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I Would Like To Know...But First.....

Thurisaz

Lieutenant Commander
I must say that I am not affiliated in anyway with the GOP or the Democrats. I neither voted Obama nor McCain. But, I would like to know why comparing Dubya to a chimp is acceptable while comparing Obama to Curious George is considered racist. If they both resemble monkeys, WTF is the problem?

These are images from google. Everyone lols at the Bush but cries racism at the Obama pics. Personally, I would rather be compared to CG.

Here is the Bush..
350jep5.jpg

Here is the Obama..
dnix05.jpg
 
I must say that I am not affiliated in anyway with the GOP or the Democrats. I neither voted Obama nor McCain. But, I would like to know why comparing Dubya to a chimp is acceptable while comparing Obama to Curious George is considered racist. If they both resemble monkeys, WTF is the problem?

It's very simple actually: There's a long history of racist depictions of African people as, and even equation with, apes - chimps, gorillas, orang-utans, whatever. That makes any such comparison of a man with African heritage incurably racist, regardless of how cute Curious George is. There's no such connotation with white men.
Comparing pictures of Bush with a chimp can be funny (or not, humour isn't always objective), it's certainly insulting, but it isn't racist. Comparing Obama to a monkey is.
 
Because Bush really is a chimp in a suit.

Obama is not. :p

Though I will not deny that both Curious George and President Obama have a cuteness to them. :lol:
 
I sense something... a presence I haven't felt since...

Oh I get it... The Rebellion! God forbid I should post a legit question concerning the resemblance of our Presidents to primates and cartoon characters and the reason why some are okay and some not. Now I'm an idiot..Thanks
 
I sense something... a presence I haven't felt since...

Oh I get it... The Rebellion! God forbid I should post a legit question concerning the resemblance of our Presidents to primates and cartoon characters and the reason why some are okay and some not. Now I'm an idiot..Thanks

You can draw whatever conclusions you like from my comment which was obviously made in jest.
 
Oh I get it... The Rebellion! God forbid I should post a legit question concerning the resemblance of our Presidents to primates and cartoon characters and the reason why some are okay and some not. Now I'm an idiot..Thanks

No offense, but even if your question was one made out of honest curiosity, don't be surprised to get hostile reactions. Since that question looks a hell of a lot like an attempt of racist trolling.
 
No offense, but even if your question was one made out of honest curiosity, don't be surprised to get hostile reactions. Since that question looks a hell of a lot like an attempt of racist trolling.

I wasn't even being hostile, I was just warning of the hostility that this thread will inevitably bring from others.

I'd imagine most people would realise that if I want to be hostile towards them, I won't show it with Star Wars quotes.
 
I must say that I am not affiliated in anyway with the GOP or the Democrats. I neither voted Obama nor McCain. But, I would like to know why comparing Dubya to a chimp is acceptable while comparing Obama to Curious George is considered racist. If they both resemble monkeys, WTF is the problem?

It's very simple actually: There's a long history of racist depictions of African people as, and even equation with, apes - chimps, gorillas, orang-utans, whatever. That makes any such comparison of a man with African heritage incurably racist, regardless of how cute Curious George is. There's no such connotation with white men.
Comparing pictures of Bush with a chimp can be funny (or not, humour isn't always objective), it's certainly insulting, but it isn't racist. Comparing Obama to a monkey is.

So what about the whole "race is a social concept" argument? Apparently that holds no water. I've been told I look like an ape before and I took it as a compliment, but I guess I'm too stupid to care.:lol:
 
So what about the whole "race is a social concept" argument? Apparently that holds no water. I've been told I look like an ape before and I took it as a compliment, but I guess I'm too stupid to care.:lol:

It has nothing to do with "race", only with racism. My point is, that the racist connotation of comparing a picture of a dark-skinned man and an ape can't be erased, it's simply there, even if it's done in a joking fashion, is meant innocuously and even if it's fitting beyond the skin colour. If you compare Obama's looks to that of an otter or llama or whatever, it may be stupid and offensive too (or funny), but not racist.

Just don't do it with a monkey. That specific imagery is hopelessly damaged.
 
Damn. Now I'm sorry I even launched this thread. One of the reasons I joined this board was because there are a lot of different opinions here. I value that. I can honestly say that every time I log on, I learn something new. You can call me racist if you want, I won't get offended because guess what... We're all watching the Trek! Think what you want. You should call me a specieist, because I'm not real keen to Ferengi. :devil:
 
Hehe, there's been discussion about whether or not the depiction of the Ferengi in Star Trek is racist also (specifically, anti-semitic), and I'm quite strongly on the side of people who think that it is. Maybe I'm overly sensitive about that stuff. ;)
 
I must say that I am not affiliated in anyway with the GOP or the Democrats. I neither voted Obama nor McCain. But, I would like to know why comparing Dubya to a chimp is acceptable while comparing Obama to Curious George is considered racist. If they both resemble monkeys, WTF is the problem?

It's very simple actually: There's a long history of racist depictions of African people as, and even equation with, apes - chimps, gorillas, orang-utans, whatever. That makes any such comparison of a man with African heritage incurably racist, regardless of how cute Curious George is. There's no such connotation with white men.
Comparing pictures of Bush with a chimp can be funny (or not, humour isn't always objective), it's certainly insulting, but it isn't racist. Comparing Obama to a monkey is.
You are absolutely correct, it's the same reason why it's inappropriate for white peopel use the "N" word when black people use it all the time when referring to each other.

Since that question looks a hell of a lot like an attempt of racist trolling.
Disagree. It doesn't look like that at all. A lot of people of people have a certain indignation and automatic knee-jerk reaction when they see what appears to be a double standard when they don't relate it to the context involved. The question was legitimate and it was legitimately answered... by you.

There's certainly no trolling here. Truthfully, in a civilized neither reference should be acceptable, but why should being civilized have anything to do with people's behavior on the Internet? :rolleyes:

-Shawn :borg:
 
Hehe, there's been discussion about whether or not the depiction of the Ferengi in Star Trek is racist also (specifically, anti-semitic), and I'm quite strongly on the side of people who think that it is. Maybe I'm overly sensitive about that stuff. ;)
I'm Irish and I'm still pissed off about Up the Long Ladder.

-Shawn :borg:
 
I must say that I am not affiliated in anyway with the GOP or the Democrats. I neither voted Obama nor McCain. But, I would like to know why comparing Dubya to a chimp is acceptable while comparing Obama to Curious George is considered racist. If they both resemble monkeys, WTF is the problem?

These are images from google. Everyone lols at the Bush but cries racism at the Obama pics. Personally, I would rather be compared to CG.

Here is the Bush..
350jep5.jpg

Here is the Obama..
dnix05.jpg

Well, it's all about the history. First of all, it's wrong on either side. "ChimpyMcCokespoon", "Chimp in Charge", these names are derogatory and childish, but what they do is insult Bush's intelligence and his appearance (the consensus being that he makes facial expressions that end up looking like that of a chimpanzee, or as the logic goes).

However, the history of black people in this country is a totally different animal. You see, it wasn't all that long ago that black people were considered an inferior race. Words like "Mongloid" and "nigger", these were used to denigrate black people, to "put them in their place". A black person was not considered a human being. Rather, they were a subspecies, a lesser form of man that was really ape. God formed Adam from the dust in God's image, while black people were miscegenated from an unholy marriage of a human being and an ape. Even science stepped into the game, stating that black people had smaller brains, lesser formed thought centers and no real intelligence beyond a smart dog or lowly ape.

Have you ever heard the term "nigger lipped"? A term that compared black people to chimpanzees because of the shape of their mouths. It was highly derogatory, and was further used to beat down black people mentally, that they were a glorified ape form, but lacked the fully developed features white people possessed. It is a term of oppression, of bigotry, when you compare a black person to a chimp, you're giving credence to the white supremacism that was rampant throughout our country's history. The word is used to diminish. You see, black people were nothing more than dumb animals who were either docile and stupid or dangerous thugs who would attack and kill one another and white people because of some jungle instinct, and they were portrayed that way in the day (and still are if you think about it).

Well into the 50's and 60's, black people were referred to as monkeys. "Porch monkey" and "jungle monkey", and they were used casually in many social circles. So the stigma is still there. To use such a phrase is to validate the hundreds of years that black people were oppressed in this country, and it's something that will not heal for a long time. To use it now is foolish, and I believe the creators of the Curious George/Obama dolls are absolutely bigots, no doubt in my mind.

I hope that helps explain some of it!

J.
 
However, the history of black people in this country is a totally different animal. You see, it wasn't all that long ago that black people were considered an inferior race. Words like "Mongloid" and "nigger", these were used to denigrate black people, to "put them in their place". A black person was not considered a human being. Rather, they were a subspecies, a lesser form of man that was really ape. God formed Adam from the dust in God's image, while black people were miscegenated from an unholy marriage of a human being and an ape. Even science stepped into the game, stating that black people had smaller brains, lesser formed thought centers and no real intelligence beyond a smart dog or lowly ape.

That stereotype is still active today, not just in the USA; one expression of it is for example fans of European football teams shouting "uh uh uh" - which is supposed to mimic monkey sounds - at black football players. Listen to the crowd in this game between the national teams of Spain and England: >>>youtube. Unfortunately that behaviour is disgustingly common in football, not every club's fans do that, but many do, some even insult the players of their own team that way.
 
However, the history of black people in this country is a totally different animal. You see, it wasn't all that long ago that black people were considered an inferior race. Words like "Mongloid" and "nigger", these were used to denigrate black people, to "put them in their place". A black person was not considered a human being. Rather, they were a subspecies, a lesser form of man that was really ape. God formed Adam from the dust in God's image, while black people were miscegenated from an unholy marriage of a human being and an ape. Even science stepped into the game, stating that black people had smaller brains, lesser formed thought centers and no real intelligence beyond a smart dog or lowly ape.

That stereotype is still active today, not just in the USA; one expression of it is for example fans of European football teams shouting "uh uh uh" - which is supposed to mimic monkey sounds - at black football players. Listen to the crowd in this game between the national teams of Spain and England: >>>youtube. Unfortunately that behaviour is disgustingly common in football, not every club's fans do that, but many do, some even insult the players of their own team that way.

Wow, what a disgusting display of bigotry and mental deficiency from a supposedly civilized group of people.


J.
 
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