I remember it too. I'm pretty sure I even commented on both and not positively.
Why is toxic fandom destroying everything?
- Thread starter Sgt. Sacrament
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I love the movie. I just thought the move of killing him off with so little dialogue a disappointment.
The comforts weren't immediate but we got Christopher Lee to replace him as the Sith apprentice and Maul got to return in TCW, Rebels and Solo so there's those things.
The comforts weren't immediate but we got Christopher Lee to replace him as the Sith apprentice and Maul got to return in TCW, Rebels and Solo so there's those things.
Thankfully Dave Filoni and Sam Witwer turned him into something really complex and interesting.
I didn't need to see more of him, and it was pain to see him return. Thankfully, he had one of the best lightsaber duels, and poetic ends in all of Star Wars.
"Look at what you've become....living in the desert like a RAT."
"Look at what I've risen ABOVE."
"Look at what I've risen ABOVE."
I've heard people say stuff like that before, falling on the side of Han or Luke, or sometimes Leia; but my friends and I never had those discussions. We always looked at it as an ensemble cast--with maybe C3PO being a bit of a sidekick.
^ Yep, always looked at it as an ensemble cast as well, with R2 and C3P0 being the sidekicks. It was the journey together, not so much the destination...
I'm not saying it's not an ensemble, but it often got tiered out as to who was the preferred character that they liked, and Han usually won out.
I read an article the other day about the Obi-Wan vs Maul duel that pointed out something I didn't notice when I watched it, the movie that Maul does when Obi-Wan kills him, is the same move that he killed Qui-Gon with. So apparently somewhere in the years between their encounters, Obi-Wan figured out how to counter it.I didn't need to see more of him, and it was pain to see him return. Thankfully, he had one of the best lightsaber duels, and poetic ends in all of Star Wars.
I really enjoy the way Sam Witwer described it, because you see the growth of Obi-Wan in that scene. He immediately gets in to Clone Wars pose, then moves to a more defensive position, like we would see in A New Hope. Then, he decides to see if Maul can be baited to react and shifts his stance to like Qui-Gon.
And Maul falls for it. He hadn't grown; he had remained stuck in the past.
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But what valid criticisms? Everyone thinks their criticisms are valid but some of these people act very whiny and like vicitms when their criticisms are criticized
There is certainly toxic fandom but, after reading about the star of the Wicked movie and her reaction to a fan poster, I'm, starting think there's also toxic celebrity.
I'm done responding to you. I've already explained myself clearly and I'm not going repeat myself ad-nsauseum. You've got me pegged wrong and suggest you stop. You're not even barking up the right tree.
The biggest criticism are usually around writing, and characters. Those are the most common ones I see. The problem with the dialog that I see is two fold: one, people assume that their experience is universal. That there is some sort of objective standard that characters can abide by and therefore if they won't work then it must be true across the board. Then we end up in circles over whether or not a character is good or not and that detracts from the actual criticism. That doesn't negate the criticism as invalid.
Two, that low performance at the box office or viewership numbers is an indicator of quality. That has nothing to do with criticism but is often wielded as the silencer of dissenting opinion that because it's popular it must be good. Which, really isn't a good indicator one way or the other. It just happens to be the easiest to measure.
Criticism of art is sometimes difficult to nail down. People don't see things the same way, don't connect with characters, don't agree with writing. And criticism is tough because we as people tend to take it very personally, and respond like we've been personally insulted.
LOL, WTactualF? A fan modifies a poster to more closely reflect the famous Broadway poster, and Erivo calls it the "the wildest, most offensive thing I have seen?" The Gopper nominee for president regularly says stuff like a black person who doesn't support him should "have [their] head examined," but a random fan-made Internet image is "the wildest, most offensive thing" she's ever seen? One of the most popular black music stars of the past thirty years has just been charged with a litany of federal sex exploitation and assault crimes, but a random fan-made Internet image is "the wildest, most offensive thing" she's ever seen? She played freaking Harriet Tubman in a movie, and a random fan-made Internet image set her off?
That's not wokeness, that's toxic narcissism, celebrity or not.
^ Yeah, it's a very odd response to a fan-made poster that's supposed to be an homage to the original musical. When the musical first became popular, they also used that cover for the book that the musical is based on. It's been around for a very long time. And besides, I prefer it to the movie poster as it adds an air of mystery and elegance.
Her comments come across as an entitled Drama Queen, and suggests she's not so aware of the pop-culture behind the musical. Like get a grip, Lady, not everything is about you!
Her comments come across as an entitled Drama Queen, and suggests she's not so aware of the pop-culture behind the musical. Like get a grip, Lady, not everything is about you!
One of the recent observations I have (neither good or bad) is that there is a sense of cultural immediacy and media ignorance on the part of many nowadays. The lack of awareness of pop culture prior to the current generation of productions makes people think "Oh, this has never been done before!" type attitude that lends itself to the air of dramatics.
I shouldn't say its a new thing: I still laugh at the IMDB review of Lord of the Rings that accused Tolkien of ripping of J.K. Rowling. There's a certain lack of awareness to media history that I think gets put on display when people go "this is the worst thing to be done in media history!" (fill in whatever example you want here).
The truth is: it isn't. There's been far worse, people have been treated far worse, and this production is not the only production to ever exist.
I have a pet theory that Star Trek and Star Wars, having rumbled on for many decades now, have both been increasingly fighting against creative franchise stagnation that set in by the turn of the Millennia (and that co-incided with the Internet exploding out of its basal niche state, with all Hell breaking loose with it sometime during the Obama era).
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