Baz Luhrmann has non-dubious impulses?
Undiscovered Country Anomolies
- Thread starter Vger23
- Start date
(shrugs) I rather enjoyed Moulin Rouge and The Great Gatsby and didn't find Australia especially objectionable. I'm not sure I've seen any of his other films.
Stage-wise, how could ''La Boheme'' be dubious?
(Film-wise, how can ''WS' Romeo & Juliet not be hellishly entertaining?)
Uhura's job in the original series was effectively that of a Navy "radioman." They basically ran the ship’s official comms: sending and receiving fleet traffic, keeping the radios and teletype running, logging everything, and following very strict procedures. They didn't sit there listening to enemy chatter or translating languages. Intercepted/foreign-language stuff was handled by crypto techs, usually working in locked-down spaces and answering to intel, not the ship’s ops chain. In short: Radiomen moved the messages; CTs figured out what the other side was saying.
In that job, it makes no sense for Uhura to need to be a linguist, especially given the universal translator et al. In fact, Uhura explicitly says, "Cryptography is working on it, sir," in "Balance of Terror," so we know there's a department for that.
In that job, it makes no sense for Uhura to need to be a linguist, especially given the universal translator et al. In fact, Uhura explicitly says, "Cryptography is working on it, sir," in "Balance of Terror," so we know there's a department for that.
Agreed on all points. In fairness, though, knowing another language is very different from working in cryptography.
So why is SHE in the dummy seat in TUC?
Because Nicholas Meyer was insistent on showing them looking through the stupid books and when Nichelle Nichols objected, flatly asked her to please not fight him on that.
I couldn't agree more. Bennett respected and understood Trek far more than Meyer. It's a shame he wasn't involved in TUC.
A logical real-world analogy but not one that completely accounts for what is expected of a communications officer on a Constitution Class starship. Seems to me she's far more than just a "radioman."
Why? Based on what she did on TOS and the movies? She'd repair circuits, handle in-ship communications, track signals, etc. She never translated or decoded anything. That's literally the definition of a "radioman" job.
The Enterprise was not the flagship in the original series. This whole "Enterprise is the flagship" business didn't start until TNG.
And since they established the UT worked perfectly (unless the script decided otherwise), she didn't need to be a cunning linguist. She needed to work the comms. That was her job.
Yeah, what he said.
The Enterprise was not the flagship in the original series. This whole "Enterprise is the flagship" business didn't start until TNG.
And since they established the UT worked perfectly (unless the script decided otherwise), she didn't need to be a cunning linguist. She needed to work the comms. That was her job.
Yeah, what he said.
All that. All true.
What job was Uhura being good at in The Undiscovered Country?
By this point, cryptography had to go, to make room for the galley cooks.
"Sir, the Enteprise redesign increases phaser power by channeling it through the main engines. They are now capable of destroying cookware."
"What about the contents of the cookware?"
"We're still working on that, sir."
I really think people are overthinking the Uhura scene. It's a moment of levity in a pretty grim film, but also shows our heroes using their resourcefulness to successfully complete the mission. It's a great Uhura scene, not an insult!
I liked what the Kelvin films did with Uhura's character, based on Hoshi from ENT, and later adopted by SNW, but in TOS she was a skilled technician and systems operator first and foremost. Speaking alien languages wasn't in her wheelhouse and nor should it reasonably have been expected to be.
As for why there was apparently no one on the Enterprise who could speak Klingon on a sensitive mission involving Klingons (who are all expected and assumed to speak English instead - which is Azetbur's point), happily we can simply point to the intentional sabotage that Cartwright's cabal intended. They planted Valeris, Burke and Samno, so they could easily have denied Kirk any Klingon cultural experts. He was set up to fail, and nearly played perfectly into their plans.
I liked what the Kelvin films did with Uhura's character, based on Hoshi from ENT, and later adopted by SNW, but in TOS she was a skilled technician and systems operator first and foremost. Speaking alien languages wasn't in her wheelhouse and nor should it reasonably have been expected to be.
As for why there was apparently no one on the Enterprise who could speak Klingon on a sensitive mission involving Klingons (who are all expected and assumed to speak English instead - which is Azetbur's point), happily we can simply point to the intentional sabotage that Cartwright's cabal intended. They planted Valeris, Burke and Samno, so they could easily have denied Kirk any Klingon cultural experts. He was set up to fail, and nearly played perfectly into their plans.
It is indicated both when Kirk and McCoy are on Rura Pente (The White Man's Gra- er, sorry, wrong movie) and in the Uhura Klingon scene that they have been using a Universal Translator.
Azetbur's objection to "racist" language (with such a weary, above it all retort) is probably the second most clumsily written dialogue in the film. (Burke and Samno take the prize.) I'll add Chekov's lead up in the exchange.
"He said 'alien'! What a horrible racist!" Tropic Thunder was more subtle. Chekov using the term "inalienable human rights" is so forced. It doesn't feel natural to the character or to the setting. It's there just so Azetbur can complain about it.
Mr. Adventure in The Search for Spock was a moment of levity and resourcefulness. This is just dumb. IMHO of course.
But Kirk says the Universal Translator was confiscated, so therefore the Klingon prison governor and Martia are all speaking English!
In the dinner scene, the line about Shakespeare and Chang quoting the Klingon also heavily implies that their party are speaking English to the Starfleet officers.
There's plenty of evidence in the film that Klingons are pretty conversant in English (or Federation Standard as it's sometimes called), but Starfleeters rarely speak Klingon.
Good point. I would assume that the UT does not have a "Speak untranslated speech for dramatic effect" setting. (OTOH, the Enterprise doors have had a "setting for drama" capability so who knows?)
The argument that Uhura (or any of the Enterprise crew) would have to be some kind of SUPER OFFICERS to be fluent (or even passable) in Klingon gets a little sillier when you realize that we've never met a Klingon who wasn't super fluent in English. (Of course Day of the Dove gets a lot less interesting if nobody can talk to each other.)
I know Chang was quoting Adlai Stevenson at the trial, but the implication when he tells Kirk to not "wait for the translation" is that Kirk speaks Klingon and Chang knows it.
Similar threads
