Camera work in season 4

[commodore64]

In some of the episodes of season 4, I really hate the camera work. It's like they realized BSG -- that goes out of it's way to be "edgy" -- used zooms and odd angles and tried to incorporate that into the show. For example, I dislike the direction and camera work of the Klingon two-parter. The shot of Archer strapped to the chair, undergoing a Klingon transformation, shot is well ... silly. And it possibly detracted from my enjoyment of the show.

Daedalus was also filled with odd zooms, as if to add tension to a show that frankly wasn't very tense.

I know it's nitpicky -- and hey, we're on the TrekBBS, so feels like we should be -- but this is one of those things that bothers me.

Anyone else? Any other camera work you hated/loved during the series?

 

[gblews]

In some of the episodes of season 4, I really hate the camera work. It's like they realized BSG -- that goes out of it's way to be "edgy" -- used zooms and odd angles and tried to incorporate that into the show.

FWIW, use of the hand held camera and the odd or unusual shot angles actually started during season 3.

I first noticed the hand held camera in Carpenter Street during the interogation scene. At one point the camera takes a weird angle and then swoops in crazily for a close up of Loomis in the chair. Its rather obtrusive but is one of the quirky things I like about the episode.

As for camera angles, in Azati Prime in the scene where T'Pol is heading for the shuttle pod in the launch bay, part of the scene is shot from underneath the walkway. It was so unusual for a Trek episode that I noticed it immediately. That isn't everyone's cup of tea, I understand that. There was probably more during season 3 that I'm missing.

It didn't always work, but as usual, I applaud any attempt to do something different in Star Trek. In any case, the odd angles and use of the hand held began prior to season 4.

 

[commodore64]

You're right in season 3, they have swooping shots and underneath shots (including Archer's torture in Azati Prime). For some reason that was less annoying than sudden, jerky zooms to me. I'm not sure the technique used for season 3 vs. season 4.

I think BSG started with weird camera work, so it's only as annoying as it was in the beginning with those shots. I like "different," but since BSG was doing it and with better effect, it made ENT seem like "We'll try anything to get people to think we're cool." Instead of just - I don't know - focus on the writing.

Again, just my opinion.

 

[gblews]

I think BSG started with weird camera work, so it's only as annoying as it was in the beginning with those shots. I like "different," but since BSG was doing it and with better effect, it made ENT seem like "We'll try anything to get people to think we're cool." Instead of just - I don't know - focus on the writing.

BSG was just one of several shows to follow "24" (which was the real pioneer) with extensive use of the hand held. In fact, 24 may not have been first to use it extensively. That "honor" probably goes to some of the cop shows.

But lots of shows including BSG and ENT have used it since then. It does give a feeling of "being there" (which is the reason I think both ENT, BSG, and others have used it) but also can appear gimmicky and obtrusive depending on how its used and how often.

Honestly, I don't remember the hand held being used much in season 4 and the only odd angle shot I can recall is the one in Daedalus where the camera starts under the biobed and comes around to T'Pol talking to Phlox.

 

[pookha]

In some of the episodes of season 4, I really hate the camera work. It's like they realized BSG -- that goes out of it's way to be "edgy" -- used zooms and odd angles and tried to incorporate that into the show.

FWIW, use of the hand held camera and the odd or unusual shot angles actually started during season 3.

I first noticed the hand held camera in Carpenter Street during the interogation scene. At one point the camera takes a weird angle and then swoops in crazily for a close up of Loomis in the chair. Its rather obtrusive but is one of the quirky things I like about the episode. .

you really start seeing it in anomaly.

 

[commodore64]

BSG was just one of several shows to follow "24" (which was the real pioneer) with extensive use of the hand held. In fact, 24 may not have been first to use it extensively. That "honor" probably goes to some of the cop shows.

Great point about the cop shows. You're right -- I guess it's been around for a while. Since the 80s? At least with the handhelds, but I'm not talking so much about hand held. I'm more talking about the "crazy" shots -- choppy zooms for example.

But lots of shows including BSG and ENT have used it since then. It does give a feeling of "being there" (which is the reason I think both ENT, BSG, and others have used it) but also can appear gimmicky and obtrusive depending on how its used and how often.

I think 24 and BSG used it to create tension. Cops definitely you feel like you're there. I guess the reason I keep going back to BSG, is to me they have the choppy zooms.

Honestly, I don't remember the hand held being used much in season 4 and the only odd angle shot I can recall is the one in Daedalus where the camera starts under the biobed and comes around to T'Pol talking to Phlox.

Again, I'm not sure the hand held bothered me, it's more the crazy zooms. Although, some of the hand held or odd shots (like filming under their feet) seemed to stick out, rather than flow with the story.

 

[Omega Glory]

I remember there was a scene in the episode "Damage" between Phlox and Archer where there was and oiminous blue light and the camera was extremly close up. I could never imagine anyone using that kind of camera work in TNG or any other star trek.

 

[Mr J]

Although sometimes it could be distracting and didn't always work brilliantly, I was pleased that S4 and to a lesser extent S3 experimented more with different shooting styles. For the most part, the spin-offs stuck to to the old boring angles and shots as TNG did in the 80's while the rest of TV kind of moved on around them. The Star Trek franchise kind of stuck in this 80's TV bubble, both in terms of writing, performance and direction, which was the biggest part of it's downfall IMO, and I wish that the sort of changes they implemented in these areas from around mid-S3 Enterprise onwards had happened a lot sooner. Enterprise actually felt like a modern TV show when they started experimenting more.

That isn't to say they always did well with it. As others have pointed out, there were instances where the shooting styles were distracting and didn't add anything to the scenes they were filming, but overall I was pleased that Star Trek finally started to move out of the old-fashioned TNG format in this area.

 

[commodore64]

I remember there was a scene in the episode "Damage" between Phlox and Archer where there was and oiminous blue light and the camera was extremly close up. I could never imagine anyone using that kind of camera work in TNG or any other star trek.

In that case, I really thought the camera worked well, as did the lighting. It enhanced the mood of the scene: resigned, personal and somewhat sorrowful.

 

[SFRabid]

What I noticed more than the camera work is the lighting. Sometimes it could be distracting and somewhat aggravating. Back lights. Flashing lights. Dark shadows on faces. It is even worse on green-screen shots when the lighting on the characters does not match well with the background.

 

[Dane_Whitman]

Although sometimes it could be distracting and didn't always work brilliantly, I was pleased that S4 and to a lesser extent S3 experimented more with different shooting styles. For the most part, the spin-offs stuck to to the old boring angles and shots as TNG did in the 80's while the rest of TV kind of moved on around them. The Star Trek franchise kind of stuck in this 80's TV bubble, both in terms of writing, performance and direction, which was the biggest part of it's downfall IMO, and I wish that the sort of changes they implemented in these areas from around mid-S3 Enterprise onwards had happened a lot sooner. Enterprise actually felt like a modern TV show when they started experimenting more.

That isn't to say they always did well with it. As others have pointed out, there were instances where the shooting styles were distracting and didn't add anything to the scenes they were filming, but overall I was pleased that Star Trek finally started to move out of the old-fashioned TNG format in this area.

This sums up my feelings on the subject.

There were some episodes where it seemed to work (Carpenter Street, Stormfront part 1) and some where it seemed forced and out of place (Daedalus).

 

[Eric Cheung]

BSG was just one of several shows to follow "24" (which was the real pioneer) with extensive use of the hand held. In fact, 24 may not have been first to use it extensively. That "honor" probably goes to some of the cop shows.

Wasn't NYPD Blue the pioneer of extensive handheld in TV?

If you consider film as well you could go as far back as at least French New Wave in terms of a conscious effort to make shots look a little gritty and shaky and handheld with their cinema verite.

But in terms of the current trend in handheld it seems like reality television is more an influence. As much as I dislike reality television it has influenced a more verite look to TV and trained viewers to tune in to a serialized show. I think it's contributed to the trend in serialized fiction programming, at least making it more marketable. Many more mainstream shows now have both of these two traits from comedies like The Office and Arrested Development to hour-long dramas like Lost and 24.

 

[182]

As for camera angles, in Azati Prime in the scene where T'Pol is heading for the shuttle pod in the launch bay, part of the scene is shot from underneath the walkway. It was so unusual for a Trek episode that I noticed it immediately. That isn't everyone's cup of tea, I understand that. There was probably more during season 3 that I'm missing.

Yeah, I never thought about it before, but everytime I watched that episode, I noticed it, because it really was unusual, and I ALWAYS think to myself "Huh." T'Pol is walking across the catwalk, the camera is underneath.. Trip stops her from behind, and the camera spins around as she herself spins around to face Trip. Also in that episode, the very end when the Enterprise is getting railed by the Xindi, and the bridge is coming down in pieces.. the camera zooms in right on T'Pol's eyes. So yeah, you make a good point, it did start popping up in Season 3, now that I think about it.

 

[indranee]

it's just something that doesn't quite work for Trek.