Terminator-201 "Samson & Delilah" - Discuss/Grade <Spoiler>

[Sakrysta]

Running commentary as I watched the episode:

Liking the new saga sell.

Not liking the much-too-long opening music video.

So, did Cameron reboot or something? That's annoying.

I'm not impressed with the redhead. She has this Cleopatra 2525 vibe about her. Something about her demeanor and look cheapens the veracity of impending apocalypse.

Why doesn't Cameron have weapons? She could easily have picked John off with a gun as she approached the car wreck. Terminators are smarter than that. She looks like a lurching zombie. Granted, a zombie that could pull you apart, but still.

I DO like that Cameron's program hasn't been erased or re-written. There's just an override command in place. This makes her a constant potential threat, as she was here. Although I didn't really buy how much of a threat she was, with her staggering around weaponless.

You know, I've grown to dislike peanut butter & jelly sandwiches over the years, but all of a sudden, I'm hungry for one.

Okay, so now that I've seen redhead's REAL identity, I dislike her even more. F-minus in the casting department. She's just horrid. This character needs more of an Angela Petrelli vibe, and less of a "I just arrived from Farscape's 'Scratch 'n' Sniff' planet" vibe. I like the concept of this level of Terminator working against the Connors here, but I do not like this actress/character at all.

I'm afraid that may have been a mistake. Charlie's wife isn't supposed to be captured until the third episode.

Speculation, or is this something you know for a fact?

Fact

In that case, thanks for the spoiler.

The series is very similar to the Infiltrator novel series in tone (down to the FBI agent joining the company and working directly for a Terminator).

Could I ask a favor? Could we avoid the spoilers about future episodes in the current episode's discussion thread? I've stayed away from the Season 2 spoiler thread because I know there are spoilers there I don't want to read. However, I'd surely like to be able to discuss an episode and read the thread without being spoiled about future episodes. Thanks!

 

[PKerr]

^ I'm not too sure that people would accept that. I could see them saying that it was a Shark Jumping moment. Then again people have been saying Cameron's declaration of love for John was on some boards.

I still think that Cameron is different because she's been sent back before and lived through Judgment Day and helped the Resistance. Terminator endoskins don't age so she would look like Cameron forever, and their powercells last a minimum of 120 years (and that was a nonrefitted unit). I think that Cameron has been alive for a minimum of 25 to 27 years - accounding for the Future War and living through it once already, the jump back (twice so I'll round that up to a year), a rough estimate of 4 years active working for Skynet, and the initial time jump.

yeah but I got the impression that she has been here since 1964? 1968? can't remember. Whatever the bank plaque said.
Wasn't she part of building the bank or bank vault?

 

[Roshi]

1963.

 

[PKerr]

1963.

yeah, that too.

 

[Alaedhros]

I was disappointed by the episode. I liked the action, but they didn't explain why Cameron went bad, why she magically turned good again, or why John very irrationally decided to put her chip back in and interrogate her instead of burning her. It seems like the writers have the action down pat, but their storytelling/explanations are weak/non-existent. (I say this as someone who loved season 1; I'm hoping my disappointment with this episode is just a fluke.)

Like a few others, I was also disappointed by the introduction of the T-1000; it just seemed... unimaginative and uninteresting.

 

[TheArsenal]

... but they didn't explain why Cameron went bad, why she magically turned good again ...

Her chip was compromised in the explosion, canceling out the override on the "Terminate John Connor" command. And, from what I could gather, Terminator chips are much like old spark plugs. You pull them, clean them up with a rag and wire brush, and pop them right back in and they are as good as new for a few thousand miles more.

 

[ATimson]

Her chip was compromised in the explosion, canceling out the override on the "Terminate John Connor" command.

"Compromised" is putting it mildly, given the chunk of metal sticking out of her head!

 

[Trekker4747]

... but they didn't explain why Cameron went bad, why she magically turned good again ...

Her chip was compromised in the explosion, canceling out the override on the "Terminate John Connor" command. And, from what I could gather, Terminator chips are much like old spark plugs. You pull them, clean them up with a rag and wire brush, and pop them right back in and they are as good as new for a few thousand miles more.

Which is dumb. The chip is the processor/thinking. It should have nothing to do with the PROGRAMMING.

 

[Ryan8bit]

^ I'm attributing her acting ability to the T-1000 trying to mimic human actions.

How come Robert Patrick's T-1000 never acted so poorly then? Manson's T-1000 has probably been around longer, too. In fact, a lot of the terminators on the show act strange.

I agree with some of the opinions that this episode was a disappointment. The religious context, the ridiculous plot of Cameron switching sides, etc. There were so many things wrong with it.

 

[ATimson]

Which is dumb. The chip is the processor/thinking. It should have nothing to do with the PROGRAMMING.

We were shown in Terminator 2 that the chip was more than just a CPU, that it also included storage as well (hence the write-enable switch).

 

[Hobs202]

^ I'm attributing her acting ability to the T-1000 trying to mimic human actions.

How come Robert Patrick's T-1000 never acted so poorly then? Manson's T-1000 has probably been around longer, too. In fact, a lot of the terminators on the show act strange.

I think this is Shirley Manson's first time actually having a major role in a fictional TV show. You need to cut her some slack.

 

[Hobs202]

Which is dumb. The chip is the processor/thinking. It should have nothing to do with the PROGRAMMING.

We were shown in Terminator 2 that the chip was more than just a CPU, that it also included storage as well (hence the write-enable switch).

Yeah, in the special edition of T2, it is stated that the Chip has A LOT to do with a Terminator's programming and memory storage.

 

[Ryan8bit]

^ I'm attributing her acting ability to the T-1000 trying to mimic human actions.

How come Robert Patrick's T-1000 never acted so poorly then? Manson's T-1000 has probably been around longer, too. In fact, a lot of the terminators on the show act strange.

I think this is Shirley Manson's first time actually having a major role in a fictional TV show. You need to cut her some slack.

Nah, I don't. If they can't hire a decent actor for the part, then that's a problem.

I'm not even sure the acting is the problem so much as the directing though. She's probably being told to act that way, which is stupid considering my earlier point.

 

[PKerr]

... but they didn't explain why Cameron went bad, why she magically turned good again ...

Her chip was compromised in the explosion, canceling out the override on the "Terminate John Connor" command. And, from what I could gather, Terminator chips are much like old spark plugs. You pull them, clean them up with a rag and wire brush, and pop them right back in and they are as good as new for a few thousand miles more.

Which is dumb. The chip is the processor/thinking. It should have nothing to do with the PROGRAMMING.

The explosion is so violent it knocks her well protected chip out of place but doesn't singe her hair or melt her skin off it's frame

 

[nx1701g]

^ If you watch closely there is a very large piece of shrapnel that she pulls out of her head. Over two thirds of it is covered in blood.

 

[nx1701g]

How come Robert Patrick's T-1000 never acted so poorly then? Manson's T-1000 has probably been around longer, too. In fact, a lot of the terminators on the show act strange.

I think this is Shirley Manson's first time actually having a major role in a fictional TV show. You need to cut her some slack.

Nah, I don't. If they can't hire a decent actor for the part, then that's a problem.

I'm not even sure the acting is the problem so much as the directing though. She's probably being told to act that way, which is stupid considering my earlier point.

The T-1000 that we saw in T2 may not be the same class as this one, first off, secondly the T-1000 unit may be applying things that it saw in historical documents or television records that somehow survived. In several of the Terminator franchise continuations Skynet shows unit's its sending back in time documents closely related to the task that they're going to emulate. For all we know T-1000 may have learned how business people act from the television show Working.

As for why the Terminators appear somewhat off, well they are supposed to be representing machines and mechanical. They were expressly told to ignore the personifications from the films when coming up with the Terminator quirks (both the actors and the writers).

 

[Ryan8bit]

It's pretty strange that at close range, an explosion causes one chunk of metal to penetrate a hardened metal combat chassis that is capable of deflecting most bullets even. And how if a chip is damaged, it malfunctions perfectly to fit the needs of a story, and is magically alright by the end.

No matter how you slice it, the whole chip situation is dumb.

 

[PKerr]

^ If you watch closely there is a very large piece of shrapnel that she pulls out of her head. Over two thirds of it is covered in blood.

Which was also BS.
Did you see the length and girth of what she pulled out?
How come she doesn't have a big hole in the back of her head?

 

[Ryan8bit]

Ratings aren't looking so hot:

http://pifeedback.com/eve/forums/a/frm/f/63310451

 

[nx1701g]

It's pretty strange that at close range, an explosion causes one chunk of metal to penetrate a hardened metal combat chassis that is capable of deflecting most bullets even. And how if a chip is damaged, it malfunctions perfectly to fit the needs of a story, and is magically alright by the end.

No matter how you slice it, the whole chip situation is dumb.

Were we watching the same show?

It's clearly shown in the episode and promos that Cameron is not back to normal at the end of the episode. True she overrode the Termination order, but, in the promo, you see her slam John against a wall and (I won't go into the rest on here because its a spoiler), but she isn't back to normal.