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What's Your Alternate Fate For Captain James T. Kirk after TOS/TUC?

Riley

Lieutenant Commander
Red Shirt
I posted this in Trek Movies but it didn't get any replies. I thought it might be of more interest here.

I've mentioned this in a few threads, but I'll just say it again: I feel that all of the TOS characters that appeared in TNG (and GEN) were either treated poorly or terribly. The only exception is McCoy, whose cameo in "Encounter At Farpoint" was beautifully written and performed.

The worst offender of all is Captain James T. Kirk, the greatest live-action science fiction character of all time, who is nothing more than a plot device in a movie that should have been at least as much about him and his crew as it should have been about Picard and his.

As a lifelong Trek fan (born in '76), I decided long ago to go with my own head canon instead of dwelling on the massive missed opportunities that frequently plague Star Trek history. As a result, GEN is a pure TNG tale with no 23rd century connections and the other TNG films also happen very differently.

I enjoy imagining what Captain Kirk would have done after being forced to retire at what would be in the 23rd century the young age of 60. I don't see Kirk doing ridiculous "mid-life crisis" stunts like orbital skydiving. I imagine he would continue to climb and keep active in other ways, but he doesn't fully retire. It's just not in the man's nature.

After giving this years of thought, I've narrowed things down to two possibilities. Let's assume that Spock became an ambassador and that McCoy continued in Starfleet, eventually heading up Starfleet Medical. However, Scotty went into transporter purgatory and Kirk didn't get stuck in plot contrivance purgatory, either.

Captain Kirk: Lone Explorer: I don't know how the financial side of things would work in the late 23rd century, but I imagine that Kirk could have bought a small starship of his own after retirement. I'm thinking of a ship roughly the size of the Syndey Class, like the U.S.S. Jenolan. It would have to be largely automated since Kirk would be traveling alone. In this scenario, Kirk would head "out there, that a way" and explore at his own leisure and discretion. He'd make time to keep up with old friends but I imagine he would one day disappear, his ultimate fate left unknown. There's no reason he couldn't live as long as McCoy or even longer.

Captain Kirk: Colony Command: I prefer this scenario a little more if only because I think Kirk would want to feel that he's continuing to make a difference and he can't do that in the same way on his own. He would retain his own starship but would lead colonists to their new homes and help them establish their colonies. This would keep him somewhat affiliated with Starfleet though he wouldn't answer to them directly. Kirk wouldn't settle down for the first decade or so, but he'd eventually marry and have a few children. However, he would never stay away from the center seat of his ship for long and as in the other scenario, he would perhaps disappear at some point, his final fate left to speculation and ultimately, legend.

As for what he'd name this ship, I have no idea. Enterprise seems too obvious, but at the same time, there's no reason he couldn't use the name for his personal vessel.

I'd love to read your ideas regarding James T. Kirk's ongoing adventures after TUC.
 
I, for one, would have been perfectly fine with leaving the fates of the TOS crew open ended. It would have been preferable to how they dealt with some of them. Not everything has to be answered.

Sulu has command of Excelsior and thats the last heard of him—fine. We can assume Chekov likely continued in Starfleet, but maybe not. Chapel and Rand were no longer part of the crew after TMP so we can assume they pursued their careers in Starfleet. Uhura is an open question. Same with Scotty although he could be involved in space propulsion research and development.

I don’t see McCoy staying long in Starfleet if he isn’t active at Kirk and Spock’s side. He could still have a rank of Admiral and participate in ceremonial roles resulting in him showing up in early TNG.

Spock leaves Starfleet, again, but now for different reasons. Like McCoy Starfleet isn’t for Spock unless he is active at Kirk’s side. I think they would undoubtedly stay in touch regularly.

I don’t think Kirk would be forced to retire. He wouldn’t be unique in preferring a ship rather than base or desk command, but not everyone can make the transition. So his fate could remain open ended.

In my own head canon the crew went on another 5-year mission after TMP. I prefer to imagine our heroes still out there. After that, though, their age could really come into play and they could start going their separate ways. I never cared for the Enterprise as a washed up cadet ship less than ten years after it was so extensively refit. And I found it hard to believe the entire group (most of them) would still be glued together overseeing cadets. This was a tenuous link to Harve Bennett’s Starfleet Academy idea which he (and likely he alone) has always liked.

Generally the remaining movies TWOK-TUC haven’t clicked for me for a very long time even though I saw each of them when they premiered. GEN is dumb.
 
Kirk does some academy lecturing, occasionally gets consulted by Starfleet Command and likes to remain in the loop.

I could imagine a situation where Kirk is happily semi-retired circa 2311, and there's an emergency communication coming in about an incident involving the Romulans.
 
Nanite technology, or something along those lines, makes aging and unchosen death a thing of the past. It also makes structural degradation obsolete. Defensive shields are exponentially upgraded, as a further consequence.

Our heroes and their ships can go on and on.

It's science fiction. There are always possibilities.
 
Kirk: mandatory retirement, couldn't be trusted by command, so useless as an admiral and too old to be in the captain's seat. He can't give up flying ships so he joins the ECS. Flies a DY1200 till he finally retires for good and writes his memoirs. Dies alone, as he predicted. By then he's in that awkward period where one is briefly forgotten and not yet remembered, having outlived his enemies but survived by most of his old friends.
 
While attempting to save the Enterprise from the cosmic Nexus, Captain James T. Kirk crawled into a Jeffries Tube and vanished.... He woke to find himself lost in time, facing mirror images that were not his own, and driven by an unknown force to change temporal realities for the better. His only guide on this journey is Kovich, a supervisor from a far future civilization of Travelers, who appears in the form of a hologram that only Kirk can see and hear. And so Captain Kirk finds himself leaping from life to life, striving to put right what had will have had went wrong, and hoping each time that his next leap will be the leap home…

Star Trek Legacy
 
I always liked the idea of Kirk somehow getting ahold of a small ship and going off either by himself or with Bones and/or Spock and being just a jack of all trades looking for adventure. Kinda like what they ended up doing with Rios in Picard S1.

Settling down with Carol after a reunification and living with her in some kind of scientific colony would be good too.

I also like the possibility of him retiring from active ship bound duty and returning to the Academy as a full or part time instructor.
 
I'll tell ya, I have tried to get through the Captain's novel trilogy, but have not made it through Captain's Glory yet, after several tries.
 
Heck, if we’re breaking with what happened onscreen anyway, change things further back. “Oh, Edith would be out of place in our time, Spock? That’s better than being dead.” So he takes her back with him to the 23rd century anyway. Either it works out and they end up married, and Kirk’s entire future life is changed; or it doesn’t work out, but she probably still turns out to be at least as resilient as a 1980s marine biologist might.

Yes, it messes up a classic story, but hey.
 
Okay, just to be flippant...

He actually returned to Earth, after his exposure to the wave in Generations. He regenerated into a young woman...

To his absolute horror, had to go through life as Dr Janice Lester. Playing out what he knew of her life...

The next one he regenerated into the Gorn Captain.

Then he spent 50,000 years as the mother horta...forgetting just about everything.

Hey... 50,000 years is a long time...
 
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If we ignore anything that came after TUC, my assumption would be that Kirk found a way to feel useful in retirement, unrestrained by the limitations of Starfleet. What that is, I don't know. Nor would I want to know. But, in my mind, he would've died whenever William Shatner dies plus 300 years. So, no matter what, I still think he'd be dead by TNG.

It would take a while for Kirk to figure out who he is without Starfleet, but he'd have eventually found a way to figure it out, once that option is permanently closed off to him and he comes to terms with it.
 
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Heck, if we’re breaking with what happened onscreen anyway, change things further back. “Oh, Edith would be out of place in our time, Spock? That’s better than being dead.” So he takes her back with him to the 23rd century anyway. Either it works out and they end up married, and Kirk’s entire future life is changed; or it doesn’t work out, but she probably still turns out to be at least as resilient as a 1980s marine biologist might.

Yes, it messes up a classic story, but hey.
As good as "City" is, it's more about drama than science fiction. If Edith had 'disappeared'....gone with Kirk into the future....it would have had the same effect as her death did.

Maybe it's time that I write the novel 'Baloney and a Hard Roll'. :devil:
 
The Enterprise-A flew straight into the sun and exploded in a bright flash at the end of TUC. All hands were lost. It also took out that star. I guess the destructive power of anti-matter reactors should not be underestimated.

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Kor
 
I, for one, would have been perfectly fine with leaving the fates of the TOS crew open ended. It would have been preferable to how they dealt with some of them. Not everything has to be answered.
Same here. The only cameo that remotely works for me is McCoy's, but I didn't need it and certainly didn't want to see Spock, Scotty, and Kirk so poorly treated. Spock deserved better though he got the best treatment of the three.
Sulu has command of Excelsior and thats the last heard of him—fine. We can assume Chekov likely continued in Starfleet, but maybe not. Chapel and Rand were no longer part of the crew after TMP so we can assume they pursued their careers in Starfleet. Uhura is an open question. Same with Scotty although he could be involved in space propulsion research and development.
I don't see Scotty retiring when there are new ships to be designed and built. I think he'd end up as head of Starfleet Research and Design.
I don’t see McCoy staying long in Starfleet if he isn’t active at Kirk and Spock’s side. He could still have a rank of Admiral and participate in ceremonial roles resulting in him showing up in early TNG.
Agreed, though he might take the gig as head of Starfleet Medical if he's sticking around on Earth anyway.
Spock leaves Starfleet, again, but now for different reasons. Like McCoy Starfleet isn’t for Spock unless he is active at Kirk’s side. I think they would undoubtedly stay in touch regularly.
Agreed. Not sure that Spock becomes an ambassador, either.
I don’t think Kirk would be forced to retire. He wouldn’t be unique in preferring a ship rather than base or desk command, but not everyone can make the transition. So his fate could remain open ended.
Of all the TOS characters, that's the fate that James T. Kirk deserved: his final fate lost to time and legend.
In my own head canon the crew went on another 5-year mission after TMP. I prefer to imagine our heroes still out there. After that, though, their age could really come into play and they could start going their separate ways. I never cared for the Enterprise as a washed up cadet ship less than ten years after it was so extensively refit. And I found it hard to believe the entire group (most of them) would still be glued together overseeing cadets. This was a tenuous link to Harve Bennett’s Starfleet Academy idea which he (and likely he alone) has always liked.
I'm relieved to see I'm not the only one who feels this way. Both of Myer's films pretend that the films that preceded them don't exist. Why would Kirk allow himself to be promoted again after all he went through to get the Enterprise back? Why would the Enterprise, less than ten years after being refit as one of the most state-of-the-art starships in the fleet, be a training vessel? I think it was an attempt at narrative shorthand to explain why these older characters were still together, but at the end of the day, it would have worked just as well if they were still active together and less time had transpired between TMP and TWOK. It also bugs me that Kirk turning fifty was treated, as McCoy said, "like a funeral." I'll be fifty next year and I'm nowhere near ready to start thinking of retirement or even seeing myself as "old." I think Kirk would be the same way.
Generally the remaining movies TWOK-TUC haven’t clicked for me for a very long time even though I saw each of them when they premiered. GEN is dumb.
Agreed. I love them because they were my Trek growing up, but a lot of the narrative choices failed the characters. I would have much preferred Phase Two so that we'd have had a true continuation of TOS. Generations is pure garbage and I just pretend now that it (and the other TNG films) don't exist.
 
I have always had VERY mixed feelings about the movies.

1) There is a lot of truth in what people say about 'Where Nomad Has Gone Before'.

2) Sequel to 'Space Seed' and only about half of it done well, if that.

3) A whole movie to bring Spock back.

4) Time travel to Earth's past, with no mention of the episodes where they were already there before.

5) Sort of 'The Alternative Factor' meets fake God.

6) Starfleet fighting rogue agents within its own ranks.

In large measure, it feels like a lot of wasted opportunities.

Heck, they could have taken a story like 'Beyond The Farthest Star', from TAS, and expanded on it. Where was that ship from? What happened?

Did any of the movies really get at the core idea of exploring the unknown? No. The first movie was drawn way out with visuals and then Nomadded. There's a new verb.

In the middle of all of that, neither Kirk nor any of the other characters advanced in ways that were very plausible as a follow-up to the series.
 
I have always had VERY mixed feelings about the movies.

1) There is a lot of truth in what people say about 'Where Nomad Has Gone Before'.

2) Sequel to 'Space Seed' and only about half of it done well, if that.

3) A whole movie to bring Spock back.

4) Time travel to Earth's past, with no mention of the episodes where they were already there before.

5) Sort of 'The Alternative Factor' meets fake God.

6) Starfleet fighting rogue agents within its own ranks.

In large measure, it feels like a lot of wasted opportunities.

Heck, they could have taken a story like 'Beyond The Farthest Star', from TAS, and expanded on it. Where was that ship from? What happened?

Did any of the movies really get at the core idea of exploring the unknown? No. The first movie was drawn way out with visuals and then Nomadded. There's a new verb.

In the middle of all of that, neither Kirk nor any of the other characters advanced in ways that were very plausible as a follow-up to the series.
All fair points, but I think a lot of it comes down to perspective. I saw the TOS Movies first, then TOS.

"The Changeling" is a good episode, but I prefer TMP's execution of the idea. It's not so much about who did it first, but who did it better.

I like "Space Seed" and it gives deeper insight into Khan, but enough information is provided in TWOK that you don't need to see it.

In TVH, they mentioned they time-travelled before using the sling-shot effect. I don't think they need to refer to any plot specifics about "Tomorrow Is Yesterday". If anything, I think TVH is like "Tomorrow Is Yesterday" from the opposite perspective. In "Tomorrow Is Yesterday", Captain Christropher is the fish out of water on the Enterprise. Whereas in TVH, Kirk and crew are the fishes out of water on Earth.

I do agree that there wasn't really much exploring in the TOS Movies. The Enterprise isn't really encountering anything it hasn't before. Other than a direct threat to Earth itself in TMP. But it's something I never thought about until after the fact. Watching the movies, without watching the series, it was all new to me. The Klingons, V'Ger, Khan, the introduction of Genesis. Nothing new about the 1980s but seeing the crew there was new. But to someone who watched TOS first, none of that was new, except Genesis, which I can understand why someone thinks that's wonky. Someone could also argue that idea of Genesis comes from the Bible, as McCoy sarcastically said. "According to myth, the Earth was created in six days. Now watch out. Here comes Genesis! We'll do it for you in six minutes!"
 
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