DS9: A Stitch in Time audio book petition

[Therin of Andor]

Commercially-viable unabridged books weren't possible until about 2004.

In the same year, we got:

An abridged version of "Vulcan's Soul, Book 1: Exodus" by Josepha Sherman and Susan Shwartz, read by Boyd Gaines, published by Simon & Schuster Audioworks, 2004, 240 min. Abridged by George Truett. (Sales were seemingly insufficient to go ahead with the next two books.)

and

unabridged, read by Richard Poe, published by Recorded Books, 2004, 510 min. At around $46 each, they were prohibitively expensive at the time. IIRC, you could buy access to the download and create your own compact discs. but the new tech allowed them to go ahead with the sequel books in 2006 and 2007.

Amazon eventually took on distribution of the Recorded Books' unabridged titles, slashing prices for the three "Vulcan's Soul" instalments to $12-$25 each. Options included keeping a digital file, burning the downloads to CD, or purchasing the ten-disk sets that were pressed mainly for public libraries and visually-impaired communities. Last time I looked, these files for those books were no longer available. By S&S Audio wasn't in the unabridged Trek market at the time.

Now, if an abridged "Star Trek" title was to come out today, sure, it would be considered "half-assed", but pre-2004, Simon & Schuster Audioworks were doing excellent work. That helped to drive the consumer interest in audio books.

 

[Christopher]

For my mileage, a 90-minute audio production, with or without a writer’s modest consent (what are they going to do, not take the money), is a half-assed audiobook, regardless whether or not they get the entire cast back for it.

That's really unfair, an argument from privilege -- the privilege of living in an era when the nature of commercial media makes unabridged audiobooks feasible. As Therin says, back then, it wouldn't have been reasonable to expect most consumers to be willing to buy an unabridged audiobook spanning maybe 6-8 separate cassette tapes or more. The default definition of an audiobook was simply different then, due to the limitations of the technology. You might as well accuse the makers of Bride of Frankenstein of doing a "half-assed" job because it wasn't in full color with CGI visual effects.

It would be one thing to say you were disappointed in the result and preferred something unabridged. But using the word "half-assed," meaning incompetent, careless, or desultory, makes it an insult toward the creators instead of the creation, and that's crossing a line. It's grossly unfair and spoiled to accuse people of carelessness or incompetence when they did the best job they could given the parameters they were working under.

 

[Arpy]

That's really unfair, an argument from privilege -- the privilege of living in an era when the nature of commercial media makes unabridged audiobooks feasible. As Therin says, back then, it wouldn't have been reasonable to expect most consumers to be willing to buy an unabridged audiobook spanning maybe 6-8 separate cassette tapes or more. The default definition of an audiobook was simply different then, due to the limitations of the technology. You might as well accuse the makers of Bride of Frankenstein of doing a "half-assed" job because it wasn't in full color with CGI visual effects.

It would be one thing to say you were disappointed in the result and preferred something unabridged. But using the word "half-assed," meaning incompetent, careless, or desultory, makes it an insult toward the creators instead of the creation, and that's crossing a line. It's grossly unfair and spoiled to accuse people of carelessness or incompetence when they did the best job they could given the parameters they were working under.

Well, my enthusiasm (and yours) aside, many unabridged books were available at the time, they just cost more. Many fans would have shelled out the extra cash (I would have for my favorites), and libraries (where I generally begin my searches at) also carry or can order for free audiobooks from anywhere in the country.

Additionally, unsatisfactory productions, regardless of whether they’re the finest of their day, can remain unsatisfactory. There are many brand spanking expansive and new movies, series, games, and more out now or in production that are not of interest to me for what they otherwise could be, for a bit more money or the same with some changes. It’s a matter of priorities. Again, your mileage may vary, mine is this. I don’t need a famous actor reading the book (especially if they’re not right for it); I just need the whole book.

 

[Christopher]

Additionally, unsatisfactory productions, regardless of whether they’re the finest of their day, can remain unsatisfactory.

Sure, but it's when you use the word "half-assed" that I object, because that's not about the product, it's impugning the professionalism and care of the creators, and that's just unwarranted. There's a huge difference between a critique of a work and an insult to its creators.

 

[Arpy]

Sure, but it's when you use the word "half-assed" that I object, because that's not about the product, it's impugning the professionalism and care of the creators, and that's just unwarranted. There's a huge difference between a critique of a work and an insult to its creators.

Well, it depends which “creators” you’re talking about. I have little issue with the artists (writers, designers, allied executives) involved but I do, yes, take issue with those in charge who prioritized an, again, to me unsatisfactory (half-assed) product over the actual book.

And to bring it back to Andrew Robinson reading more of those books that did not get an audio production or a full unabridged one, I’d be ecstatic if contemporary low-cost technologies and a new generation of audiobook makers could make that happen for all the existing and untapped listeners out there of Star Trek content.

 

[Christopher]

I do, yes, take issue with those in charge who prioritized an, again, to me unsatisfactory (half-assed) product over the actual book.

I still think that's imposing an unreasonable expectation given the nature of the market at the time. Just because some unabridged audiobooks existed back then doesn't mean they were the default or that it would've been profitable to do Star Trek audios that way.

 

[Arpy]

Moving on, for me I think the dream project would be to do audio versions of the DS9 Relaunch. Say “phase one” could be from Avatar to Unity. They could all be read by the same actor and be part of a reprinting of the lot in special editions.

For some one-offs, I think top of my list might be The Never-Ending Sacrifice (if they could find a mature enough voice for the reading) and Dark Mirror, which I haven’t read in nearly 30 years but remember loving.

What would be some books you’d like to listen to?

 

[USS Firefly]

What would be some books you’d like to listen to?

I don't listen to audio books, but I meet you half way. I still want a book about the Federation and Cardassian war. So a paperback and an audio book about the war, narrated by Patrick Stewart and Andrew Robinson

 

[Lynx]

I doubt that he will read Second Self after what happens in that book.

Spoiler: Garak

Garak is totally destroyed and ruined as a character in that book and then killed off.

 

[Relayer1]

Can we start a petition to get the CD version released in the UK now please ?

 

[Tosk]

Can we start a petition to get the CD version released in the UK now please ?

Can't you just import it?

 

[Relayer1]

Can't you just import it?

Not from Amazon. They won't ship it.

 

[Tuskin38]

Spoiler: Garak

Garak is totally destroyed and ruined as a character in that book and then killed off.

He isn't ruined at all.

 

[Tosk]

Not from Amazon. They won't ship it.

If it's not an Amazon exclusive then surely the solution is to buy it from somewhere else?

I'm not trying to be a dick (I also live in a not-America country, so I totally understand the annoyance/cost of having to import) but it seems like it'd be a lot easier to hunt down a copy than to wait or petition for a UK release.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Can we start a petition to get the CD version released in the UK now please ?

Is this not for UK?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Stitch-Tim...3&psc=1&mcid=205460fdbce43b348a374dd3c716ec0b

Okay, says "unavailable", but this is the placeholder for the UK edition for the CDs. Not sure of the problem. Australia was a little behind USA, but the actual discs came via USA anyway, I think.

To me, it looks like the digital download is there?

 

[Lynx]

He isn't ruined at all.

I think that he's totally destroyed in the book Second Self.

 

[RonG]

I think that he's totally destroyed in the book Second Self.

Seriously, *how* is he destroyed?
The character goes through developments years after last seen on screen (and in the alternate Fisrt Splinter timeline).

First, even if you don't like the direction - how do these developments affect any previous story about the character?

Second, that does not mean that the character cannot appear in future stories, set throughout the established lifetime, and as I understand, he's set to appear in an upcoming novel set before the DS9 series.

Nothing has been destroyed.. you just read something you didn't like or connect with - happens to somebody every day.

 

[Lynx]

Seriously, *how* is he destroyed?
The character goes through developments years after last seen on screen (and in the alternate Fisrt Splinter timeline).

First, even if you don't like the direction - how do these developments affect any previous story about the character?

Second, that does not mean that the character cannot appear in future stories, set throughout the established lifetime, and as I understand, he's set to appear in an upcoming novel set before the DS9 series.

Nothing has been destroyed.. you just read something you didn't like or connect with - happens to somebody every day.

First of all, he's made more worse than he ever was in the series or other books, almost like some Nazi war criminal.

Second, he's ruined as a character by transformed into a Bajoran who lives the rest of his life among Bajorans. No offense to the Bajorans themselves but the proud Cardassian patriot GHarak would never do that.

Third, he's killed off and dumped out of future storytelling like some piece of garbage.

OK, there could poissibly be a lot of novels about Garak before the events in the series DS9. But there's always the risk that the events there contradicts what happened in the series or previous books. Will he be revealed as some 24th century Doctor Mengele in those books or what?

And there will be no novels about Garak in the future timeline after 2357 (or 2399 or whatever).

 

[RonG]

First of all, he's made more worse than he ever was in the series or other books, almost like some Nazi war criminal..

I can actually relate to the crux of this point - Garak was not previously portrayed as a main part of the Cardassian occupation. However, since he was in office, this was more him being a symbol of the Cardassian past, as well as his revealed actions in the past.

Second, he's ruined as a character by transformed into a Bajoran who lives the rest of his life among Bajorans. No offense to the Bajorans themselves but the proud Cardassian patriot GHarak would never do that.
Third, he's killed off and dumped out of future storytelling like some piece of garbage.

This story is supposed to be the 'last Garak story' chronologically - since Trek novels (and TV, actually) are not stricly progressing (in real or fiction time), there can certainly be stories with Garak in the future (exactly as there will be stories with other Trek characters who died on the screen or in novels and comics.

OK, there could poissibly be a lot of novels about Garak before the events in the series DS9. But there's always the risk that the events there contradicts what happened in the series or previous books. Will he be revealed as some 24th century Doctor Mengele in those books or what? .
And there will be no novels about Garak in the future timeline after 2357 (or 2399 or whatever).

You raise several commplaints really unrelated to one another.
1. No 'new' events will contradict the tv series.. that's the basic rule of tie-in fiction
2. If future revealed events show Garak as less-than-saintly.. isn't that pretty much suggested from what *is* known about Garak? I would actually be surprised if he is shown to be a true 'hero' figure in future books...
3. After 2399? there would be very few novels set after 2399 *at all*, as this is one of the 'current' timeframes for Trek.. But books set during Garak's life? pplenty of room and potential there..
Garak's actually *on the cover* of Dayton Ward's next Trek novel.. Far from 'destroyed'...

 

[Tosk]

almost like some Nazi war criminal.

As opposed to the space Gestapo that he actually was?