Spoilers Destiny: Mere Mortals by David Mack Review Thread

[ronny]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

Finished this a few days ago but haven't been near a computer. What a great book. I'm really looking forward to the next one. I can't think of any weak parts but I think my favorite was the Enterprise/Avantine visiting the other ends of the worm holes, all good stiff in different ways.

Spoiler: I have a very basic bonehead question.

The nebula where the wormholes all converge, is that where the planet Hernandez was on that blew up and that's how the pathways are created? Did we find out how they were created and I just am blanking out on that bit or is how they were ceated revealed in the next book?

On a totally unrelated note I'm bummed I can't see who voted how in this poll like I can for the first book, I just want to verify who thinks it's awful. And I'm really looking forward to the third book, so many cliff hangers.

 

[Dayton3]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

To me the introduction of the race that apparently wiped out thousands of Borg ships in the past and still hate the Borg is setting up a classic
"deux ex machina" I think it is called.

Some way in book #3, this previously unheard of power is going to annihilate the Borg force invading the Alpha and Beta Quadrants.

 

[David Mack]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

Finished this a few days ago but haven't been near a computer. What a great book.

Thanks!

Spoiler: I have a very basic bonehead question.

The nebula where the wormholes all converge, is that where the planet Hernandez was on that blew up and that's how the pathways are created? Did we find out how they were created and I just am blanking out on that bit or is how they were ceated revealed in the next book?

The answer had best be coded as a spoiler, too, methinks:

Spoiler: Gods of Night & Mere Mortals

In Gods of Night, the forced supernova of Erigol's sun, coupled with the sabotage to their subspace tunnel communications network, created the tunnels through subspace. And yes, that supernova created the Azure Nebula in 2168, which is why if you look at that sector of the sky right now, you'd see no such nebula...

And I'm really looking forward to the third book, so many cliff hangers.

Then I've done my job.

To me the introduction of the race that apparently wiped out thousands of Borg ships in the past and still hate the Borg is setting up a classic "deux ex machina" I think it is called.

Some way in book #3, this previously unheard of power is going to annihilate the Borg force invading the Alpha and Beta Quadrants.

Two words: EPIC FAIL.

 

[Rosalind]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

On a totally unrelated note I'm bummed I can't see who voted how in this poll like I can for the first book, I just want to verify who thinks it's awful. And I'm really looking forward to the third book, so many cliff hangers.

That's because I'm too lazy to fix it for this thread, since it took a few steps to do it for the first thread. I like having the votes visible too, so there's no way people can vote 'terrible' before the book comes out.

 

[ronny]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

I like having the votes visible too, so there's no way people can vote 'terrible' before the book comes out.

And thanks David for the answer, I was pretty sure I more or less had, just wanted to make sure and it helped seeing it summed up in a couple of sentences.

I kind of stopped reading this thread a couple pages in since there seemed to be a alot of thought about how things are resolved in the final book and I don't want to go into the last book with any pre-conceived ideas about how it's supposed to end, except for my own.

 

[Dayton3]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

Finished this a few days ago but haven't been near a computer. What a great book.

Thanks!

Spoiler: I have a very basic bonehead question.

The nebula where the wormholes all converge, is that where the planet Hernandez was on that blew up and that's how the pathways are created? Did we find out how they were created and I just am blanking out on that bit or is how they were ceated revealed in the next book?

The answer had best be coded as a spoiler, too, methinks:

Spoiler: Gods of Night & Mere Mortals

In Gods of Night, the forced supernova of Erigol's sun, coupled with the sabotage to their subspace tunnel communications network, created the tunnels through subspace. And yes, that supernova created the Azure Nebula in 2168, which is why if you look at that sector of the sky right now, you'd see no such nebula...

And I'm really looking forward to the third book, so many cliff hangers.

Then I've done my job.

To me the introduction of the race that apparently wiped out thousands of Borg ships in the past and still hate the Borg is setting up a classic "deux ex machina" I think it is called.

Some way in book #3, this previously unheard of power is going to annihilate the Borg force invading the Alpha and Beta Quadrants.

Two words: EPIC FAIL.

Then I shall look forward to the resolution.

 

[KRAD]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

To me the introduction of the race that apparently wiped out thousands of Borg ships in the past and still hate the Borg is setting up a classic
"deux ex machina" I think it is called.

Close: it's "deus ex machina," which is Latin for "god from a machine." It derives from Greco-Roman theatre where a god would be introduced into the play to resolve the entanglements.

It has come to refer to "any artificial or improbable device resolving the difficulties of a plot," as defined by Dictionary.com.

 

[foravalon]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

The Tholian ambassador mentioned something about the Taurus reach -- is this a New Frontier reference?

No, Vanguard. The turbulent history between the Federation and Tholians in the Taurus Reach is spelled out in that series.

This scene was a little disheartening. I wanted to be caught up on my D-Mack readings before beginning Destiny so I made sure to read Reap the Whirlwind immediately before starting the epic. Being a peace-nik my heart was warmed by the events of Whirlwind regarding the Tholians and Starfleet. The fact that Tholians maintained embassies at places like Deep Space Nine well into the 24th century, in my eyes, leaned in the direction of better relations between the UFP and the Tholians. Having the "sins of the Taurus Reach" brought up so far in the future doesn't really bode well for events in the intervening years.

 

[My2tailwaggers]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

As a lurker who ususually just hides and reads everyone elses great posts... I just had to come out of hiding to express how much I am enjoying this series! I enjoy reading all of the Star Trek books.. very much so.. but this series is just exceptional! I love the Erika Hernandez storyline, the flashbacks, Dax, Titan.. well, just everything. I also think the Borg make great villians for such a large cast in these books. Great work! I cant wait for the third installment due out soon.. but not soon enough!

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

Having the "sins of the Taurus Reach" brought up so far in the future doesn't really bode well for events in the intervening years.

Not necessarily. Some cultures today have long cultural memories, where the slights and evils of the past centuries gone are still present for them today. Look especially at Middle Eastern cultures, where a schism over a millennia ago still causes trouble between Shia and Sunni. Just because the Tholians, as a whole, may have made peace with the Federation (hence, embassies), individual Tholians may still harbor grudges and resentments against the Federation that go back centuries.

 

[foravalon]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

/\ Now That I can totally buy. It seems a lot more plausible too that Tezrene maight be a special sort of case, much like Lt. Stiles from "Balance of Terror" holding on to centuries-old enmities for fairly personal reasons.

 

[Stevil2001]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

Or he(?) might not even actually care, but likes bringing it up to score points.

 

[KRAD]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

Tezrene is a she.

 

[Luminus]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

What a cool book. I caught the references to the starships Saladin and T'Kumbra toward the end there. Guess it's probably curtains for Captain Solok and the Logicians. I'm also really liking this Captain Dax all the sudden. With everything going to hell, she basically told Picard that she was going to head straight into the worst of it and go after the Borg Queen and he can try and keep up. Pretty badass.

Pretty stupid, you mean. There's nothing badass about taking a rusty knife to a machine gun fight.

All in all, I don't understand why people keep saying that they're tired of the Borg. Why aren't you tired of the Kilingons? Why aren't you tired of the Vulcans? Why aren't you tired of the Romulans? It just makes no sense to me at all.

This book was so damn good, the second I finished it Sunday, I went to Amazon.com and ordered the third one. This is the kind of thing we should have seen on television. A full scale Borg invasion.

What I want to know though, is who is the Child of the Storm? Is that a throwaway species or are they relevant to the story?

By the way, that scene with the green-skinned Takaran woman taking out the 2 Hirogen warriors was sick-cool!

 

[Christopher]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

I'm also really liking this Captain Dax all the sudden. With everything going to hell, she basically told Picard that she was going to head straight into the worst of it and go after the Borg Queen and he can try and keep up. Pretty badass.

Pretty stupid, you mean. There's nothing badass about taking a rusty knife to a machine gun fight.

"Rusty knife?" What are you talking about? The Aventine is Starfleet's most advanced vessel, even more so than Titan and considerably more so than Enterprise. It's a test bed for prototype technologies nobody else has. It's also a large ship, smaller than Enterprise but considerably bigger than Titan (at least going by its crew capacity, which is twice Titan's).

 

[Luminus]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

I'm also really liking this Captain Dax all the sudden. With everything going to hell, she basically told Picard that she was going to head straight into the worst of it and go after the Borg Queen and he can try and keep up. Pretty badass.

Pretty stupid, you mean. There's nothing badass about taking a rusty knife to a machine gun fight.

"Rusty knife?" What are you talking about? The Aventine is Starfleet's most advanced vessel, even more so than Titan and considerably more so than Enterprise. It's a test bed for prototype technologies nobody else has. It's also a large ship, smaller than Enterprise but considerably bigger than Titan (at least going by its crew capacity, which is twice Titan's).

And it's just been put through the ringer in that fight against the Hirogen, hence the "rusty knife" comment. They don't even have full shields. 40 heavily armed ships can't stop a single cube, yet she's limping her broken ride into a battlefield of thousands of cubes. Somebody on that ship didn't do the math.

 

[William Leisner]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

^ That's more of a case of the knife being dull and nicked than rusty...

 

[Steve Roby]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

All in all, I don't understand why people keep saying that they're tired of the Borg. Why aren't you tired of the Kilingons? Why aren't you tired of the Vulcans? Why aren't you tired of the Romulans? It just makes no sense to me at all.

I'm bored of the Borg because storytelling is about characters, and the Borg aren't characters. There are no individuals, unless you count the Borg Queen, and she's been done to death thanks to Voyager. You could count ex-Borg as characters, like Hugh and Seven, but they're ex-Borg. Different thing entirely.

Take a look at KRAD's A Burning House, his most recent Klingon novel. The book is about moving beyond the cliches of who the Klingons are. You get a wide range of characters living very different lives. You simply couldn't do a story like this about the Borg, because they have no character, no personality, no range, no lives. That was supposed to be the whole point way back when. That was what made them such a great enemy: they're not like the Klingons or Romulans, they're like an avalanche. You can't have conversations with them and negotiate with them.

But how many different stories can you tell about dealing with an avalanche? You can't have a Borg story like "Balance of Terror," involving a duel between honourable enemies; you can't have a Borg story like "The Enterprise Incident," with intrigue and seduction; you can't have a story like "The Defector," or "Unification," etc., because the different characters who drive those stories don't have Borg counterparts.

Am I making sense?

 

[Stephen!]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

You can't have conversations with them and negotiate with them.

Unless you count Janeway's negotiation with them in "Scorpion"

 

[Steve Roby]

Re: Star Trek: Destiny: Mere Mortals - SPOILER Thread

Unless you count Janeway's negotiation with them in "Scorpion"

Not a typical situation, really... unless you introduce a lot of worse-than-the-Borg threats to the point where the Borg became allies instead of enemies.