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Paramount working on DS9 HD?

I was hoping for similar on TOS remaster, did they have to keep every ship a Connie when there are "only 12 like it in the fleet"?
Actually, they kind of did yeah. Budget was only one factor in why the Constellation in The Doomsday Machine was Constitution class. There was also dramatic reason for it, being this is a ship identical to the Enterprise with every advantage it had, yet it got completely owned by this titular Doomsday Machine, which ups the stakes for the Enterprise in this episode.

Then there's the war game fleet in The Ultimate Computer, which is stated in dialogue to have a combined total of 1600 personnel in it, suggesting the writers intended all four of those ships to be Constitution class with crews of 400 each.

I suppose the Defiant in The Tholian Web didn't actually have to be a Constitution, but by the time TOSR came around we already had Enterprise's MU two parter which stuck with the Defiant being a Constitution, so TOSR had no choice in the matter.
 
I myself hope they will remaster all the battle scenes to remove all the old Excelsiors, Mirandas, K’T’ingas and BoPs and replace them with newer designs. But something tells me that’s not on their radar.
Problem there is there's also charts on computer displays which show icons for Excelsior and Miranda class ships being part of the fleets, like this admittedly blurry example. So if they did replace ships in the fleets, they'd also have to alter those charts.
 
For a series finale it definitely deserved better especially when they gave us such great battles in previous seasons, there was anticipation that the finale space battle would be amazing. It did kinda spoil my enjoyment of the last episode. It's up there with the reused Klingon Bird of Prey explosion in Star Trek Generations.

I recall an interview (I can offer little more in the way of details save that it was not too long after the finale aired) that spoke to this. The Fire Caves sequence sucked a whack of $$$ out of the FX budget. At the time, Digital Muse and Foundation Imaging were the primary FX houses for Trek. Digital Muse were tasked with the new space battle sequences, while Foundation Imaging were put to work on the Fire Caves.

I would rather they'd gone a cheaper route with the Fire Caves, personally. There had been plenty of examples of more practical FX used throughout the series to create a similar effect (e.g. The Badlands).
 
I suppose the Defiant in The Tholian Web didn't actually have to be a Constitution, but by the time TOSR came around we already had Enterprise's MU two parter which stuck with the Defiant being a Constitution, so TOSR had no choice in the matter.
The interiors were just like a Connie's, tho. ;)
 
I wonder who has all the higher detail CG models Eaglemoss has had made over the years.

Picard Season 2 used their Steamrunner model.

I hope there are copies around. The late Fabio Passaro, who did, I believe, the majority of the CG work for Eaglemoss, used Lightwave, same as the original VFX team. If they tried to reassemble that group, get their hands on as many of the original scene files as still exist, having many of the models already in the same format would give them a leg up. I assume he turned in the final versions of the models that he updated along with the renders.

The way I see it, creatively, they have a few options, from least to most invasive. For the sake of argument, we'll assume they have a comprehensive record of every CG shot from the show as-is.

1. Straight re-render. Use a vintage version of Lightwave, just load up the old scenes, change the camera setting from 720x480 to 1920x1080, hit "render," and Bob's your uncle. Tom Smith did this with several original CGI shots from Babylon 5.

2. Mild updates for resolution. Keep the scenes the same, but replace the models with more detailed versions where the seams would start to show in HD. Most of the Eaglemoss models were detailed up for print, as were others used in the Ships of the Line calendars, so there are already offically-made drop-in options for several of the CG ships (and that would improve consistency, such as replacing the droopy-nose Defiant model and the Mirandas with impulse engines instead of torpedo bays). Perhaps replace lower-resolution effects, as well, like explosion elements. Put names on all the blank Galaxy and Excelsior class ships. Basically the TNG-R approach.

3. Bigger updates for modernization. Update the scenes and models for the newer versions of Lightwave which use a much more realistic lighting and surfacing system. Adjust lighting and effects for pop, and use a more modern post-production workflow. "What We Left Behind" seems to be a mix between "2" and "3." The models seem to be all the same, but the style was modernized (the HD versions of the shots actually predate the modernization of Lightwave's render, they were made independently years before the documentary entered production).

4. Tweak the shots. More variety of ships in fleet scenes, replace reused footage with new shots. Dealer's choice if you want to restrict yourself to just designs that already existed but weren't available to the CG team at the time, or retcon in ships that weren't designed yet IRL but would've existed in-universe, like the Valdore, the California, the Parliament, maybe the Excelsior II, the Reliant-style Ambassador variant that wasn't in "The Pegasus," and so on. Likewise, if you want to make Ron Moore happy, it's your choice as to whether marking the second Defiant as "NCC-74205-A" fits under this or 2.

5. Full TOS-R. Redo everything from scratch, worry about matching the spirit of the shot and not the letter. I don't think anyone really wants this.

I'd go for option four, myself. The show should look it's best, remastering the film will already cause a massive increase in production-value, the VFX should get some polish to keep up. Adding a postage-stamp-sized Constitution-refit or Ambassador zipping around in "Sacrifice of Angels," or the Romulans having more than one kind of ship at a time, will just make nerds happy and no one else will care.

Then there's the war game fleet in The Ultimate Computer, which is stated in dialogue to have a combined total of 1600 personnel in it, suggesting the writers intended all four of those ships to be Constitution class with crews of 400 each.

Okuda talked about how they briefly considered having some of the ships in "The Ultimate Computer" be different designs, but decided that 40 years of inertia with them being known as Constitution-class ships wasn't something they could push aside. They didn't even make the Intrepid a new design, and we'd never actually seen that one in TOS, it was entirely assumption that it was a Connie.
 
Problem there is there's also charts on computer displays which show icons for Excelsior and Miranda class ships being part of the fleets, like this admittedly blurry example. So if they did replace ships in the fleets, they'd also have to alter those charts.

I doubt they’d be that anal retentive about blurry background displays, unless they were focused on directly. But again, I really don’t see them spending any more time than they need with recreating the battles. Why make new designs when they can just use things like the Eaglemoss and STO assets?
 
I hope there are copies around. The late Fabio Passaro, who did, I believe, the majority of the CG work for Eaglemoss, used Lightwave, same as the original VFX team. If they tried to reassemble that group, get their hands on as many of the original scene files as still exist, having many of the models already in the same format would give them a leg up. I assume he turned in the final versions of the models that he updated along with the renders.

The way I see it, creatively, they have a few options, from least to most invasive. For the sake of argument, we'll assume they have a comprehensive record of every CG shot from the show as-is.

1. Straight re-render. Use a vintage version of Lightwave, just load up the old scenes, change the camera setting from 720x480 to 1920x1080, hit "render," and Bob's your uncle. Tom Smith did this with several original CGI shots from Babylon 5.

2. Mild updates for resolution. Keep the scenes the same, but replace the models with more detailed versions where the seams would start to show in HD. Most of the Eaglemoss models were detailed up for print, as were others used in the Ships of the Line calendars, so there are already offically-made drop-in options for several of the CG ships (and that would improve consistency, such as replacing the droopy-nose Defiant model and the Mirandas with impulse engines instead of torpedo bays). Perhaps replace lower-resolution effects, as well, like explosion elements. Put names on all the blank Galaxy and Excelsior class ships. Basically the TNG-R approach.

3. Bigger updates for modernization. Update the scenes and models for the newer versions of Lightwave which use a much more realistic lighting and surfacing system. Adjust lighting and effects for pop, and use a more modern post-production workflow. "What We Left Behind" seems to be a mix between "2" and "3." The models seem to be all the same, but the style was modernized (the HD versions of the shots actually predate the modernization of Lightwave's render, they were made independently years before the documentary entered production).

4. Tweak the shots. More variety of ships in fleet scenes, replace reused footage with new shots. Dealer's choice if you want to restrict yourself to just designs that already existed but weren't available to the CG team at the time, or retcon in ships that weren't designed yet IRL but would've existed in-universe, like the Valdore, the California, the Parliament, maybe the Excelsior II, the Reliant-style Ambassador variant that wasn't in "The Pegasus," and so on. Likewise, if you want to make Ron Moore happy, it's your choice as to whether marking the second Defiant as "NCC-74205-A" fits under this or 2.

5. Full TOS-R. Redo everything from scratch, worry about matching the spirit of the shot and not the letter. I don't think anyone really wants this.

I'd go for option four, myself. The show should look it's best, remastering the film will already cause a massive increase in production-value, the VFX should get some polish to keep up. Adding a postage-stamp-sized Constitution-refit or Ambassador zipping around in "Sacrifice of Angels," or the Romulans having more than one kind of ship at a time, will just make nerds happy and no one else will care.



Okuda talked about how they briefly considered having some of the ships in "The Ultimate Computer" be different designs, but decided that 40 years of inertia with them being known as Constitution-class ships wasn't something they could push aside. They didn't even make the Intrepid a new design, and we'd never actually seen that one in TOS, it was entirely assumption that it was a Connie.

Regarding the Intrepid, why would the Vulcans settle for a lesser starship design than Starfleet was using for human-crewed starships?
 
I'm also among those who will gladly pony up the cash to buy a new HD remaster of DS9 on disc when it comes out. I can only hope they get Ira Steven Behr and Roger Lay onboard to create new VAM featurettes.

That being said, I'm dismayed that there are folks wanting a special edition version of the series, which doesn't seem practical. And let's also remember this is Paramount we're talking about. I heavily doubt they'll go with a bidder that has a budget which includes the time and expense needed to completely redo, reimagine, and redirect the VFX shots.
 
Cautiously excited for this, and I don't want to let myself get carried away as this news is the exact opposite of what we've been told over the years. :vulcan:
 
I hope it happens. It's a venerable TV-show that's part of a venerable franchise and it still has a fanbase. A lot of work went into the show and for much of its run, it's the best that this era of Star trek ever produced.

Fingers crossed!
 
I’m surprised VOY didn’t get shopped around first.

I also wouldn’t be surprised if VOY has already been shopped around.

I suspect we might see both done and rolled out for the anniversary in 2026. They need something for the anniversary and I’d eat my hat (if I had a hat) if Paramount get Kelvin 4 into cinemas in time.
 
I’m surprised VOY didn’t get shopped around first.

I also wouldn’t be surprised if VOY has already been shopped around.

I suspect we might see both done and rolled out for the anniversary in 2026. They need something for the anniversary and I’d eat my hat (if I had a hat) if Paramount get Kelvin 4 into cinemas in time.

Just addressing your earlier post re: derisive comments. Why? It's not disrespectful towards anyone involved in the production of the show. The fact is, if you have a modern screen north of 50", you're going to have pretty crappy image when viewing DS9 in its SDR format.

When we purchased our first 4K HDR screen a couple of years back, I watched Lord of the Rings and a couple of X-Men movies in 4K / HDR - it was stunning. On a whim, I decided to see what the glorious CGI mayhem of Sacrifice of Angels would look like. It was a rude surprise to see how poor the quality of the episode was on my fancy new TV.

Eventually, 4K (and higher) will be ubiquitous. All modern content is in HD at a minimum. We're accustomed to higher definition now. Unfortunately, for older shows - particularly those with CGI FX pre-HD... they don't come off well.

Secondly, re: VOY getting first dibs on a remaster: how dare you.
 
Think again.

Same here.

Now, I’m not asking for George Lucas levels of insanity for DS9-R. I just want the ship battle scenes, if they have to be recreated, to just show more diversity in ship design than what was originally shown due to budgetary and time concerns. And I want new footage for the series finale instead of stock footage from a previous battle. Heck, I would have liked to have a completely new design for the Defiant-A, but unfortunately that ship sailed when they showed it in the Starfleet Museum in PIC.
 
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