQ the issue of licensing. To quote:

"Is all of this legal?

Answer: Yes! We obtained a license from Franz Joseph in 1979 and later signed a contract with Paramount. We pay them a royalty check every three months."

 

[Therin of Andor]

"Is all of this legal?

Answer: Yes! We obtained a license from Franz Joseph in 1979 and later signed a contract with Paramount. We pay them a royalty check every three months."

Exactly. They don't specify the year in which they signed the agreement with Paramount, but it was much later than you'd expect for a game using alien races from TOS and TAS. I think it was originally assumed that the game would use FJ ship and emblem designs, not depictions of TAS aliens in the gaming manuals, which is what ended up happening.

 

[ClayinCA]

Like this?

What a great picture, and in colour no less! Where'd you get that from, David?

Sorry to hear there probably wont be an Okinawa novel. That's one I would have bought.

Me too....

 

[Lonemagpie]

What a great picture, and in colour no less! Where'd you get that from, David?

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v698/mikeyb_137/

Lots of colourised DW pics from the 1st and 2nd Doctors' eras

 

[Jbarney]

I haven't been as big of a Kzinti fan as some others, but I do have those comic strips. Planned on reading them soon, perhaps during the summer. I look forward to the continuity at least.

The race from TASS that I've wondered about is the Skorr.

 

[JD]

I think someone just made a reference to there being one on Titan the other day. But I don't rember their name, or which book(s) they are in.

 

[Therin of Andor]

The race from TASS that I've wondered about is the Skorr.

From my TAS site at:
http://www.geocities.com/therinofandor/TAS/TAS.html

SKORR of "The Jihad" and "Star Trek Log Five" - Race mentioned ("Battlestations!"). Ensign Rixa, female crewmember of this avian race, featured ("TNG: Section 31: Rogue"). Skorrian fritters, served in a Kaferian apple compote, mentioned ("DS9: Mission Gamma, Book 1: Twilight"). USS Titan Lieutenant Commander desYog featured ("Titan: The Red King"). Goddess teneYa-choFe mentioned ("Titan: The Red King").

Note: TAS trading card set from Rittenhouse assumes Aurelians are the same race as the SKORR. The hominid Ornarans of the TNG episode, "Symbiosis" were originally referred to as Aurelians in an early draft of the script.

AURELIANS of "Yesteryear" and "Star Trek Log One" - Avian race described; Ambassador Aleek-Aur mentioned ("The Worlds of the Federation"). Race mentioned ("The Lost Years", "Chains of Command", "The Lost Era: Deny Thy Father", "Ex Machina", "Crucible: Spock: The Fire and the Rose").