By the same token, you can’t point to box office as a guarantee of quality either. So that’s a wash.
In the end it’s all subjective, right? You either like something or you don’t.
I don’t like TMP. In the final analysis….who cares?
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
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By the same token, you can’t point to box office as a guarantee of quality either. So that’s a wash.
In the end it’s all subjective, right? You either like something or you don’t.
I don’t like TMP. In the final analysis….who cares?
Agreed. Shatner had a deep understanding of not only his character, but Nimoy and Kelley's, too, to the point where all that had been built and developed between the three from two TV series and four movies felt like a natural exploration of their bond in TFF. Try finding even 5% of that in any of the other franchise entries (i.e., Berman/JJ/DISCO-Trek).
Same here.Kirk’s “I need my pain” speech is classic too.
I think TMP is the worst Star Trek movie of all time. I’d watch TFF on a continuous loop for days before sitting through TMP again.
I can go either way. It’s just not that important to me.
Given how often Starfleet changes uniforms over the course of five years I can gladly accept that the NCC-1701 switched back and forth between the TOS and SNW looks a couple of times.
Laundry day is rough.
Especially when you have to dodge construction personnel moving around deckplates.
McCoy was right about engineers loving to change things, Look at the engine room is TOS!
Even the transporter room changed details between the first and second pilot and then the regular series.
Data was the cold, emotionless one who had to learn humanity (in the way Spock had to get in touch with his suppressed human side). Moreover, when Pulaski was added to TNG, she was an undeniable McCoy clone, and who was the one crew member she locked horns with / challenged in the McCoy manner? Data, not Worf, or anyone else. All calculated, but it did not recapture the Spock/McCoy magic.
The Worf characterization had him often treated like a dumb, irrational Bigfoot the higher ups rarely listened to.
He didn’t though. He resisted and rejected it continually.
He certainly didn’t see the act of becoming more human as being some kind of endgame or goal in the way that Data did.
I’d also disagree that Data was cold, whilst further disagreeing that Spock was emotionless.
Part of the reason why it didn’t work is because Spock and Data are fundamentally different characters.
Spock was written as a wry, humorous individual who could give back to McCoy what he received. It didn’t work with Pulaski because Data is a hell of a lot more naive. It came over more like bullying.
But there… what else do you need? The reason they couldn’t pull another Spock/McCoy relationship out of Data/Pulaski is that Spock and Data are totally different characters. So far from being ‘clones’ that it’s not even funny.
Sure, sometimes. But often he would be in some situation in which human/starfleet values come into direct conflict with his Klingon side. Like Spock, when he’s written well, he’s the crew member who straddles two worlds but lives fully in neither.
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Illogical. Illogical. All units relate. All units. Norman, coordinate.So just to be clear...
You love Star Trek V: The Final Frontier...
...But you hate Star Trek: The Motion Picture!?
Save for all the times they varied and changed and looked completely different, i.e. Kruge looks nothing like those Klingons and the only connective tissue is music.
Ultimately, it comes down to entertainment. And if the entertainment is boring then no amount of justifying, like establishing a certain look, music, themes, or box office, will make it less boring.
Not quite; throughout the three seasons of TOS, he did open up emotionally in defining ways relevant to his bonds with humans, though not limited to:
"Where No Man Has gone Before": Spock--despite spending most of this second pilot coldly pushing Kirk to murder Gary Mitchell, the episode ended with a revealing admission:
"I felt for him, too."
Even during this early stage, Spock was not completely suppressing emotions, as much as he tried, and part of his disease-induced honesty as seen in "The Naked Time" proved strong feelings were there (his love for his mother, friendship with Kirk), and it was emotionally draining on him to suppress those feelings.
"Amok Time": Spock is quite open in recognizing Kirk and McCoy as his friends, and--the following is key--after the effects of Ponn Farr had passed, his reaction to seeing Kirk alive was--as McCoy so accurately described it--"...an emotional scene that would have brought the house down!"
Late in season 2, we have "Bread and Circuses", where Spock and McCoy--after surviving the first round of gladiator fights--have this exchange:
McCoy: "Do you know why you're not afraid to die, Spock? You're more afraid of living. Each day you stay alive is just one more day you might slip and let your human half peek out. That's it, isn't it? Insecurity. Why, you wouldn't know what to do with a genuine, warm, decent feeling."
Spock: "Really, Doctor?"
McCoy: "I know. I'm worried about Jim, too."
Spock is unambiguous here--about having--as McCoy described it--a "genuine, warm, decent feeling"--with his "Really", which was--as McCoy correctly concluded--Spock worrying about Kirk.
During season three's "For the World is Hollow, and I Have Touched the Sky", we see Spock gently supportive of McCoy (recovering from the Oracle's punishment):
McCoy: "Oh, that Oracle really got to me. I must be especially susceptible to its magic spells."
(McCoy notices Spock's help and behavior toward him)
Kirk: "Spock knows."
Spock's feelings for McCoy were so strong, he did not need to utter a word with the expression on his face, and his helpful nature. The overall point being that TOS Spock maintained a certain amount of his Vulcan stoicism, but he--if actively--tried to reject his emotions, the key examples of his open emotional behavior would have never come forward time and again, no matter the circumstance.
Well, you're acknowledging that Pulaski was used to be the McCoy clone to the one character placed in the Spock role: Data, which was my point about Data's role on TNG.
Works for me. Citizen Kane was even more mind-numbingly boring than TMP. At least I have some actual reason to genuinely give a shit about Kirk, Spock and McCoy.
Whhhhaaaa???
Season 3 of TOS is a smoother, more entertaining rewatch than TNG Season 3, VOY Season 3, DSC Season 3 or PIC Season 3. The third year of TNG is either epic and deservedly memorable or largely meh or even forgettable.
TOS' final year has a few abysmal duds but it's generally a well-made season of network television and very memorable and burns its way into your DNA.
TOS' final year has a few abysmal duds but it's generally a well-made season of network television and very memorable and burns its way into your DNA.
Heathen.
Respectfully.
Respectfully.
Controversial Opinions alright. In two pages, TOS Season 3 went from underrated to overrated!
I think It's a better season than is usually given credit for but not to the point where I'm like, "It's SOOOOO much better than everything else!!!"
I think It's a better season than is usually given credit for but not to the point where I'm like, "It's SOOOOO much better than everything else!!!"
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