Dating Picard

[Lord Hobbers]

Alas, I don't mean going on a date with Jean-Luc! I was just looking to engage with a discussion about when the Star Trek Picard series is set.

So, we can definitely say that Season One is in 2399, because it says so quite clearly on screen and we are also told that it takes place fourteen years after 2385. In fact, we can also assume it takes place in the summer of 2399, because in episode 3 Picard tells Zhaban that it is a month until the harvest (which tends to be around September).

And with Season Three we have been given a specific stardate (78183.10), which sets the events of the current season around April 2401 (even though this is potentially problematic for Jack's age, unless we assume he is 21 or 22 and just didn't want to correct Picard when he guessed he was 23 or 24).

That just leaves Season Two. Memory Alpha lists Season Two as also being set in 2401, but that just doesn't make sense. In Season Three, Raffi says she has been undercover on M'Talas Prime for "months". We also see that Seven has been through her intensive command training programme and been commissioned as a commander, and Picard has once again retired. I cannot buy that Season Two and Three all take place within a few weeks of each other, in the first four months of 2401.

I know that the wine bottles during the harvest scene in Season Two have 2401 printed on them, but this would imply that Season Two is set five months after Season Three (September 2401)! We also have Picard's line telling us that Zhaban has been dead for "eighteen months", which if we assume he died at the same time as Picard in Season One, the earliest Season Two could be set is December 2400 or January 2401, but if it is set in winter then why is Picard harvesting the grapes? Season Two must be set between August to October (in whatever year it is) or else they wouldn't be harvesting the grapes to make wine.

We also have the scene of Rios in the ICE jail, in which he says that the Stargazer is from the year 2400 (which makes much more sense). Since this is dialogue spoken on screen, I tend to give this a little more weight.

So, in conclusion, in my head canon, this is where I place the Picard seasons:

Season One - Summer 2399

Season Two - Autumn (or Fall as I believe it is called in the US) 2400

Season Three - Spring 2401

This seems to me to allow all the events stated to have happened between seasons to actually happen.

Does anyone else have any thoughts on this?

FYI, this is not a nit-pick or a whinge about the show - just a genuine question about what people's thoughts are on the show's timeline.

 

[Tuskin38]

I agree, 100%

 

[Christopher]

I'm convinced that this season was intended to be set during 2407 (as initially claimed on Twitter) when it was filmed, and then someone realized that that date didn't work for the 250th Frontier Day, so they bumped it back in post-production to 2401, creating serious continuity problems with Jack's age and the timing of season 2. Naturally the stardates, which are only heard in voiceover narration, could have been changed in post-production.

One other factor that doesn't make sense if it's just months after season 2 is Seven being a commander and first officer in Starfleet, when she was only just starting in Starfleet at the end of season 2. Between that and all the rest, bumping it back to 2401 (presuming that's what happened) is a "fix" that created far more problems than it solved.

Season Two - Autumn (or Fall as I believe it is called in the US) 2400

We call it both, though "autumn" is more formal.

 

[Lord Hobbers]

I'm convinced that this season was intended to be set during 2407 (as initially claimed on Twitter) when it was filmed, and then someone realized that that date didn't work for the 250th Frontier Day, so they bumped it back in post-production to 2401, creating serious continuity problems with Jack's age and the timing of season 2. Naturally the stardates, which are only heard in voiceover narration, could have been changed in post-production.

One other factor that doesn't make sense if it's just months after season 2 is Seven being a commander and first officer in Starfleet, when she was only just starting in Starfleet at the end of season 2. Between that and all the rest, bumping it back to 2401 (presuming that's what happened) is a "fix" that created far more problems than it solved.

This would certainly make sense that it was supposed to be a few years later, especially because the promotional material released beforehand stated that the Titan-A was launched in 2402. And I'd even seen suggestions of a 2411 setting for the season before it started!

The only thing that does fit well with the 2401 setting is the rift in Riker and Troi's marriage - having it be not so long after he rejoined Starfleet in Season One does make a little more sense than if there had been a longer gap. But other than that, a year or two later for the season would be much easier to square.

We call it both, though "autumn" is more formal.

Thank you, I was not aware of that.

 

[Tuskin38]

I'm convinced that this season was intended to be set during 2407 (as initially claimed on Twitter) when it was filmed

Huh, who said that?

 

[The Wormhole]

I remember RMB saying the season was supposed to be 2411 and that Frontier Day was the Federation's 250th anniversary, a claim Memory Alpha repeated at the start of the season. But this is the first I'm hearing of any claims that it was originally intended to be 2407.

We also have the scene of Rios in the ICE jail, in which he says that the Stargazer is from the year 2400 (which makes much more sense). Since this is dialogue spoken on screen, I tend to give this a little more weight.

Although I agree that it probably does make more since to place season 2 in 2400, I am going to point out Rios didn't actually say he was from 2400, but that the Stargazer was launched in that year.

 

[Christopher]

Huh, who said that?

I tried to track it down without success, but I found that the Instagram Star Trek Logs page asserts that the Titan-A was launched in 2402 after Riker's Titan was retired in 2398, and it was stated in the premiere that Shaw had commanded it for 5 years.

Because of Captains Saavik and Riker, the Titan’s legacy was continued with a brand-new starship, one that would retain its registry, but now with the “A” designation, an honor that is only given to a select few starships.

NCC-80102-A. Constitution III Class is referred to in Starfleet slang as Neo-Constitution Class. This new Titan is primarily an exploratory vessel, honoring the retro design of the Constitution Class II. Launched in 2402 under the command of Captain Liam Shaw. Work began on a refit using the original Titan space frame, however, with the development of cutting-edge technology, the Titan’s design changed mid-construction and a new ship took form. As per tradition, Starfleet engineers affectionately designated it as a refit, having kept much of the original Titan’s internal components.

https://www.dailystartreknews.com/r...aracters-have-been-up-to-in-the-last-20-years

Which would seem to confirm that setting the season in 2401 was not the original plan.

 

[Tuskin38]

Terry said the 2402 in the log was a mistake. I thought there was another log that gives a 2401 date, I don't remember which one.

 

[Lord Hobbers]

Although I agree that it probably does make more since to place season 2 in 2400, I am going to point out Rios didn't actually say he was from 2400, but that the Stargazer was launched in that year.

The actual line Rios says, when asked his occupation, is, "Captain, of the U.S.S. Stargazer. You wouldn't know it. It's a starship from the year 2400."

So not necessarily the launch date. I'd say that is more hinting at the year he has come from. For example, hypothetically speaking, in "Time's Arrow", if Picard had made a similar comment about being captain of the Enterprise, he would have said "it's a starship from the year 2370" because that's the year he came from, rather than "2364" when she was launched.

 

[Christopher]

Terry said the 2402 in the log was a mistake.

Which he would still probably have said if they retconned it after the fact, since the mistake would be that the unaltered version was allowed to come out. I still say the later setting makes enormously more sense in the context of everything in this season except the Frontier Day date.

 

[Dukhat]

Why they didn’t just make the date 2411 is beyond me. It would have matched Ed Speleers’s age more appropriately, made more sense for Seven to be a commander, and would have been the actual 250th anniversary of the founding of the Federation. Somebody dropped the ball here.

 

[fireproof78]

Terry probably had one date in his draft whenever he started this story (clearly not during Season 2). And the date just stuck through every draft.

YATI!

 

[Caeruleus]

2399 S1
2400 S2
2401 S3

 

[Yistaan]

We can't use 21st century farming methods to date the harvesting of grapes in the 25th century. Picard S2 takes place in January and S3 in April. Jack is 21 at most and didn't correct Picard on his age. Yes it's clunky. Yes the implausibility of Seven and Raffi switching careers within months has been pointed out to Matalas many times on social media. But he's the showrunner, and he gives the final word, and there's no hard screen contradictory evidence so as implausible as it is, there it is. We're the same fandom that has a chunk of us saying that the 1701 bridge was switched out and back between Q&A, Cage, and back again in Discovery/SNW after all.

If it really, really bothers you then you could say that Frontier Day is the 250th anniversary of the Coalition of Planets in 2155, but your headcanon probably won't last long as all official media and even non-canon tie ins will use the 2401 date going forward obviously (the 2402 launch date of Titan on Instagram was already retracted)

 

[Dar70]

I can't believe this is still bothering some people around here. Lmao

-Turbolift funhouse....no problem
-Everyone knows T'Pring before Amok Time.....No problem
- Spock has a sister.....No problem.
- Enterprise is now twice its original size ...No problem
- Klingons have four Nostrils ....No problem

Picard Says Jack is 23/24......he's actually 21
BIG PROBLEM.....

 

[fireproof78]

Turbolift funhouse....no problem
-Everyone knows T'Pring before Amok Time.....No problem
- Spock has a sister.....No problem.
- Enterprise is now twice its original size ...No problem
- Klingons have four Nostrils ....No problem

Why are these problems again?

The turbolift funhouse has no plot bearing at all. It's a dumb visual. It's on par with the faster transport in history in "The Menagerie." Annoying but not grievous.

"Everyone knows about T'Pring" yes at the time. Spock clearly serves with one or two or three different people by Amok Time.

Spock has a sister. Yes, and a brother. And his father is an ambassador. It's called drama.

Never heard the official size of the Enterprise on screen. So I never saw the problem.

Klingons have redundant organ systems. Previously established. Not a problem.

Jack is 21. Don't care.

This is making mountain out of a mitochondria.

 

[Dar70]

Why are these problems again?

The turbolift funhouse has no plot bearing at all. It's a dumb visual. It's on par with the faster transport in history in "The Menagerie." Annoying but not grievous.

"Everyone knows about T'Pring" yes at the time. Spock clearly serves with one or two or three different people by Amok Time.

Spock has a sister. Yes, and a brother. And his father is an ambassador. It's called drama.

Never heard the official size of the Enterprise on screen. So I never saw the problem.

Klingons have redundant organ systems. Previously established. Not a problem.

Jack is 21. Don't care.

This is making mountain out of a mitochondria.

I already know that you do not care about any of it. I'm talking about the people that do care about his age. It garners a whole thread. Yet the other issues I brought up people sweep it under the rug. As if it was always like that. So for THOSE people (not you) IT WAS ALWAYS LIKE THAT. JACK IS 21 HE WAS 16 AT THE BAR BUT HE JUST HAPPENS TO BE PLAYED BY A 34 YEAR OLD. If Arnold Jackson at 10 can be played by a 40 year old I don't see a problem....lol

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[fireproof78]

I already know that you do not care about any of it.

I'm going to stop you right there. I do care. I don't see it as a problem. There's a difference between the two and the cavalier dismissal is annoying that people don't care. No, they might care; they just don't see a problem.

 

[Dar70]

I'm going to stop you right there. I do care. I don't see it as a problem. There's a difference between the two and the cavalier dismissal is annoying that people don't care. No, they might care; they just don't see a problem.

I'm going to stop you right there. You DO NOT CARE about continuity or canon errors , rewrites, etc. You brush them off. You have no problem with them So AGAIN.....this is for the people that have a PROBLEM with Jacks age......Brush it all off like Fireproof. Ignore it. If you can accept a Turbolift interior that is 10 times the size of the ship (that was not a one of showing by the way), if you can accept Klingons with 4 nostrils and that T'pring and Chapel were best buddies and than Chapel forgot T'Pring existed 7 years later. It should be a cake walk to believe Jack is 21. Dear god people....lmao

 

[fireproof78]

Dear god people....lmao

With due respet, this is why I brush it off. Reactions like "lmao" are rude and disrespectful in this context.

I do care, more than you give me credit for. But, your mind is made up and I will not convince you otherwise.

Good day.