Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 2x05 - "Fly Me to the Moon"

[Timofnine]

I'm not a fan of the TNG interpretation of the Prime Directive, never have been. And, anyone from the Federation shouldn't be setting foot on foreign soil, which includes the star system, of a race that hasn't given them permission, regardless of the social/technological status of that race. The Federation is basically exploiting lesser cultures for information but offering nothing in return.



Who gave them this power and why should any human bow to it?



Are they protecting Earth, or are the protecting their slice of the galaxy from barbaric and unpredictable humans?

They are a far future cooperative of all species, consciousness’ and civilisations, from ‘far beyond the stars’, harmoniously looking after themselves and each other as a universal collective consciousness in a retrospective way through all of time and space via the watchers. Even though this state of future harmony has been achieved, there are still anomalies and glitches in the system as it is booting up to this ultimate expression of universal harmony and universal peace…. So using very advanced technologies, watchers are interspersed throughout the four quadrants to pivotal points in time and space to make sure that these focal points remain fixed points in time, as any deviation or corruption could lead to the collapse of this harmonious future where all species have reached the ultimate expression of consciousness and peaceful coexistence.

 

[BillJ]

They are a far future cooperative of all species, consciousness’ and civilisations, from ‘far beyond the stars’, harmoniously looking after themselves and each other as a universal collective consciousness in a retrospective way through all of time and space via the watchers. Even though this state of future harmony has been achieved, there are still anomalies and glitches in the system as it is booting up to this ultimate expression of universal harmony and universal peace…. So using very advanced technologies, watchers are interspersed throughout the four quadrants to pivotal points in time and space to make sure that these focal points remain fixed points in time, as any deviation or corruption could lead to the collapse of this harmonious future where all species have reached the ultimate expression of consciousness and peaceful coexistence.

None of this is from any of the shows. So, no. No one has the right to enforce their views on another without their consent.

 

[Nerys Myk]

The fact that there is an implied history between Guinan and the Watcher indicates that she has not taken an issue with Guinan’s continued presence on Earth.

Yep, there's a difference between "stay out of my business" and "get off this planet".

 

[Timofnine]

None of this is from any of the shows. So, no. No one has the right to enforce their views on another without their consent.

But everyone gives their consent via the collective consciousness in the far future when they realise what the alternative is…

 

[BillJ]

But everyone gives their consent in the far future when they realise what the alternative is…

Everyone? I doubt it. As long as there are sapient beings, there will be disagreements. Who is anyone to tell me that if I'm unhappy of 40th century New Earth, that I can't go back to the 20th century and live out my days? The technology for time travel was always in the universe and always will be. It is a feature, not a bug. You screw something up, the universe works the wrinkles out and moves on.

Time travel shouldn't be something reserved for Kings and others of supposed moral purity.

 

[Timofnine]

Everyone? I doubt it. As long as there are sapient beings, there will be disagreements. Who is anyone to tell me that if I'm unhappy of 40th century New Earth, that I can't go back to the 20th century and live out my days? The technology for time travel was always in the universe and always will be. It is a feature, not a bug. You screw something up, the universe works the wrinkles out and moves on.

Time travel shouldn't be something reserved for Kings and others of supposed moral purity.

There are no kings in a collective consciousness… the collective consciousness is the universe, the watchers are the universe’s way of working the wrinkles out.

Enjoy 40th century universal Armageddon as an alternative? Or maybe that’s what you want? I’m sure that a Star Trek spin off movie dealt with this once? Event Horizon I think that it was called? I’ve never seen that film so maybe I’m mistaken referencing it?

 

[urbandefault]

<snip>Time travel shouldn't be something reserved for Kings ... </snip>

Depends on the context.

 

[Warped1]

Has anyone here postulated the REAL Watcher / Supervisor was killed off by this potential imposter and it is SHE who is trying to manipulate the timeline and Q is trying to save it?

 

[Warped1]

Gary Seven was hands on and she just sits on her hands.

 

[fireproof78]

They are a far future cooperative of all species, consciousness’ and civilisations, from ‘far beyond the stars’, harmoniously looking after themselves and each other as a universal collective consciousness in a retrospective way through all of time and space via the watchers. Even though this state of future harmony has been achieved, there are still anomalies and glitches in the system as it is booting up to this ultimate expression of universal harmony and universal peace…. So using very advanced technologies, watchers are interspersed throughout the four quadrants to pivotal points in time and space to make sure that these focal points remain fixed points in time, as any deviation or corruption could lead to the collapse of this harmonious future where all species have reached the ultimate expression of consciousness and peaceful coexistence.

I love these these statements as if there was such certainty to how this operates. It's a fascinating exploration of how individuals view the franchise, but ultimately I have no idea where these ideas come from or why they are relevant to the current efforts of telling a story of Picard fixing time.

 

[Warped1]

Or so she is trying to make Picard believe

 

[BillJ]

Has anyone here postulated the REAL Watcher / Supervisor was killed off by this potential imposter and it is SHE who is trying to manipulate the timeline and Q is trying to save it?

Yeah.

What if the Gary Mitchell Appreciation Society really aren't Watchers? What if they are the actual enemy? They could easily tie this in as a chapter of the Temporal Cold War.

 

[BillJ]

Enjoy 40th century universal Armageddon as an alternative? Or maybe that’s what you want? I’m sure that a Star Trek spin off movie dealt with this once?

Whose to say it leads to Armageddon? In pretty much every time travel instance, the goal is to restore the timeline with no thought given as to whether things might actually be better in the long run with the changes. We are given scant evidence that the preferred timeline of our heroes is the "better" timeline.

There was no Enterprise in orbit about the Guardian planet and Hitler won WWII, that doesn't mean that the timeline that came out of the changes might not be better. Remember the "better" timeline also has the Eugenics Wars, Colonel Green, World War III, the Romulan War, a couple of Klingon wars, the Borg and others...

 

[Timofnine]

I love these these statements as if there was such certainty to how this operates. It's a fascinating exploration of how individuals view the franchise, but ultimately I have no idea where these ideas come from or why they are relevant to the current efforts of telling a story of Picard fixing time.

Have you not read my posts?

The Watchers are in Picard season 2, and I am speculating as to their origins and purpose which ties in with my fan theory of the far future of the Star Trek universe, possibly also including the Q Continuum which might be the actual name of far future galactic cooperative/Federation/collective consciousness.

 

[BillJ]

The Watchers are in Picard season 2, and I am speculating as to their origins and purpose which ties in with my fan theory of the far future of the Star Trek universe, possibly also including the Q Continuum which might be the actual name of far future galactic cooperative/Federation/collective consciousness.

I love speculation, but it should have some basis in the facts of the show we're speculating on.

 

[fireproof78]

Have you not read my posts?

The Watchers are in Picard season 2, and I am speculating as to their origins and purpose which ties in with my fan theory of the far future of the Star Trek universe, possibly also including the Q Continuum which might be the actual name of far future galactic cooperative/Federation/collective consciousness.

Then present it as speculation not as fact. Also, it should connect to the story being told. 40th century hive minds do not.

And this is why I don't watch Dr. Who.

 

[BillJ]

And this is why I don't watch Dr. Who.

Doctor Who is always a show I want to get into, until I watch it.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Interesting that Gary Seven was from the 24th century

We don't know that.

The transporter beam that brought him to the Enterprise could have come from the future, but was never specifically confirmed as such.

So for all we know, Gary was native to the 20th century just like he was supposed to be.

 

[fireproof78]

Doctor Who is always a show I want to get into, until I watch it.

Same. I tried and then...yeah. I couldn't.

And people think Discovery is "dark."

 

[Warped1]

And this is why I don't watch Dr. Who.

Maybe the Borg Queen is a future incarnation of The Doctor who was assimilated but has no memory of it because the chameleon arc was in use at the time.

The Daleks also tried to exterminate Renee, but like Q found out they couldn't because she is a fixed point in time.