Actor/Professional Writer "collaborations..." really?

[CaptainHawk1]

Over the years I've read countless of Trek novels written collaboratively by Trek actors and regular repected authors of Trek. Whether it's the Shatnerverse by Shatner and the Reeves-Stevens's or a Stitch in Time by Andrew Robinson (and whomever he wrote his novel with) or the novel I read yesterday, The 34th Rule by Armin Shimmerman and David George, there is one thing I've always been suspicious of: how much writing do these actors actually do? I've always found it doubtful that actors, who by the nature merely perform someone else's fiction and have no experience in creating fiction, are suddenly writing complex novels. The Shatnerverse was the first series of novels I became suspicious due to the incredible amount of detail and the fact they are all written in the exact same style, coincidentally, as Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stevens.

So what's the deal? How much involvement do these actors actually have in penning these novels?

-Shawn

 

[Thrawn]

Well, I can tell you that the editors said that Andrew Robinson wrote every word of A Stitch In Time when someone asked that online a few years ago. As for the others, I'm not sure.

 

[MargaretClark]

As Andrew Robinson's editor, I can tell you he wrote every single word of A Stitch in Time. He did all the rewrites and all the other "glamorous" work an author does before a book sees print.

Margaret

 

[Dayton Ward]

I've always found it doubtful that actors, who by the nature merely perform someone else's fiction and have no experience in creating fiction, are suddenly writing complex novels.

Well, I think Hugh Laurie, Ethan Hawke, and Carrie Fisher (to name a few examples just off the top of my head) would argue with you on that.

Then there are the scads of actors who've written either for film, TV, or the stage. You know. Again off the top of my head... folks like Edward Norton, Carrie Fisher again, Jon Favreau, Sylvester Stallone (who was nominated for, among other things, an Oscar for screenwriting), or Affleck and Damon (who won said Oscar), and another guy you may have heard of...Shakespeare.

On the Trek front, as has already been said, Andy Robinson did indeed write every word of A Stitch In Time, itself an outgrowth of the copious notes he kept during DS9's run so that he could fashion a consistent, rich backstory for Garak.

As for the collaborations, they come in all shapes and sizes and vary from project to project, even when you're talking about the same writing team. My understanding on the Kirk books is that the Reeves-Stevens do the heavy lifting when it comes to the Trek books (adding the Trek trivia/continuity/etc.), but Shatner is involved in the story development and working with the writers to figure out what the Kirk plotline will be. Whatever the arrangement, all the parties seem okay with it.

(An interesting thing I learned about Shatner only recently: long before he was Kirk, Shatner worked for the Canadian Broadcasting Company and apparently wrote plays for them. Go figure.)

 

[Jim Johnson]

One could argue that a performance is just as creative as writing, but...nah.

Speaking as a writer, a playwright, and an (amateur) actor, it's entirely possible for one person to be creative enough to do any and all of those things, and other creative things besides.

As Dayton mentioned, the circumstances vary from book to book and project to project, of course.

 

[captcalhoun]

i believe the story related in VOI was that Shatner comes up with the ideas, J&G write the first draft, after hammering out an outline with Bill, he then does some polishing (probably to Kirk's stuff mostly) and then they do another draft and then it gets submitted.

 

[Deano2099]

I think I remember that in I, Q John DeLancie did Q's monologues and Peter David the rest (albeit with a lot of back and forth).

 

[CaptainHawk1]

I've always found it doubtful that actors, who by the nature merely perform someone else's fiction and have no experience in creating fiction, are suddenly writing complex novels.

Well, I think Hugh Laurie, Ethan Hawke, and Carrie Fisher (to name a few examples just off the top of my head) would argue with you on that.

Then there are the scads of actors who've written either for film, TV, or the stage. You know. Again off the top of my head... folks like Edward Norton, Carrie Fisher again, Jon Favreau, Sylvester Stallone (who was nominated for, among other things, an Oscar for screenwriting), or Affleck and Damon (who won said Oscar), and another guy you may have heard of...Shakespeare.

On the Trek front, as has already been said, Andy Robinson did indeed write every word of A Stitch In Time, itself an outgrowth of the copious notes he kept during DS9's run so that he could fashion a consistent, rich backstory for Garak.

As for the collaborations, they come in all shapes and sizes and vary from project to project, even when you're talking about the same writing team. My understanding on the Kirk books is that the Reeves-Stevens do the heavy lifting when it comes to the Trek books (adding the Trek trivia/continuity/etc.), but Shatner is involved in the story development and working with the writers to figure out what the Kirk plotline will be. Whatever the arrangement, all the parties seem okay with it.

(An interesting thing I learned about Shatner only recently: long before he was Kirk, Shatner worked for the Canadian Broadcasting Company and apparently wrote plays for them. Go figure.)

Yeah, thanks for that...

You know what I love? I love when I start a thread and another member of the board decides to take up a full page in response to show how witty and clever they are, but don't bother to answer the original question and provide absolutely no extra insight. Thanks for that. That was exactly what I was looking for.

First, I was specifically referring to Trek actors, no one else. Second, I was talking about Trek novels, which require a vast amount of technical knowledge and knowledge of the Trek Universe. I was not talking about screenplays and not about any other type of novel.. Third, even with all of that not being considered, your examples are anecdotal and represent the exceptions to the rule, not the rule.

Still, when you get around to discussing the issue I had raised, the response was vague and didn't offer anymore information than was already provided.

Sorry to sound so caustic but that really burns my biscuits when people go into long-winded posts without answering the question or helping further the discussion.

-Shawn

 

[Trent Roman]

Dayton did answer your question:

As for the collaborations, they come in all shapes and sizes and vary from project to project, even when you're talking about the same writing team.

In other words, the degree of involvement varies from person to person, and from project to project; there's no one, set answer. The examples he mentioned are not anecdotes but incidences on the spectruum across which such projects can fall across. Now, if that's not the answer you wanted--like something bashing the writing skills of actors rather than the nuances of reality--then that's hardly Dayton's problem.

Fictitiously yours, Trent Roman

 

[Greg Cox]

Exactly. The only honest answer is: it depends.

All collaborations are different, even those between professional authors. (I know, I've written three books that way.) And that applies to celebrity-driven books as well. There's any number of ways to go about it, with varying degrees of involvement from the celebrity.

 

[Divine]

I've always found it doubtful that actors, who by the nature merely perform someone else's fiction and have no experience in creating fiction, are suddenly writing complex novels.

Well, I think Hugh Laurie, Ethan Hawke, and Carrie Fisher (to name a few examples just off the top of my head) would argue with you on that.

Then there are the scads of actors who've written either for film, TV, or the stage. You know. Again off the top of my head... folks like Edward Norton, Carrie Fisher again, Jon Favreau, Sylvester Stallone (who was nominated for, among other things, an Oscar for screenwriting), or Affleck and Damon (who won said Oscar), and another guy you may have heard of...Shakespeare.

On the Trek front, as has already been said, Andy Robinson did indeed write every word of A Stitch In Time, itself an outgrowth of the copious notes he kept during DS9's run so that he could fashion a consistent, rich backstory for Garak.

As for the collaborations, they come in all shapes and sizes and vary from project to project, even when you're talking about the same writing team. My understanding on the Kirk books is that the Reeves-Stevens do the heavy lifting when it comes to the Trek books (adding the Trek trivia/continuity/etc.), but Shatner is involved in the story development and working with the writers to figure out what the Kirk plotline will be. Whatever the arrangement, all the parties seem okay with it.

(An interesting thing I learned about Shatner only recently: long before he was Kirk, Shatner worked for the Canadian Broadcasting Company and apparently wrote plays for them. Go figure.)

Yeah, thanks for that...

You know what I love? I love when I start a thread and another member of the board decides to take up a full page in response to show how witty and clever they are, but don't bother to answer the original question and provide absolutely no extra insight. Thanks for that. That was exactly what I was looking for.

First, I was specifically referring to Trek actors, no one else. Second, I was talking about Trek novels, which require a vast amount of technical knowledge and knowledge of the Trek Universe. I was not talking about screenplays and not about any other type of novel.. Third, even with all of that not being considered, your examples are anecdotal and represent the exceptions to the rule, not the rule.

Still, when you get around to discussing the issue I had raised, the response was vague and didn't offer anymore information than was already provided.

Sorry to sound so caustic but that really burns my biscuits when people go into long-winded posts without answering the question or helping further the discussion.

-Shawn

The last time you posted in Trek Literature, you were kind of a jerk like you are now. Hopefully we won't see you around too often.

 

[Dayton Ward]

Yeah, thanks for that...

No problem.

Anything else I should remember when replying to you, or did you get it all out just then?

 

[Geoff Thorne]

yeah, whatever.

Everybody knows DeCandido writes all the books.

 

[OmahaStar]

Yeah, thanks for that...

No problem.

Anything else I should remember when replying to you, or did you get it all out just then?

I hope he did, cuz his reply to you was WAY out of line.

 

[Tulaberry whine]

IIRC, Armin Shimmerman has written a series of books outside of Trek.

 

[Therin of Andor]

I love when I start a thread and another member of the board decides to take up a full page in response...

that really burns my biscuits when people go into long-winded posts without answering the question or helping further the discussion.

Well... Um, that's all from me then.

 

[David R. George III]

Well, I was going to respond, but I'm not really interested in being taken to task for my answer. Also, for anybody interested, Armin spells his last name with two ms, not three (Shimerman, not Shimmerman).

 

[Steve Roby]

The Shatnerverse was the first series of novels I became suspicious due to the incredible amount of detail and the fact they are all written in the exact same style, coincidentally, as Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stevens.

The fact that they're named as his co-authors on the title page and given bios on the back cover flap of every Shatnerverse book from the beginning, and named on the book cover starting with The Captain's Peril, might have been a bit of a hint, too.

 

[ronny]

Yeah, thanks for that...

You know what I love? I love when I start a thread and another member of the board decides to take up a full page in response to show how witty and clever they are, but don't bother to answer the original question and provide absolutely no extra insight. Thanks for that. That was exactly what I was looking for.

-Shawn

To use one of my favorite quotes from The Young Turks: "Dude, you're a 10, you need to be a 2".

 

[William Leisner]

Anything else I should remember when replying to you, or did you get it all out just then?

You'll probably want to bring along a box of Kleenex. And perhaps a tiny little violin to play.