Twilight- poor man's Buffy?

[TheMasterOfOrion]

That's too bad. If you'd seen it, you'd know what you were talking about. Maybe you can try watching again?

With the way Whedon flows lately I'm not surprised his dollhouse is DOA

I've seen enough of both that Buffy tv show and bombarded with enough internet ads for Twilight, that's about as much as I'll stomach.

To Hell with them both!

PS
What's this topic doing in science fiction anyway, wheres the "science" in this whole vampire genre?

 

[Ethros]

To quote Buffy herself "I don't see this being settled with logic."

There's thing I've noticed on this board about posters with the word 'master' in their name


btw, 50 bonus points if one knows which ep that quote is from

 

[TheMasterOfOrion]

btw, 50 bonus points if one knows which ep that quote is from

the worst Buffy episode, no doubt written by Whedon himself

 

[Bob The Skutter]

PS
What's this topic doing in science fiction anyway, wheres the "science" in this whole vampire genre?

Maybe there's a clue in the name of the forum. Science Fiction & Fantasy.

 

[OmahaStar]

btw, 50 bonus points if one knows which ep that quote is from

the worst Buffy episode, no doubt written by Whedon himself

"Earshot" was written by Jane E. (espenson or something like that, I believe)

So, wrong on both counts. Dude, seriously, if you don't like it, you don't have to post about it. We got it the first time. You don't know the series, you refuse to watch it, and your posts show your ignorance regarding the series. It would be like me trying to talk about Beverly Hills 90210.

 

[Lindley]

Yeah, Buffy is a show that you can't pretend to know something about. You either know it or you don't, and it's pretty clear that you don't. For one thing, the badassness is fairly evenly distributed between the genders. That's not to say there isn't a feminist angle, because there obviously is, but it's not intrusive most of the time.

"Earshot" was great, incidentally. Buffy talks Jonathan down from killing himself in the bell tower with this whole big speech, only to encounter the crazy lunch lady trying to poison everyone.

 

[cardinal biggles]

Twilight, don't know and I don't really care. It sounds to me this movie is like the high school version of the 'Interview with the Vampire' books. Vampire movies were never my thing but I enjoyed the Interview with the Vampire movie and if this Twilight movie entertains, makes money on the big screen and quickly fades away i will probably dislike it a lot less than Buffy

It's not going to fade away anytime soon. There's still three more sequels to adapt for the big screen.

 

[Ol Scratch]

In my opinion, most of Whedon's shows and fans are similar to Apple's products and fans. They cater to a very specific nitch of people despite being cheap and annoying products to use to the majority, yet those same people advocate and worship those products and everything else Apple puts out. And worse, they do so by trying to act holier-than-thou to prove how intelligent and above everyone else they are.

Which, of course, just leads even more people to hate both them and the objects of their worship all the more.

 

[CorporalClegg]

^
I hate Apple and even I thought that was off-base.

 

[Lindley]

As with many things, those who understand least, judge most.

 

[Ol Scratch]

And worse, they do so by trying to act holier-than-thou to prove how intelligent and above everyone else they are.

As with many things, those who understand least, judge most.

Case in point.

 

[Lindley]

Personally I'd rather share great TV with everyone. But some people are so intent on holding on to their preconceptions that nothing you say or show them will sway them in the slightest. It's not about changing their mind----it's about convincing them to let the show change their mind. Because good TV is good TV no matter who's watching, and you'd *think* that would shine through. But for some reason people tend to get a bit upset when you tell them their first impression is downright wrong. Not sure why. If you try to tell them they're missing out, they take it as an attack. It's a bit of a catch-22.

If I've seen all of Babylon 5, I'm more qualified to comment on the quality of Babylon 5 than someone who's seen two episodes. Especially if those two episodes are ones *I* know not to be representative. The same is true of Buffy. Those of us who've seen the whole thing are, simply, more qualified to judge its quality than those who haven't.

Is there a bias in such judgements? Of course. Someone who enjoys the show is more likely to see the whole thing. But that's true of most everything, and it's just something we have to live with.

Buffy is good television. I didn't know it was while it was on, because I couldn't get past the name and dismissed it out of hand. But once I gave it a serious try, I admitted that my preconception was false and had another 7 years' worth of material to enjoy. If that was my experience, chances are it would also be the experience of many who belittle or ignore the show without any true understanding of it now.

If someone can argue knowledgeably about the reasons why they disagree with my opinion of a TV show, I'm willing to do that. (Once or twice. I won't have the same argument 100 times.) But if someone makes a blanket statement about a show without providing any evidence that they're really familiar with it? Then yes, I absolutely will dismiss their opinion out of hand, because it's not worth a damn.

I believe all this can be summed up nicely by my previous statement.

 

[Ethros]

^ *Applause*

And just to confirm, yes the quote was from Season 3's "Earshot", written by Jane Espenson

 

[Ol Scratch]

The point was that it was a very specific portion of the fans, not the actual works, that cause so many people to have such negative views about all things Whedon. It's not like it's one or two people that feel that way, either, so you can't really call said people outliers or anything else.

It really is similar to Apple and its fanboys. The people you just want to punch in the face not because they're using an Apple product, but because they're just so damn annoying, self-righteous and holier-than-thou about said products.

I don't like Buffy and I found Firefly absolutely silly despite the backpeddling they tried to to fix it (ie, the "hundreds of worlds" in a single solar system, or a backwater planet so poor they have to rely on wind power for the most basic of things yet still have a holographic forcefield window in the tavern). But it's easy enough to just not watch them and instead focus on other shows and franchises that I do enjoy.

Avoiding the above-mentioned type of fanboys, though? Not quite so easy. Hence indifference slowly mutating into seething hatred.

 

[OmahaStar]

I don't like Buffy

You've already admitted you've never seen an episode, that the most you've seen is five minutes. Come back when you have an informed opinion. Until then, your "opinion" has no merit.


Where's Kor when you need him?

 

[CorporalClegg]

The point was that it was a very specific portion of the fans, not the actual works, that cause so many people to have such negative views about all things Whedon. It's not like it's one or two people that feel that way, either, so you can't really call said people outliers or anything else.

It really is similar to Apple and its fanboys. The people you just want to punch in the face not because they're using an Apple product, but because they're just so damn annoying, self-righteous and holier-than-thou about said products.

I don't like Buffy and I found Firefly absolutely silly despite the backpeddling they tried to to fix it (ie, the "hundreds of worlds" in a single solar system, or a backwater planet so poor they have to rely on wind power for the most basic of things yet still have a holographic forcefield window in the tavern). But it's easy enough to just not watch them and instead focus on other shows and franchises that I do enjoy.

Avoiding the above-mentioned type of fanboys, though? Not quite so easy. Hence indifference slowly mutating into seething hatred.

Did you ever stop and think the reason Buffy fans have become so vocal is because of persecution and dismissal from people like you?

And, I don't know any Apple people who act as you suggest. I think you're getting them confused with NIX users.

 

[Lindley]

a backwater planet so poor they have to rely on wind power for the most basic of things yet still have a holographic forcefield window in the tavern

That again? There are a dozen possible explanations for that. The fun is in finding them. The simplest is that while the infrastructure of the world is low-tech, trade with the Core still exists; particularly for a spaceport facility, a smattering of advanced gadgets should be expected. Another view is that given advancements of the time, holographic tech isn't all that complicated anymore and really can reasonably coexist with wind power.

Firefly's only real science issue is the lack of FTL putting so many habitable bodies close together. The "small star cluster" model works to alleviate that somewhat, although you'd still need an excessive number of moons. The positive aspects of the show far outweigh that small bit of incredulity, in any case.

And, I don't know any Apple people who act as you suggest. I think you're getting them confused with NIX users.

Well, to be fair, in a sense OSX *is* a 'NIX system.

Anyway, which OS you like is mostly a function of what you're familiar with. I may not understand how anyone could think Windows is the best there is, but that's at least partially because I only use it at work; I don't play around with it on my own time.

 

[Holoaddict]

Personally, I do not find Buffy and Twilight to be all that similar. I have seen every ep of Buffy and the movie Twilight. I do think that the movie came across more like a teenage version of the tv show Moonlight.

 

[3D Master]

Yeah, Buffy is a show that you can't pretend to know something about. You either know it or you don't, and it's pretty clear that you don't. For one thing, the badassness is fairly evenly distributed between the genders. That's not to say there isn't a feminist angle, because there obviously is, but it's not intrusive most of the time.

Uh, no it's not fairly evenly distributed. Not at all. Only on Angel were men, human men, allowed to be badasses - that is until Whedon went to take over, and he promptly reduced them all to whining bitches who can't do anything right, like he did on Buffy.

To be fair; Buffy degenerated more into: "ordinary non-supernatural humans are all a bunch of pathetic, whining, incapable of doing anything right, suck up wannabes, and any demon, or demon-enhanced being is the shit, perfect, incapable of doing wrong, super people (even when they've been more like the opposite, but let's not get that in the way of the new theme we're writing, eh?)" than strictly men / women, but it's definitely there.

 

[Ol Scratch]

I don't like Buffy

You've already admitted you've never seen an episode, that the most you've seen is five minutes. Come back when you have an informed opinion. Until then, your "opinion" has no merit.


Where's Kor when you need him?

You know, if you're going to criticize someone about not having an informed opinion, should at least make sure you're talking about the right person.

Hint: I'm not the person you're talking about.

Did you ever stop and think the reason Buffy fans have become so vocal is because of persecution and dismissal from people like you?

No, because I was online well before Firefly ever existed and I saw the fans come about. They were pretty much exactly as described even before the show aired (say hello to the origins of the "worship anything Whedon does" commentary from myriad individuals) and it only got worse as it went on.

If you guys are going to ask why people (again, a plural word; it's not a singular person's opinion) have issues with Whedon's fans, it'd be nice if you weren't too hypocritical about being "persecuted" while doing exactly that to the people you asked the opinion of.