Sums up my beliefs as well. Voyager made a lot of mistakes where its characters were concerned, especially the female ones. Seven's outfit was one of them. Picard, at least, did not repeat this particular issue.
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
- Start date
Sums up my beliefs as well. Voyager made a lot of mistakes where its characters were concerned, especially the female ones. Seven's outfit was one of them. Picard, at least, did not repeat this particular issue.
PIC is largely a mess but how Jeri Ryan has been employed in the series is, thankfully, not one of the things contributing to the show being said mess.
Jeri Ryan was sexually objectified on Star Trek: Voyager. She is not sexually objectified on Star Trek: Picard, where she is allowed to wear real clothes that reflect her character's personality rather than a ridiculous catsuit that undermines her performance at every turn.
Yes, Seven was objectified in Voyager, but even back then she was so much more than that. The character wasn't just popular with the target audience they tried to lure with her body. She was popular among people who have no sexual or romantic interest in women as well.
If she had just been a decoration we would talk about her like people often talk about Troi, a character who's potential was wasted because she was turned into a decoration.
If she had just been a decoration we would talk about her like people often talk about Troi, a character who's potential was wasted because she was turned into a decoration.
G
Gul Sengosts
Guest
Yeah, Seven was one of the strongest characters of VOY who's much more than her appearance, but still the ridiculous suit is grating in every scene she's in. I wish she'd just been given a Starfleet uniform, that would have been so much better, and she'd have been remembered just as a great character, without any bullshit tarnishing her.
Oh agreed. Even worse because that one episode showed us how good she looked in a starfleet uniform. I was countering the people here who claim that she was nothing but a "bridge babe".
And, being in bed with the flue and being able to catch up on SNW I have what is probably a contrversial opinion on it. For those who haven't seen it yet I put it in spoilers. It's about episode 7.
Christ the person who plays Captain Angel is crap at playing a villain. Being non-binary myself I was pretty excited that they hired a non-binary guest star. I found them pretty good...until the reveal. Why on earth do they suddenly morph into Captain Planet villain who chews the scenery to bits? Her acting as Angel was bloody awful! As I said she's just a few puns away form being a 1990s Saturday Morning Cartoon villain. And sorry, but that individual does not have the charisma you'd need to pull of that type of cackling villain.No. Then again the whole episode was kinda shit and a bit juvenile, with the whole "mutiny" coming of as bad, teenage fanfic level plotting (a first for SNW for me, I enjoyed the other episodes so far)
I would have also liked a mention that they coaxed the location of the real Dr.Aspen from the Pirates and sending a rescue mission at the end, that would have been a sentence that ought to be have said.
I hope we never see Captain Angel again and that the rest of the episodes aren't bad like this one.
I would have also liked a mention that they coaxed the location of the real Dr.Aspen from the Pirates and sending a rescue mission at the end, that would have been a sentence that ought to be have said.
I hope we never see Captain Angel again and that the rest of the episodes aren't bad like this one.
VOY was often good or even great to the extent it could be because of Seven and the Doctor. Without both characters even Kate Mulgrew's personality and endless charm couldn't have kept that show afloat.
Cutting-and-pasting a post of mine from 2021 that was quoting another post of mine from 2020, because it's relevant to where we are in this thread.
News - "Star Trek’s Jeri Ryan Enjoyed Playing Seven of Nine On Picard More Than Voyager" | Page 2 | The Trek BBS
-- Cutting and pasting --
Me at 18 in the summer of 1998, mowing the lawn. There you go. I had the T-shirt and everything.
But here's a more substantive post I typed up a little while ago, on April 2nd, 2020.
-- Cutting and pasting. --
I think in the future, people will wear whatever they want. It's the only way to explain the horrible costuming in TNG. I thought it got better from the DS9/VOY years and on. If they were trying to convey "This is a sci-fi character!" it worked. But I never thought much about it. I was more interested in Seven's character arc during the fourth season.
From the fifth season on, I think she was running in place most of the time but there's only so much you can do once everything's a monotonous routine and you have two people like The Doctor and Janeway breathing down your neck constantly making note of if you so much as even move a muscle differently. Sadly, I can relate to this. I didn't "fit in" until I found my own niche in college, I wasn't interested in conforming to the norm or doing what I was "supposed to do", and I did NOT like having parents who were trying to watch me so closely or wouldn't let me do anything to the point where I had to start doing things behind their back just to get out from underneath their eye. So I don't blame Seven for also wanting to have a secret little double-life in "Human Error". I completely understand it.
So I didn't really give a shit about the catsuit. I was more focused on the character. This was someone I could identify with. Otherwise, I wasn't much of a fan of VOY. She's the reason I watched as long as I did. Otherwise, I would've stopped watching sooner since (unlike a lot of other people here) I don't stick around watching things I'm not a fan of. I mean, sure, Spock was half-Human and half-Vulcan and I could identify being of two cultures, being half-American and half-Iranian, but Seven wasn't like anyone else and didn't appreciate being forced to be like anyone else. And that's what I identify with more (then and now). It's not what you are, it's who you are.
News - "Star Trek’s Jeri Ryan Enjoyed Playing Seven of Nine On Picard More Than Voyager" | Page 2 | The Trek BBS
-- Cutting and pasting --
Me at 18 in the summer of 1998, mowing the lawn. There you go. I had the T-shirt and everything.
But here's a more substantive post I typed up a little while ago, on April 2nd, 2020.
-- Cutting and pasting. --
I think in the future, people will wear whatever they want. It's the only way to explain the horrible costuming in TNG. I thought it got better from the DS9/VOY years and on. If they were trying to convey "This is a sci-fi character!" it worked. But I never thought much about it. I was more interested in Seven's character arc during the fourth season.
From the fifth season on, I think she was running in place most of the time but there's only so much you can do once everything's a monotonous routine and you have two people like The Doctor and Janeway breathing down your neck constantly making note of if you so much as even move a muscle differently. Sadly, I can relate to this. I didn't "fit in" until I found my own niche in college, I wasn't interested in conforming to the norm or doing what I was "supposed to do", and I did NOT like having parents who were trying to watch me so closely or wouldn't let me do anything to the point where I had to start doing things behind their back just to get out from underneath their eye. So I don't blame Seven for also wanting to have a secret little double-life in "Human Error". I completely understand it.
So I didn't really give a shit about the catsuit. I was more focused on the character. This was someone I could identify with. Otherwise, I wasn't much of a fan of VOY. She's the reason I watched as long as I did. Otherwise, I would've stopped watching sooner since (unlike a lot of other people here) I don't stick around watching things I'm not a fan of. I mean, sure, Spock was half-Human and half-Vulcan and I could identify being of two cultures, being half-American and half-Iranian, but Seven wasn't like anyone else and didn't appreciate being forced to be like anyone else. And that's what I identify with more (then and now). It's not what you are, it's who you are.
Yes. In part because of Jeri Ryan's work, and in part because the writers somehow managed to do good work with her... some of the time.
Yes. I have the same reaction to Harry's collar.
Or just plain civilian clothes. Neelix might have looked like a sofa sometimes, but Kes's (early) outfits were attractive and modest.
Better. The blue uniform colors really set off her natural coloring.
Especially with her own character in a constant state of flux.
I have followed every Star Trek show since the Next Generation from first episode to last and have seen every single movie in their first theatrical run. Not necessarily the first week, but during the theatrical run.
The only movie I didn’t see first-run in the theaters was TMP, mainly because I was 3 years old. All the others I saw first run. Every film from TFF forward I saw on opening night.
I’ve made up for not seeing TMP in its initial run by watching re-releases twice in the last several years.
I still think she should have adopted one by her own choice as part of her character development (and getting a field commission to ensign in the process)
But until then she would have looked good in, for example, a nice teal coloured tunic with a matching pair of either leggings or pants (teal because it would have fit her function as part of Voyager's science divisionand because, as @Oddish pointex out Jeri Ryan looks good in that colour)
Holy Prophets, that episode was utterly atrocious. It was weeks before I could stomach another episode of LD.
Regarding Seven, once she got out of that ridiculous silver suit I didn’t think her catsuit was too many degrees worse than what Troi, Kira or T’Pol wore.
In fact, I have more of an issue with Kira’s catsuit (season 4 onward) because it was kind of insulting for a military commander to be wobbling about in seven inch heels with a spray on suit. Ditto T’Pol. And I don’t really know why a counsellor would have her cleavage on display—always seemed a bit inappropriate?
Berman had such a fetish for catsuits, he should be made to wear one as punishment.
Last edited:
T'Pol's Season 1 and 2 catsuit.
Ugh.
Ugh.
Rick Berman was so much worse than Gene Roddenberry. Rick Berman was a slickster who could get away with a lot more nonsense because he knew how to play studio politics so much better but didn't have the same raw creative talent.
What I like about Alex Kurtzman is that he doesn't appear to have the same hang-ups as Roddenberry or Berman, his Star Trek series have true gender equality, and he's not afraid to make each series different. Not "the same but different" (like Rick Berman did) but actually different.
T’Pol and 7 both had actual growth and arcs. You could argue the two best in Trek. Jeri Ryan was a really good actress, too, which I don’t think you woulda predicted from her prior resume (pageant winner, model, and politician’s wife, iirc though none of those is bad, of course!). Tom and B’ellana grew, as a real couple too. But I’m fairly pro VOY as people go here, too.
Edit: thinking catsuits, boy Kira really got fleshed out as a person in DS9 too. Catsuits intended as eye candy, but the actresses and writers parlayed the characters into people.
Edit: thinking catsuits, boy Kira really got fleshed out as a person in DS9 too. Catsuits intended as eye candy, but the actresses and writers parlayed the characters into people.
As far as female characters, unquestionably Kira and Seven had the most growth.
He certainly went in some new directions... the far future with Discovery, Trek noir with Picard, craziness with LD, kid's shows with Prodigy, and a touch of the familiar with SNW.
At least Kira was wearing what the other Bajoran officers were wearing, and it looked like clothing rather than spray paint.
Similar threads
- Locked
