The Alternative Factor

[Kryton]

I always rationalize it as "it was the sixties, man". There was bound to be at least one episode that only makes sense to someone on "LDS" and this one is it.

Timothy Leary understood this episode! why can't we?

Rob
Scorpio

Timothy Leary's dead.

No no no no...he's outside looking in.

 

[M'Sharak]

I do cut them some slack as the guy who plays Laz was a last second replacement.

OK, seeing that I'm not up on all Trek lore, I'll bite: who was the first draft for the part, & what were the circumstances of the replacement, if at all interesting?

John Barrymore (Drew Barrymore's grandfather) was supposed to play Lazurus but he was unable to do so since he was too drunk to do so.

It was John Drew Barrymore - Drew's father. Good actor, when he showed up and made an effort, but had a rather substantial reputation as a flake by the time he no-showed "The Alternative Factor".

(John Barrymore had been dead for nearly 25 years when this ep originally aired.)

 

[Iowagirl]

It's about struggles. Good and evil, Jekyll and Hyde. The cliff is the symbol for the unsteadyness of our lives; we either fall into the abyss or we will be given a second chance to continue our "mission". Sometimes you realize that evil will win and destroy everything - either an entire universe or your soul - sometimes those two are synomyms. And sometimes you realize that "evil" is not that easy to define, and you must pay a high price, you must sacrifice what you consider most dear to you in order to save the universe, your life, the life of others, and in the end, again, your soul.

Don't know whether that actually makes any sense, bu I've always perceived TAF more or less an allegory.

"So you're the terrible thing? The murdering monster? The creature?"
"Yes, Captain. Or he is. It depends on your point of view, doesn't it?."

 

[Ovation]

I think I'll have to pop that one into the player tomorrow after all these comments. It's been a while. Besides, I'm curious what the remastered HD version looks like.

 

[EEE]

This is one of the few TOS episodes I literally had to struggle to sit through. Usually the bad TOS episodes are still fun to watch in a campy way, but I'm never watching this one again if I can help it.

That's kind of funny to me. After decades, I finally converted my wife to being a Trekkie and we watched all of TOS together. I skipped this episode explaining that I had no need to see it again. She still hasn't seen it.

The episode all makes sense by the end (without converting to Mormonism or being a Leary fan), but it seems pointless as you watch it. It's missing definition of the mystery or suspense of trying to keep the two Jason Bolt's apart. Or both. It's just plain not well written for TV drama. (but of course, my opionions are based on several decades old and probably faulty memories of the episode! *grin*)

 

[Trevacious]

KIRK: Everything's all right, Mister Spock, for us.
SPOCK: There is, of course, no escape for them, sir.
KIRK: There is, of course, no escape. How would it be? Trapped forever with a raging madman at your throat until time itself came to a stop? For Eternity. How would it be?
SPOCK: Captain, the universe is safe.
KIRK: For you and me. But what of Lazarus? What of Lazarus?

"But what of Lazarus...?" Given an Eternity trapped there in the now-sealed corridor, do you suppose the battling Lazari could ever just...get over it? Maybe sit down and have a little peace summit? Maybe share a stick of gum? Draw up boundaries and retire to their separate corners of spinning corridor?

 

[Red Ranger]

KIRK: Everything's all right, Mister Spock, for us.
SPOCK: There is, of course, no escape for them, sir.
KIRK: There is, of course, no escape. How would it be? Trapped forever with a raging madman at your throat until time itself came to a stop? For Eternity. How would it be?
SPOCK: Captain, the universe is safe.
KIRK: For you and me. But what of Lazarus? What of Lazarus?

"But what of Lazarus...?" Given an Eternity trapped there in the now-sealed corridor, do you suppose the battling Lazerii could ever just...get over it? Maybe sit down and have a little peace summit? Maybe share a stick of gum? Draw up boundaries and retire to their separate corners of spinning corridor?

This almost made me laugh as hard as the "KILL! KILL! KILL!" line from the ep! I have to say I liked it the first time I saw it when I was, like, 10. Then, I realized how flawed the writing is. For instance, why would Kirk just let some random whacko roam around the ship without even so much as a security escort, when he's received orders from Starfleet Command indicating the cosmic blinking could be a prelude to an invasion!

I have always been intrigued by the idea of an anti-matter universe, and it's quite interesting to see the different takes on the idea, from the Negative
Zone in the Marvel Fantatic Four comics -- my favorite version -- to the anti-matter universe of Qward in the DC Green Lantern comics.

I always liked the sad ending of the Lazari fighting each other for all eternity, the good Lazarus sacrificing his existence to save two universes.

One of the most intriguing yet uneven TOS eps.

Red Ranger

 

[Ovation]

Just watched in HD. Nicer pictures still don't make it more comprehensible. Ah well--good music in this episode and it has the lovely Lt. Masters. Not a total loss.

 

[cooleddie74]

Nothing short of rewriting and refilming this thing from scratch will make it much if any better. I learned to control my cringing long ago when it comes to this episode and if I have to sit through it, try to pay as much attention to the shifting and inconsistent Lazarus beards as possible for comic relief.

 

[Kryton]

Lazarus had more beards than Rock Hudson.

 

[The Old Mixer]

Late at night has nothing to do with it--I've nodded off to this episode in the middle of the day.

How do starship instruments detect that the universe has temporarily blinked out of existence, if they themselves had blinked out of existence? If everybody and everything blinked out of existence at once, then came back--how would anyone know?

The part of this episode that annoys me the most is Kirk repeatedly using the phrase, "But what of Lazarus? What of Lazarus...?" Yeah, I think it's only twice, but that's at least one time too many.

The cliff is the symbol for the unsteadyness of our lives; we either fall into the abyss or we will be given a second chance to continue our "mission".

Well, he fell off the cliff more than once, and still got up to continue his mission! If he'd just fallen off the cliff and that was that, I would have been fine with it.

I'm one of the few who thinks that "The Way to Eden" had an essentially interesting concept that should have been explored more in the Trek mythos...but I'd never bother trying to read into this snoozefest.

Given an Eternity trapped there in the now-sealed corridor, do you suppose the battling Lazari could ever just...get over it? Maybe sit down and have a little peace summit? Maybe share a stick of gum? Draw up boundaries and retire to their separate corners of spinning corridor?

Why, they could have spun the episode off into an entire sitcom about the two Lazarii having to share an apartment! Thank god they didn't!

 

[ToddPence]

This is probably one of those shows which maybe looked good on paper, but which didn't translate well at all to screen. The premise is is that one Lazarus is supposed to be calm, sedate, intelligent, rational, and the other Lazarus is supposed to be a raving, incoheret madman. The problem is that both Lazarus's act like raving, incoherent madman throughout the show and it is only in Kirk's last scene with Lazarus that one of them acts calm and rational.
The one thing intriguing about this show is whether or not it is the prequel to "Mirror, Mirror" is the other Lazarus from the same universe that the bearded Spock, the halter-top wearing Uhura and the cheek-scarred Sulu are from?
Other odd things abound: Lazarus refers to him and his alter ego as "time travelers". No, you can travel from universe to universe. That's not the same thing as being able to travel through time. Spock says "Madness has no purpose. But it may have a goal." Aren't a purpose and a goal essentially the same thing? McCoy treats Lazarus in sickbay, but sends him off in the same bedraggled and torn clothing he wore when he fell off the cliff. Doesn't the ship have any new clean clothes they can give the guy?

 

[M'Sharak]

Given an Eternity trapped there in the now-sealed corridor, do you suppose the battling Lazari could ever just...get over it? Maybe sit down and have a little peace summit? Maybe share a stick of gum? Draw up boundaries and retire to their separate corners of spinning corridor?

Why, they could have spun the episode off into an entire sitcom about the two Lazarii having to share an apartment! Thank god they didn't!

Talk about The Odd Couple -- one neatnik and one slob doesn't even come close to matter and antimatter.

ABC 7 PM "This week Oscar and Felix come close to mutual annihilation over the dishwasher detergent." (Color)

 

[Tralah]

Given an Eternity trapped there in the now-sealed corridor, do you suppose the battling Lazari could ever just...get over it? Maybe sit down and have a little peace summit? Maybe share a stick of gum? Draw up boundaries and retire to their separate corners of spinning corridor?

Why, they could have spun the episode off into an entire sitcom about the two Lazarii having to share an apartment! Thank god they didn't!

Talk about The Odd Couple -- one neatnik and one slob doesn't even come close to matter and antimatter.

ABC 7 PM "This week Oscar and Felix come close to mutual annihilation over the dishwasher detergent." (Color)

I love it! They seriously should have had the actors that played Oscar and Felix be Lazarus! It would have made this episode so much more fun to watch, even if it would have been just as nonsensical.

 

[The Old Mixer]

At least they got a hilarious audio birthday card out of this episode. Anybody see it?

Front has photo of Kirk and Spock with caption: "Mr. Spock, what would be the result if we lit all of the candles on that birthday cake at once?"

Open it up, it plays Spock's line from TAV: "Annihilation, Jim--total, complete, absolute annihilation." Complete with cheesy dramatic musical cue.

 

[The Boy Who Cried Worf]

In my opinion the worst of the TOS episodes. Not because it is really bad, but because it is really... nothing. Totally unengaging.The kind of episode that seems like it drags on forever than you look at the clock and it is only half over. I think the main problem is that I could never figure out which one was supposed to be the sane Lazarus and which was the crazy Lazarus,and I never wanted to watch it again enough to decide. Even the bandage never helped me. Unfortunately now that every one is talking about it I'll probably go back and watch it.

 

[cooleddie74]

Lazarus had more beards than Rock Hudson.

And was often gayer.

 

[Hofner]

What would it be like to be stuck for all eternity with a madman at your throat? Ironically, having to sit through this episode probably gives a good approximation. Having to listen to Morn talk about his family also comes to mind.

Robert

 

[DrTaylor]

I've always liked it. What's harder to understand than, say, "Mudd's Women"? or "The Menagerie"?

Neither of which makes tons of sense.

 

[Timo]

Another thing not very well justified in the writing is the idea of an eternal struggle between these two idiots. Since when have they been immortal? Aren't both simply humanoids who will grow old and die pretty soon (even if they have "the recuperative powers of a dinosaur", which they probably don't since McCoy didn't know about the switcharoo when giving his expert opinion), not to mention starve or succumb to thirst within a week already?

Timo Saloniemi