I’ve also noticed: At least in its earlier seasons, Classic Doctor Who had pretty much the same values that I see classic Star Trek as having — and likewise somewhat moved away from them over time, rather more than Trek did (because I’d argue that most of current streaming Trek still holds to them, whereas DW doesn’t necessarily). I could be wrong, though — though I’ve watched most of DW over (a very, very long) time, I haven’t rewatched it nearly as much as I have ST.
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
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Honestly, like Trek, I think it really depends on the story. More recent Doctors had a lot more introspective stories at times, inviting the Doctor to really determine what drives him forward in his adventures. I think Star Trek does the same, sometimes allowing things to not go well to ask the question of "Why" and "How" to intervene, rather than the old assumptions that intervention automatically meant a positive outcome.
It's also interesting to explore the idea of an ideal. The idea that "This is Star Trek to espouse the ideal" is a fascinating one, because not even Trek characters live up to that ideal often in the stories. We see struggle and failure and disappointment. I think modern Trek is dismissed as more action oriented, but what gets ignored are those moments that the character chooses, despite what they would prefer to do in an ideal place.
I read through the rest of the thread and had to come back to this:
In episodes like this, and Spock's sacrifice in TWOK, David's and Kirk's sacrifice in SFS, Sybok's sacrifice in TFF, the sacrifice they're willing to, and too often Do make, IS the ideal. That sacrifice to save lives is Spock's favorite axiom come to life. IRL there are people that do this every day, and too few of them are hailed as heroes. That's why ideals put on display like this in our entertainment is important.
I would hardly call David's death a willing sacrifice. Even though Saavik says in The Voyage Home that he gave his life to save Spock, the actual scenes in the previous film don't depict that. Instead, he is murdered on Kruge's orders, without concern or conscience.
David gave his life to save Saavik who was about to be killed instead.
I disagree about David.
The Klingon was about to kill Saavik. David heard the blade open up as he was about to plunge it into her, and then he attacked the Klingon. Obviously, he was probably hoping to disarm him and save them, but he had to know that the possibility of him getting killed so the others can live was very high.
So he absolutely was sacrificing himself.
The Klingon was about to kill Saavik. David heard the blade open up as he was about to plunge it into her, and then he attacked the Klingon. Obviously, he was probably hoping to disarm him and save them, but he had to know that the possibility of him getting killed so the others can live was very high.
So he absolutely was sacrificing himself.
You weren't paying attention. It was Saavik who was picked to be killed. David intervened and was killed instead. David died saving a life, a heroes death.
Let the evidence speak for itself:
David stepped in to protect Saavik and Spock. End of story. Did he know he was about to die? Doubt it. But he willingly risked his very life to keep Saavik from being murdered in cold blood.
I'm curious to see if we can fill a whole page with correcting @Moviefan2k4 about David sacrificing his life to save Saavik.
If it had been Kirstie Alley he would have remembered.
If it had been Kirstie Alley he would have remembered.
Who?
Travis Mayweather
Like ENT had an adult contemporary soft-rock song...
... I bet SFA has a hip-hop or 2020s pop song as the intro.
Calling it now.
... I bet SFA has a hip-hop or 2020s pop song as the intro.
Calling it now.
"Belief In The Spleen."
I've always wished the powers that be would totally rethink the soundtrack of one of the series. Not just the intro, but the underlying themes used in episodes, because I think if you really wanted to "reinterpret" Star Trek, the music is one way to differentiate the tone.Like ENT had an adult contemporary soft-rock song...
... I bet SFA has a hip-hop or 2020s pop song as the intro.
Calling it now.
It's all either very background, forgettable orchestral music or variations of stuff we've heard before. And I know they got a lot of backlash when Enterprise tried contemporary music in the intro or attempted stuff like getting Rihanna to do a music video for Star Trek Beyond, but something like Michael Giacchino's "Enterprising Young Men" for Star Trek (2009) I think goes a long way in setting the tone for that film.
I saw a YouTube video one time where someone scored the battle in DS9's "Call to Arms" with Bear McCreary's "Prelude to War" from Battlestar Galactica and it shifts the tone of the scene.
I mean even animated stuff like Final Space and Rick & Morty have used their soundtracks and inserted contemporary music in really good ways to accentuate the drama.
Paul Reubens would have approved!
"Pain in the Chest."
Cee Lo Green as a Star Trek guest star? Now THAT'S a controversial Star Trek opinion!
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