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What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?

From what I’ve seen, I think a lot of fans got overexcited by the mere fact SNW is episodic. The episodes themselves generally haven’t bowled me over yet (and two of them were fairly awful—the space pirate one and the one where the ship was transformed ala “Masks”).
 
Comparing 31 to the pooper is apt. It may be necessary, but I sure don’t want to spend an hour every week with my face in it.

YMMV in-universe or irl. You do you.
While I would find an S31 series far more interesting than... ah, the bodily orofice which I compared it to, that got a laugh out of me, so take my Like and be done with it. :lol:
 
SNW is really fun. It’s not great, but it’s just loads of fun. I think it appeals to me for the same reason LD appeals to others.

It had some missteps (“Lift Us Up Where Suffering Cannot Reach” was criminally mundane for this type of series, and “Serene Squall” was just….stupid and annoying) but everything else was pretty awesome. Also, it has the best cast of all the modern shows…hands down, and not a single eye-rolling/annoying character.

It’s not as engaging or risk-taking as DSC, or as epic and prestigious as PIC, or even as heartfelt as PRO…but it does everything “good-to-really well.” DSC’s biggest weakness is that it tries too hard to be sincere, and it’s terribly self-conscious. PIC just can’t seem to put 10 good cohesive serialized episodes together.

Controversial Opinion: The modern portfolio of Trek shows compliment each other really well.
 
Could they? Let's assume the real and scientifically accurate answer was "No, we have to burn the planet for the benefit of MILLIONS of people"? (Which is how it is presented in the movie. Isn't it?)

I mean, maybe the answer IS "No. The Ba'ku stay where they are. No matter the consequence." Maybe they get their own Maquis. I suppose Picard was their Maquis. Wow, he fared better than Eddington. (Look at me, throwing around the Deep Space Nine knowledge!)
So maybe it ain't so bad a movie, since we're still discussing the central conundrum. :lol:

Per the transcript, it's not certain if it's "necessary" to fry the planet, but the method the Son'a have chosen to use would poison it. Supposedly, the Federation's best minds couldn't come up with another way... really? It's Dougherty who pleads for the billions that might be helped, but eventually admits the rush is because the Son'a won't survive much longer. How many Son'a are there? More or less than 600? We don't get told.

DOUGHERTY: Jean-Luc, there are six hundred people down there. We'll be able to use the regenerative properties of this radiation to help billions. ...The Son'a have developed a procedure to collect the metaphasic particles from the planets rings.
PICARD: A planet in Federation space.
DOUGHERTY: That's right. We have the planet. They have the technology. ...A technology we can't duplicate. You know what that makes us? ...Partners.
PICARD: Our partners are nothing more than petty thugs.
DOUGHERTY: On Earth, petroleum once turned petty thugs into world leaders. Warp drive transformed a bunch of Romulan thugs into an Empire. We can handle the Son'a. I'm not worried about that.
PICARD: Someone probably said the same thing about the Romulans a century ago.
DOUGHERTY: With metaphasics, life spans will be doubled. ...An entire new medical science will evolve. I understand your Chief Engineer has the use of his eyes for the first time in his life. ...Would you take that away from him?
PICARD: There are metaphasic particles all over the Briar Patch. Why does it have to be this planet?
DOUGHERTY: It's the concentration in the rings that makes the whole damned thing work. Don't ask me to explain it. I only know they inject something into the rings that starts a thermolytic reaction. When it's over, the planet will be uninhabitable for generations.
PICARD: Admiral, delay the procedure. Let my people look at the technology.
DOUGHERTY: Our best scientific minds already have. We can't find any other way to do this.
PICARD: Then the Son'a can establish a separate colony on this planet until we do.
DOUGHERTY: It would take ten years of normal exposure to begin to reverse their condition. Some of them won't survive that long. Besides, they don't want to live in the middle of the Briar Patch. ...Who would?

It's a fairly good ethical quandary, but could have been executed better, as many folks have already discussed.

I'm willing to put up with every inconsistency from Christine Chapel (um, has that name always rhymed with Sistine Chapel and 50+ years later I'm just noticing it?)
:guffaw::guffaw::guffaw:

FWIW, I didn't see Kirk as particularly impulsive in the episode. Less experienced than we're used to, yes. And Pike was busy trying to figure out the ramifications for his future, so he was second-guessing everything. But I found it a good episode that riffed off what we already knew in an interesting way.
 
SNW is really fun. It’s not great, but it’s just loads of fun. I think it appeals to me for the same reason LD appeals to others.

It had some missteps (“Lift Us Up Where Suffering Cannot Reach” was criminally mundane for this type of series, and “Serene Squall” was just….stupid and annoying) but everything else was pretty awesome. Also, it has the best cast of all the modern shows…hands down, and not a single eye-rolling/annoying character.

It’s not as engaging or risk-taking as DSC, or as epic and prestigious as PIC, or even as heartfelt as PRO…but it does everything “good-to-really well.” DSC’s biggest weakness is that it tries too hard to be sincere, and it’s terribly self-conscious. PIC just can’t seem to put 10 good cohesive serialized episodes together.

Controversial Opinion: The modern portfolio of Trek shows compliment each other really well.
I really liked "Lift Us Up..." I thought it was a good homage to a famous story that still haunts me and managed to add Pike's fabulous integrity in to boot.

I agree with you that the modern shows compliment each other well. I'd even go a little further and say they show just how much can be done within the "Star Trek" IP.

I guess my controversial opinion is that I really like DSC *and* PIC *and* PRO *and* LD *and* SNW. Not that I have no issues or think there weren't things that could've been done better, but overall I enjoy myself while watching them. :biggrin:
 
Also, it has the best cast of all the modern shows…hands down, and not a single eye-rolling/annoying character.

It does have a fantastic cast, particularly with Pike, Spock and Una. I just started rewatching it and those three are superb leads with great chemistry. Unfortunately, I really can’t stand Ortegas’s constant SMIRK. I find it really off putting. She’s the one character I find annoying.
 
really liked "Lift Us Up..." I thought it was a good homage to a famous story that still haunts me and managed to add Pike's fabulous integrity in to boot.

"Lift Us Up..." was a gut punch, pure and simple. It hit me so hard I had to give SNW a rest for awhile to emotionally recover from it. Especially the dead husk of a kid, and the look on Ian Ho's face as those electronic snakes begin devouring him... urghhh. And a horrible, tragic irony that the raider ship, the turncoat guard, and the others... they were the good guys all along.
 
Destroying the hero ship has worked precisely once*, in Star Trek III: The Search for Spock. We're beyond diminishing returns into outright cliché now. The Enterprise-D's destruction is particularly egregious in that regard.

*It almost worked twice when the Defiant was destroyed in DS9: "The Changing Face of Evil", but then the dramatic impact is undone when they get a duplicate Defiant back a couple of episodes later.
 
Destroying the hero ship has worked precisely once*, in Star Trek III: The Search for Spock. We're beyond diminishing returns into outright cliché now. The Enterprise-D's destruction is particularly egregious in that regard.

*It almost worked twice when the Defiant was destroyed in DS9: "The Changing Face of Evil", but then the dramatic impact is undone when they get a duplicate Defiant back a couple of episodes later.
The one that everyone writes off just because it had been done to death was Star Trek: Beyond. I was less invested in the characters, I was MUCH less invested in the ship, but Beyond hit me hardest of all of the "blowing up the ship" moments. It was an actual battle. Our heroes were losing more and more in a gradual tick tock. And then they even had to fight just to give up! (And Chris Pine makes EVERYTHING better.)

That said: Generations -- When the little girl is being carried away from her teddy bear? OMG. I knew at that moment above all others: TNG had wasted any potential it was ever given by putting families on board. That's actually one of my top 20 Star Trek moments of all time.

But yes. You're right. In The Search For Spock the LAST thing we ever expected was 1701-A. I am at a loss to explain why the reveal at the end of Star Trek IV, while such an obvious and terrible cheat that has none of the weight that even getting Spock back had, reduces me to tears every goddamn time. The moment had more emotion for me than Spock's death and the destruction of the Enterprise had combined. (Weirdly, I'm more emotional at the recap in ST4 than when the Enterprise blew up in the first place!)
 
The one that everyone writes off just because it had been done to death was Star Trek: Beyond. I was less invested in the characters, I was MUCH less invested in the ship, but Beyond hit me hardest of all of the "blowing up the ship" moments. It was an actual battle. Our heroes were losing more and more in a gradual tick tock. And then they even had to fight just to give up! (And Chris Pine makes EVERYTHING better.)

That said: Generations -- When the little girl is being carried away from her teddy bear? OMG. I knew at that moment above all others: TNG had wasted any potential it was ever given by putting families on board. That's actually one of my top 20 Star Trek moments of all time.

But yes. You're right. In The Search For Spock the LAST thing we ever expected was 1701-A. I am at a loss to explain why the reveal at the end of Star Trek IV, while such an obvious and terrible cheat that has none of the weight that even getting Spock back had, reduces me to tears every goddamn time. The moment had more emotion for me than Spock's death and the destruction of the Enterprise had combined. (Weirdly, I'm more emotional at the recap in ST4 than when the Enterprise blew up in the first place!)

I absolutely HATED the design of the Abrams Enterprise. So I found myself completely shocked when I felt a gut punch as it was getting destroyed in BEYOND. That movie made me feel for it being gutted, piece by piece. Quite an accomplishment in itself.

I think part of why it was so effective was, as you said, the piece by piece destruction.
 
And it also helped that BEY felt like a weightier story that carried with it the most TOS-like feel of any of the Kelvin Timeline films. While the Kelvin Timeline Enterprise may well be my least-favorite Enterprise design in the franchise you got the sense these officers had spent more than five years serving aboard her and were genuinely gut-punched at her loss.

And as was already stated: her destruction was one of a thousand cuts and brutal.
 
Controversial opinion? Okay.

The JJ films have plot holes you could drive the USS Vengeance through, without touching the sides. Some spectacular scenes, but they do not a movie make.

Those films suck.

And so does DISCO
 
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