Remember the old days? (Mainly for Gen X and boomers, I guess…)

[Steve Roby]

Yea, and it's not just you. Having been born in 1960, I have never really felt like a Boomer either, given that most of the defining events of that generation (Howdy Doody, Woodstock, etc) happened before I was even a teenager. Hell, the Beatles had already broken up before I turned 10.
We have been called Generation Jones, Baby X, Boomerex, and Trailing-edge Boomers by the academics when discussing this phenomenon of being on the cusp.

I used to hang out on a place called The WeLL back in the '90s, which had a section called Lost, for the Lost Generation (1960-1965). I was born in 1963 so that worked for me. My sisters were born in 1964 and 1972 and my wife was born in 1968, and I really don't think we represented two different generations between us. For that matter, Douglas Coupland, writer of the novel Generation X that kicked off decades of generational navelgazing, professional voice of GenX for a few years, was born in 1961. So was one of my exes, come to think of it.

Anyway.

The 1970s were a time when we had to figure out a lot more on our own. As a military brat, I moved around as a kid, and as far as I can remember I never got to see Star Trek regularly until 1974. I'd seen at least one episode somewhere, read a Gold Key comic or two, and I got Mission to Horatius for, I think, Christmas 1971, along with the similar Whitman TV books for Rat Patrol, Hawaii Five-O, and a couple of others. I was a lot more excited about the first two at the time.

In 1972 we moved to a town with a really good used bookstore. At first I went for cheap used Hardy Boys books (35 cents instead of $1.44!), then discovered other Grosset & Dunlop series that were no longer being published, then I burned out on the kids' book section and looked at the SF section. Hey, Star Trek 3 by James Blish, I'll try that. Within a year or two I was caught up on Blish, found the first Alan Dean Foster Logs, got The World of Star Trek, The Trouble With Tribbles, Star Trek Lives!, The Making of Star Trek... there was no looking back. But there was a lot of looking around. I'd find out about those books by spending a lot of time in bookstores. No Internet, not even Starlog for the first few years.

Oh, on the subject of not having a lot of information about things... one of the Grosset & Dunlop series I bought at my favourite used bookstore was Tom Corbett, Space Cadet. It was several years before I discovered it was based on a TV series. And then I discovered there had also been a radio show, comic books, a newspaper comic strip.... It wasn't until the Internet era that I managed to get the one book I'd been missing (around 25 years after I bought the others).

It was harder to find the things we loved in the 1970s -- or even that they existed, until we saw them -- but that made the experience that much more special. (Fotonovels!? What are these? This is so cool!)

 

[ZapBrannigan]

If anybody's interested, this is what I found regarding who we're all supposed to be. I can't keep them straight to save my life.

Named generations, primarily based on US demographics, span from the early 20th century to the present, with common, albeit sometimes debated, ranges:

• The Lost Generation (1883–1900): Named for those who came of age during World War I.

• The Greatest Generation (1901–1924/27): Also known as the G.I. Generation, they fought in World War II.

• The Silent Generation (1925/28–1945): Grew up during the Great Depression and World War II.

• Baby Boomers (1946–1964): Born during the post-WWII population boom.

• Generation X (1965–1980): Followed the Baby Boomers.

• Millennials / Gen Y (1981–1996): Came of age around the turn of the millennium.

• Generation Z / iGen / Zoomers (1997–2012): Followed the Millennials.

• Generation Alpha (2013–mid 2020s): Children born to Millennials.

• Generation Beta (Approx. 2025–2039): The upcoming generation succeeding Alpha.

Common Transitional "Micro-Generations":
• Generation Jones (1954–1965): The cohort between Boomers and Gen X.
• Xennials (1977–1983): The "micro-generation" cusp between Gen X and Millennials.
• Zillennials (1993–1998): The cusp between Millennials and Gen Z.

 

[Steve Roby]

I don't really buy Generation Jones. People born in 1954 and people born in 1965 became teenagers and adults in pretty different times.

Just reminded myself of the Police song "Born in the 50s," from their first album back in 1978. Well, no, Sting, I wasn't. A lot of people who bought that album weren't.

 

[BillJ]

"Xenial" is what people have been forced to call GenY to get people like you to accept it's a real identity. I suppose I should be happy that you even acknowledge it exists, but all I see is another self-important dick trying to tell me what my identity is instead of just calling me what I want to be called.

When you were born isn’t who you are. Breathe. No one is trying to erase your identity, we just have a different understanding on how this all works.

 

[Noname Given]

I was a bit late to the party, but due to me living in Germany, I was lucky enough to make some of these "good old days" experiences a few years later, as it took a while for Star Trek to arrive here:

For example, I experienced the very first run of many TOS episodes. The first run on German tv, that is ... that was in late 1987 (a first chunk of 39 had been aired in Germany 1972-74, but the remaining 39 -- all but "Patterns of Force" -- didn't premiere here before 1987/88). TNG didn't start here before September 1990.

So I was a TOS fan at first, since late 1987, unaware that TNG even existed. Without a VCR, I would record the audio of TOS episodes onto audio cassettes.

Here in West-Berlin, there was the AFN tv station for the US army stationed here, but since it was in NTSC format, I could only watch it in black/white and without sound on our PAL tv. It had TOS on every saturday morning, and I would see many episodes for the first time there -- without sound. Some episodes became legends for me this way.

The Blish novelizations were among the first books I read from start to end as a kid. And I would collect all kinds of other stuff on flea markets, like comic books and trading cards.

I first learnt there were TOS movies, when the only pay tv cable channel in Germany at that time aired ST IV in spring 1989. Although my family had no subscription, that didn't keep me from "watching" the encrypted movie nevertheless -- the audio was good enough and the picture only partially distorted, due to the analog encryption, and what I didn't see only further triggered my imagination. ST V was finally the first ST movie I watched at the cinema.

When I first came across TNG on AFN (in b/w and without sound), in late 1989 or early 1990, I assumed it was a TOS remake, and Riker was supposed to be the new Kirk. I wrote letters to all relevant tv stations, asking if they would air it, and got a reply by the ZDF station in early 1990 that they would start TNG later that year, which totally amazed me.

Eventually, my parents had bought a VCR, so I recorded TNG from the start, but no TOS re-runs were on German tv in West-Berlin between late 1988 and January 1992, and during that period, I would collect and gather even the tiniest piece of Star Trek I could get.

It was like heaven on earth when I met an older boy in the neighborhood, who had taped many TOS episodes on VCR and would copy them for me, in exchange for providing him with our VCR for three weeks. That way, I got my hands on about 35 TOS episodes, many of which I hadn't known before.

In 1991, I collected the "25th Anniversary" trading cards, imported from the US by a couple running a comic book store (where I would also get old second hand ST comic books from the 70s).

Finally, there was a complete TOS rerun in 1992, when I could finally tape the episodes I hadn't had on tape before ... and TNG was running parallel (its 2nd and 3rd season at that time in Germany), which meant "new" Star Trek episodes for me 3 times a week.

Around that time, I joined a fan club, that had a monthly fanzine, where I would read news about Star Trek for the first time, slowly becoming aware how amazing the fandom was. They also had fan fiction and fan art for mail order.

For me, these years between 1988 and 1992, marked by very scarce new Trek content for me, and this scarcity just increasing my craving, may have been "the golden age of Star Trek" for me.

The absolute peak would be 1994, though: The private station SAT1 picked up Star Trek and aired 95 of the 178 TNG episodes for the first time in Germany, daily from Monday to Friday, plus the first two seasons of DS9 and another TOS re-run -- and I still totally enjoyed every bit of this new content, Trek was still getting better and better.

In fact, as long as Star Trek was just TOS, TNG and DS9, I loved all of it ... the point when the tides changed, and I felt it became "too much" and losing quality, was in mid 1996 for me -- when VOY aired in Germany, the first Trek show I felt was a big step backwards, after it had been progressing all the years before.

Until around March 1996, when DS9 season 3 aired for the first time in Germany and "Patterns of Force" was released on VHS, which allowed me to complete TOS, it was a given for me that I basically enjoy every new Star Trek content -- I loved all of it.

Is it true that they changed a lot of the original scripted dialogue when they dubbed TOS from English into German that either made it more campy/humorous/designed more to appeal to younger children?

 

[Noname Given]

I don't really buy Generation Jones. People born in 1954 and people born in 1965 became teenagers and adults in pretty different times.

Just reminded myself of the Police song "Born in the 50s," from their first album back in 1978. Well, no, Sting, I wasn't. A lot of people who bought that album weren't.

Yep. I can definitely relate.

 

[Sim]

Is it true that they changed a lot of the original scripted dialogue when they dubbed TOS from English into German that either made it more campy/humorous/designed more to appeal to younger children?

Yes, although less so than you might expect.

In general, the tone of the 39 episodes dubbed and aired by ZDF between 1972 to 74 was changed a bit more than the 39 episodes dubbed and aired 15 years later by SAT1 in 1987/88 ... and even of these first 39 episodes, many were translated quite faithfully to the original (like "The Enemy Within", "Obsession" or "The Immunity Syndrome").

Especially Kirk, Bones and Scotty were given a more colloquial, less military style of speaking, with a couple of "buddy-isms", Bones got the fitting nickname "Pille" in German (="pill"), Kirk sometimes called Chekov "pane" (Czech for "Mister") for whatever reason, and Scotty's accent was reflected by an especially colloquial flection.

And whenever there was humor in the original (like in "I, Mudd" or "Piece of the Action"), the translation took quite some freedom to rather translate the funny spirit than literally -- they came up with quite a few ideas on their own. Sometimes, they inserted a line with no relation to the original when it was fitting (for example, in "Tomorrow is Yesterday", after Christopher wakes up in the infirmary, he tells Kirk "you've got a punch like Cassius").

Apart from smaller changes like that, and the notable shift in tone, most episodes remained relatively close to the original. With a few major, extreme exceptions:

"Amok Time" was totally butchered, cut down to 38 minutes, and re-cut to change the story. There was no mention of Vulcan mating rituals whatsoever, Spock just happened to be "space sick", and his duel with Kirk was a fever dream due to an untested medication. Apparently, the mating topic was considered too hot for an adolescent audience.

In "Metamorphosis", they didn't change the story, but made even more cuts ... the German version was only 36 minutes long.

Both episodes were "corrected" by a new German version on VHS release in 1996 and DVD in 2004.

"That Which Survives" was another extreme example: They inserted many totally silly jokes unrelated to the original. Apparently, nobody working on the dubbing took this episode seriosly.

But these three episodes are the three extreme examples, the changes for all others were much more subtle.

The 39 SAT1 episodes from 1987/88 maintained the nicknames and less military, more colloquial style, but otherwise remained rather true to the original, with two exceptions:

In "City on the Edge of Forever", the very short sequence with the marching Nazis was cut, but without changing the meaning of the original.

And on "A Taste of Armageddon", they erased any mention of the death cabins, which resulted in an episode that made few sense in the translated version. This too was corrected with the 2004 DVD release.

And, of course, "Patterns of Force" was omitted in both the 1972-74 and the 1987-88 airings. It was finally dubbed and released on VHS in 1996, with a translation very close to the original, and a 16+ rating.

 

[Sim]

Oh, and I should add that the choice of voice actors for the German dubbing was superb, imo. Especially Kirk and Spock.

Kirk was dubbed by G. G. Hoffmann, a very warm, charming voice actor who was usually booked for "hero" roles ... for example Sean Connery. He came across as even more of a lady man in German.

Likewise, Spock's rational, sometimes snobbish attitude was perfectly reflected by Herbert Weicker.

They didn't just speak a translation, they actually interpreted the characters.

I'm personally rather fond of the German TOS dubbing, despite its flaws, not least because of nostalgia.

 

[Ssosmcin]

I not only can't figure out all these generation designations, I can't figure out why it's important to anyone.

I literally don't have a spare f'k to give. I'm 58. My knees and back tell me all I need to know.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I don't really buy Generation Jones. People born in 1954 and people born in 1965 became teenagers and adults in pretty different times.

Just reminded myself of the Police song "Born in the 50s," from their first album back in 1978. Well, no, Sting, I wasn't. A lot of people who bought that album weren't.

That's going to be true of any "Generation". I'm in "Jones" and there are time I can relate to things from GenX than things from the Boomers. The draft and Vietnam were over by the time was a teen. Hard Rock. Disco, Punk and New Wave were more my jam than the 60s scene. Though for some reason a lot my fellow Jonesers feel nostalgic for the 60s, but we really don't recall them like our older siblings. I think some of the neo-Hippies and Mod Revial type were from Jones as well as X.

 

[mb22]

Oh, also, while I didn't buy them, around 1976 the Estes model rocket company came out with both Enterprise and Klingon Battlecruiser model rockets. I'm not entirely sure how those were supposed to work. Anyone remember or have those?

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[mb22]

What social (race, religion, ethnicity, education, location, economic status, etc.) groups one belongs to are at least as important as when one was born. Someone growing up in an economically underserved inner city is going to experience life differently than one living in an affluent suburb.

 

[Sim]

What social (race, religion, ethnicity, education, location, economic status, etc.) groups one belongs to are at least as important as when one was born. Someone growing up in an economically underserved inner city is going to experience life differently than one living in an affluent suburb.

They girls and boys I went to school with were all about my "generation" ... and many of them couldn't have been more different to me and my life. I knew that even back then, and that hasn't changed since.

 

[Rowdy Roddy McDowall]

Those Blish books were home video before there WAS home video. Even the Fotonovels were a still thing of the future.

We only has 12 Mandala color book episodes in the end, though the Trek Core screencaps for all TREK episodes now are equally sweet.

Oh, and I should add that the choice of voice actors for the German dubbing was superb, imo. Especially Kirk and Spock.

I'm personally rather fond of the German TOS dubbing, despite its flaws, not least because of nostalgia.

Be it ORDINARY PEOPLE, ALIEN, or TREK*, I absolute love listening to Deutsch dubbings.

(*See THE RODDENBERRY VAULT episodes for these.)

 

[Phoenix219]

Yea, and it's not just you. Having been born in 1960, I have never really felt like a Boomer either, given that most of the defining events of that generation (Howdy Doody, Woodstock, etc) happened before I was even a teenager. Hell, the Beatles had already broken up before I turned 10.
We have been called Generation Jones, Baby X, Boomerex, and Trailing-edge Boomers by the academics when discussing this phenomenon of being on the cusp.

right... i always say, if you were alive when Vietnam and the Moon Landing happen, when Star Trek was in first-run, are old enough to remember when Star Wars first hit the theater and when the Atari was initially released, you are not my generation, even though, by the numbers, we are supposed to be. Its why i firmly gravitate towards the "made up" micro-generation bridge/cusp for sure. Heh, Boomer-X is the exact same things as X-Enniel at the other end. Thats kinda great. I think Baby X would be the other end of the spectrum and fit better at my end lol. But yeah... you nailed it. Although, it all does kind of merge together, because of hand-me-downs, re-runs, TV specials and garage sale finds, I do have a lot of nostalgia for the stuff I missed, but its a weird echo, quite different from the stuff I experienced first hand as a child. I've recently developed a huge interest in some 1970s tv shows I never gave the time of day to before, and its both familiar and just-out-of-reach at the same time. But man, the Rockford Files is one of the best TV shows I've ever seen in my life, and it makes me a bit sad I missed that time period, even though in no ways to I wish I was any older than I already am LOL.

 

[M'Sharak]

I used to hang out on a place called The WeLL back in the '90s, which had a section called Lost, for the Lost Generation (1960-1965).

That's great for The WeLL, I guess, but for The Lost Generation there's an earlier group which laid claim to that label.

I don't really buy Generation Jones. People born in 1954 and people born in 1965 became teenagers and adults in pretty different times.

Just reminded myself of the Police song "Born in the 50s," from their first album back in 1978. Well, no, Sting, I wasn't. A lot of people who bought that album weren't.

I was.

Generation Jones is as real as any of the other labels arbitrarily applied to statistical groupings based upon date of birth. Boomers are all too old and you don't quite fit with GenX? Bam! There you go.

 

[Ovation]

I was born in the Summer of Love. Good enough for me. (Though it was a sad day when my students no longer knew what that meant )

 

[Steve Roby]

What social (race, religion, ethnicity, education, location, economic status, etc.) groups one belongs to are at least as important as when one was born. Someone growing up in an economically underserved inner city is going to experience life differently than one living in an affluent suburb.

Social status can be hard to make sense of. My mom was a fisherman's daughter, one of a dozen children, my dad a barber's son, one of nine kids, they both enlisted in the military in the 1950s, met, got married, Mom got out and raised us kids and occasionally worked at K-Mart. Race? White, Mom an English-speaking person of French, British, and Norwegian descent, Dad a French-speaking person of French and possibly British descent. Religion? Raised Catholic, but in Canada, that's the majority type of Christian. It's not like being Catholic in the US or the UK, it's boringly normal. 11 of 24 prime ministers have been Catholic, the other 13 divided between five different types of Protestant. Working class? We grew up in trailer parks and military family housing. Today all three of us kids have two university degrees each. Where does that put us? Location? As military kids we bounced around the country. In twelve school grades I went to six schools in Ontario, Alberta, and PEI. Went to university in Nova Scotia.

It's a lot easier to say when I was born.

 

[T'Bonz]

What generation you are doesn't really matter. It's kind of fun though to reminisce with those raised in the same era, probably why the designations are so popular. As with many things, they're generalization and many won't fit properly or find they align with another generation more accurately for some reason or other

I'm a late Boomer. I can def relate to Generation Jones, but also with some Boomer stuff because I had a sister six years older and my pop culture tastes include stuff I got from her at the time. A lot of the Boomer prosperity was gone by the time I hit adulthood compared to early Boomers, but I bet some of the later generations would scoff and say "uh, you guys STILL had it better." And they'd be right about that when it comes to certain things. But wrong about others - like the horrid interest rates on housing back then.

It's silly to point fingers at other generations because we were born when we were born. Why turn the designations into something ugly?

I'll continue remembering the fun things of my childhood and teens, and you do too if you wish, no matter when you were born. It's all good.

 

[Ssosmcin]

I had felt that Pepsi missed a prime opportunity to make a Star Trek connection in the 80's and early 90's. They slogan was "The choice of a new generation."

I had a vision of their commercial ending with Brent Spiner.

"Pepsi: The choice of a new generation."

He drinks, looks at the camera and in perfect Dataspeak:

"And the Next."