Canon and contradictions coexist comfortably but continuity cannot correlate consistently concurrently.
What are your opinions regarding Star Trek that are, shall we say, unorthodox?
I'm sure their "historical records" were as inerrant as the bible
Nah. it means they had a cool idea. Like the creators of a lot of TV shows set in an approximation of the real world. The story had been kicking around since 1965, The Trek version since 1967.
In Star Trek's universe Earth did have orbital nuclear platforms in 1968. Sometimes our real world lines up with Trek, most of the time it doesn't. As things should be. I don't want a copy of our real world, nor do I want a completely parallel humanity.
Infinite Crisis has joined the chat.
Canon and contradictions coexist comfortably but continuity cannot correlate consistently concurrently.
CC has no idea what this means but loves it anyway!
Crisis on Infinite Earths says "Get in line kid."
The Nexus seems to be when the writers got into their head that Picard must have children. This then manifested into season 3 of Picard, where he had a kid. Damn Nexus.
2371: "I don't have children, and will never have any kids."
2380: "I wonder why Beverly just vanished and cut off all contact....hope I didn't get her pregnant."
2380: "I wonder why Beverly just vanished and cut off all contact....hope I didn't get her pregnant."
Exactly. Unlike what Kurtzman thought, I (and I'm sure a LOT of other fans) don't need the STAR TREK timeline to match our own for it to be inspirational or aspirational.
(I found what he said to be really insulting, honestly.)
The film First Contact is explicit that approximately ten years after WWIII is "the mid-21st century".
So, if a retcon occurred regarding when WWIII occurred, then it occurred no later than by production of the film FC.
Regarding what "Encounter at Farpoint" says, it does not name WWIII, nor does it say when the post-atomic horror began. It does date the type of court that Picard and crew are subjected to as occurring in the year 2079, during the "post-atomic horror", characterized broadly as "the mid-21st century".
I haven't had that feeling since FC, when it seemed like sporadic contact was happening. But basically we have a real mess with the timeline now (like @BillJ ) I just think of Star Trek as another timeline.
But no matter how one looks at it, it's hopelessly messed up, now:
Edith Keeler dies but possibly not EXACTLY as she would have.
Carbon Creek: Vulcans on earth, one of them staying behind
Gary 7 also on Earth preventing nuclear destruction. Also two other agents who died in an accident
Quark and friends stop by for a visit
Plenty of other time travelers or interplanetary visitors, bar owners, etc pass by, usually in San Francisco, for some reason.
Crew of HMS Bounty spend time in San Francisco in the 1980's, cause transparent aluminum to be invented. A prominent cetacean biologist disappears. They get out before Eugenics wars get under way.
Sometime between the events of TVH and 1996 earth begins building DY100 ships capable of interstellar flight. This is problematic because ENT also shows the actual 1996 tiny space rover on Mars, Sojourner. It's nice that they could launch Sojourner to Mars while in the middle of the Eugenics Wars while Khan's nation manages to build a Starship. Presumably there were others since it was an actual class of ship that was well known to the crew of Enterprise, even if Botany Bay was not. Also they must have started building ISS soon afterwards, even though it's not exactly like the one we got, and was crewed with a new class of shuttle more like the real life X-33 project.
Also they have cryogenic suspension. And super strong supposedly very intelligent geneticly augmented folks.
Stuff from season 2 Picard happens. Or doesn't. Can't remember. Really who cares?
But NASA must be getting better at these things as at some point it launches Voyager 6. And then NOMAD.
It almost makes you want to move into the 1 mile high arcology Millenium Gate, which was totally a thing by 2012.
Earth: alive and well more or less and not devatasted by 2024. Bell Riots. But Ireland is unified so that's nice.
2032: crewed Mars mission. That's nice. Why didn't they just take a DY100. Also very cool that they did that in the middle of:
World War III. Memory alpha has it lasting a quarter century or so from 2026 onward. However Captain Pike states that it more or less began in Jan 6 2020. So.. same problem as with Eugenics Wars. unless this is also the Eugenics Wars.
Post WWII: Cops in body armor vaping and shooting guns in court rooms. Post Atomic Horror. oh no. It's like 2025-to current day but with cooler clothes. Praise the leader and pass the ketamine.
The roads must be total shit by the 2030's with all that warfare but forunately hovercars get invented finally.
By the 2060's warp drive had been invented and demonstrated. Earth seems devatated but some parts must not be or they REALLY got their shit back together in 4 years because:
Friendship 1 launches 4 years after the events of FC. This may be the first UESPA probe mentioned.
At some point United Nations becomes United Earth, and there's pretty clearly a different system of world governance. Wonder what happened to the holdouts? Different topic. Anyway, Friendship-1 has the UN logo.
SS Valiant may have launched a year or two earlier. It's all very messed up.
SS Conestoga launches within the same decade as Phoenix. Earth was doing well enough despite the ongoing post-atomic horrors it was attmempting interstellar colonization. Not just trying to settle Mars, etc.
And there would definitely be parts of Earth in medieval, Mad Max-like conditions 16 years after First Contact and warp drive. TNG clearly said that Earth was still recovering from World War III into the early 22nd century, with the Neo-Transcendentalist Movement being an important cultural development of that era.
No, I agree, First Contact is definitely where the retcon first started. I'm just saying that the original intent was that World War III and the Eugenics Wars were one and the same. To wit:
SPOCK: Records of that period are fragmentary, however. The mid-1990's was the era of your last so-called World War.
MCCOY: The Eugenics Wars.
SPOCK: Of course. Your attempt to improve the race through selective breeding.
I suppose we could say that McCoy was simply mistaken here, but that would seem like a big, glaring historical error if so that Spock would no doubt correct him on.
Or vice versa. The 1990s was the last of the world wars but the Eugenics Wars (plural were later.
Spock could have been wrong in saying the 1990s was the last of the world wars. But, likewise, I would think McCoy would pounce at the chance to correct Spock.
Unless they are both mistaken. Records of that time are fragmentary.
Regardless, in the real world I agree with you the intent was the Eugenics Wars were the last of the world wars and they were fought in the 1990s
They could’ve split the difference if they were creative. That the Eugenics Wars happened from 1992-1996 but those wars were what led to WWIII in the 20whenevers. That issues and flashpoints bubbled under the surface and then exploded into a nuclear conflict.
From a historical perspective, three centuries later, they are looked at as one continuous conflict.
From a historical perspective, three centuries later, they are looked at as one continuous conflict.
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