Meaning of the term has changed. By Trek's time, it just means "best of the best"/"public face of the organisation"
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
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That doesn't make any sense. The universal translator seems to be working fine for most everything else. But it's nothing to get hung up about (not that I think anybody is getting hung up about it, despite some accusations that they are). Just a roll-eyes and then a move on are all that's indicated.
Like we have flagship stores in Harvey Norman but last time I checked the Admiralty wasn't aboard those either. It just means a good store. The Enterprise-D and the Kelvin-Enterprise were the good stores of the Federation. Maybe the Zheng-He is the flagship in Picard era but just as easily not. Maybe you win the title in a raffle.
The Enterprise-D was a top of the line ship that carried a name with an illustrious history going back 200 years in Starfleet.
Add in the fact it literally is a merging of a fancy hotel with a battleship, and it certainly meets the qualifications of being a 'flagship'.
Add in the fact it literally is a merging of a fancy hotel with a battleship, and it certainly meets the qualifications of being a 'flagship'.
That's part of the Navy, is it?
Is Starfleet the Navy?
From THE STAR TREK GUIDE (a.k.a. STAR TREK WRITERS/DIRECTORS GUIDE), by Gene Roddenberry, et al., third revision, April 17, 1967, page 27 (boldfacing mine):
Is the starship U.S.S. Enterprise a military vessel?
Yes, but only semi-military in practice -- omitting features which are heavily authoritarian. For example, we are not aware of "officers" and "enlisted men" categories. And we avoid saluting and other annoying medieval leftovers. On the other hand, we do keep a flavor of Naval usage and terminology to help encourage believability and identification by the audience. After all, our own Navy today still retains remnants of tradition known to Nelson and Drake.
Yes, but only semi-military in practice -- omitting features which are heavily authoritarian. For example, we are not aware of "officers" and "enlisted men" categories. And we avoid saluting and other annoying medieval leftovers. On the other hand, we do keep a flavor of Naval usage and terminology to help encourage believability and identification by the audience. After all, our own Navy today still retains remnants of tradition known to Nelson and Drake.
The boldfaced trumps this question, and the decides the issue in question, too. The misuse of "flagship" violates this prescription, full stop.
Oh, and by the way, the question of is the Enterprise a military vessel, also settled by a single word right there: "yes."
Channels have flagship shows. Companies sell flagship products.
In modern terms it's come to mean 'the leading and best example of something'. Ie:
1) The Crown is one of Netflix's flagship shows.
2) The iPhone is Apple's flagship product.
The meaning of the word has in other words already mutated. The Enterprise is the ship that represents the best ideals and philosophies of the Federation and is used as a platform on which to propagate them. It's the Federation flagship. Makes sense to me.
Apparently there are also some problems with terms such as 'military' or 'money'. Despite some 'definitive' statements of characters on these points in the series, we also see some evidence to the contrary. Perhaps 'flagship' isn't the only term the UT has trouble rendering in late 20th/early 21st century terms
Exactly.
The term 'flagship' has been used outside of the military for decades and has no military applications.
Publix has flagship stores. Whole Foods has flagships stores.
Sci-Fi Channel had flagship shows. (FARSCAPE, STARGATE SG-1, and BSG have each held this title.)
Words can and do have multiple meanings.
Example: "Look at the guns on him." We're not talking about the weapons in his holster, we're talking about his biceps.
And we're talking hundreds of yearsin the future. Very easy to have even more uses for a word than we have now.
From a military point of view it makes no sense. I've worked in a flagship store. Guess what? Higher ups, executive leadership, are in and out on a weekly basis.
I prefer a regular store. Or ship in this instance.
I prefer a regular store. Or ship in this instance.
We have an alternate meaning now, never mind centuries later...
Like yourself, I just don't see the problem with it at all.
It also makes next to no difference to me what the ship is called. Ships are just places for characters to inhabit and it's those characters that matter in the end.
So, if they pronounce Enterprise in a new show as "enter-pree-say" would that be acceptable as linguistic drift?
True. I do agree on this point. But, as Captain Cupcake noted it's not a ruining of the show. Just an annoyance, eye rolling and sighing, and moving on.
I have also worked in flagship stores, both for Publix and Whole Foods.
Higher ups in and out all the time... damned annoying. Can't get any real work done because regular managers are too concerned with appearances. Want the shelves to look full? Instead of wasting hours blocking (bringing multiple items up to make item look full), why not let people actually fill those shelves with the pallets of product that are sitting in the back?
Or, here's a win-win... have a couple people block, and everyone else fill the shelves with product? You get to keep up appearances and actually get work done.
The retail space, honestly, is so damned inefficient with their practices. So very happy my current job is out of retail.
Depends on the day in my current job for me.
But, yeah, it's inefficient. Reminds me of a friend of mine who served on an older US Navy ship and because of it's age it leaked. So, during inspections by flag officers, enlisted personnel had to work one compartment forward to wipe up any drips and move to the next compartment before the inspecting officers entered.
I suppose that current Trek shows can't really use the term 'flagship' as it's supposed to be, simply because we don't see many Admirals.
Yes, a flagship is simply the Admiral's ship, but (apart from the occasional cameo appearance by, for example, Robert April in SNW) Admirals just don't show up that often. And when they do, they're usually not in command of a fleet. So there's no REASON to use the word like that.
Yes, a flagship is simply the Admiral's ship, but (apart from the occasional cameo appearance by, for example, Robert April in SNW) Admirals just don't show up that often. And when they do, they're usually not in command of a fleet. So there's no REASON to use the word like that.
Unless a corrupt antagonist is required. Even that is a TNG and later thing as TOS Admirals make brief appearances to give the teaser for the week's episode.
I would love to see a show where there's an admiral actually doing admiral things.
Me and my coworker muse that Picard should had been some sort of admiral or ambassador while Riker was the Captain and someone like Tasha the XO... Show that whole different angle.
In SNW, the original Enterprise is also called the "flagship." But in TOS it's never ever referred as such. It's just another ship in the fleet doing its job.
Although technically in TWOK and TSFS, the Enterprise is a flagship since Admiral Kirk is in command.
But TREK since TNG has been misusing the Naval parlance of flagship. As someone pointed out, it's more like the retail store definition.
Although technically in TWOK and TSFS, the Enterprise is a flagship since Admiral Kirk is in command.
But TREK since TNG has been misusing the Naval parlance of flagship. As someone pointed out, it's more like the retail store definition.
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