How can future shows retcon the errors of Star Trek Picard?

[Nerys Myk]

If you can read a person's mind, maybe you can also write to it.

"Dagger of the Mind".

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

I mean, you by definition can never use all the tools in your toolbox to prevent something if you want to remain a free society.

Yet the UFP manages to exist in the 24th century while Telepathy is at play as a part of daily life & part of common society.
The UFP hasn't crumbled and people move about their normal business without the bat of an eye.

And condemn billions more lives to oblivion. No way.

You sound alot like Dr. Phlox and are holding back the genetic cure to that disease that was ravaging the species society for some hypothetical boogey men that might come about later in the civilizations course.

Instead of saving known lives now, you're worried about hypotheticals in the future.

Is that how you want to run things?

Obviously because Future Janeway's journey to 2377 in "Endgame" was a part of those future agents' own subjective past.

The entire point of the Temporal Prime Directive is to protect your own subjective past, no matter what.

Our own Subjective Past has over 90,000 dead and countless Romulan lives dead because the evacuation never happened.
Those are lives known to be lost because of one person's betrayal.

Says who? There's nothing in the canon establishing anything like that.

Common people in modern day society who expects perfection from their Public Servants, but will crucify everybody who fail even in the slightest bit and demands their abolishment should they fail. I see it all the time in current public media.

Now that is unrealistic.

I know, but the expectations from average citizens are still there.

I lived through the U.S. public's swing towards jingoism, imperialism, and racism after 9/11. And it was a profound, profound mistake that set the U.S. on a regressive path that undermined progress towards social justice for decades. It's not a model to emulate.

So have I, and modern "Social Justice" isn't really all that "Progressive" or "Justice-like"; so it's not a model to emulate either IMO.

I think that's jumping to conclusions. We don't know much detail at all about the relationship between the Tal Shiar and the RFS. Nor even about the relationship between the Tal Shiar and the Zhat Vash. For all we know, the Tal Shiar leadership might launch a campaign to purge Zhat Vash agents from their organization.

Or they might reward Oh and make her the head of the Tal Shiar for all the damage she did to StarFleet and the UFP.

That's possible, but it wouldn't make much sense. Why would Starfleet wait nine years to put Picard in command of the Enterprise-D after the Stargazer was destroyed, but only wait one year to put him in command of the Enterprise-E after the Enterprise-D was destroyed?

Picard wasn't even on the Enterprise-D when the attack by the Duras Sisters happened.
Picard was planet-side dealing with Dr. Tolian Soran.

And the Enterprise-D was defeated by Cyber Espionage, not from any lack of technical capabilities or weakness from crew training. It was lack of Cyber Security Protocol to replace Geordi's VISOR with a brand new unit that was untampered with.

Something, where proper Cyber Security Protocol would have caught if it was in place.

It's not like StarFleet couldn't afford to replicate an entire drawer's full of brand new VISORs, each one ready to replace any mishandled unit after an away mission. Where Cyber Security Techs can investigate said used VISORs for tampering.

Absolute nonsense. There was never a reason he could not have had both a fulfilling relationship and his Starfleet career. We've seen plenty of successful Starfleet officers in committed, long-term relationships. Picard was just afraid of commitment.

Yet in the All Good Things alternate timeline, he did marry Beverly & was divorced from her.
But after those events, he choose to never marry.

As far as we know. But the point here is not to make an argument about what definitely was happening; the point is that your claim that a telepathic scan would be an effective means of screening for moles cannot be rationally sustained on its own terms.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree since regular Psychic Mental Scans haven't been tested and there have been at least 3x known Traitors to the UFP / StarFleet already.

Avoiding an unnecessary war that does not benefit your society and which would produce worse problems does not make your society "a softie."

How would you define the Dominion War?
Was that necessary?

What about the Cardassian Border Wars?

And the Ba'ku incident was a clear violation of Federation law. As Bashir noted in "Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges," the Federation Charter has clear provisions against interfering in the internal affairs of foreign cultures. (The Prime Directive, aka Starfleet General Order 1, is probably a detailed set of general orders about how to implement this provision of the Federation Charter.)

General Order #1 was interpreted quite differently in Kirk's era.

First off, Obama was not the guy who opposed U.S. intervention in Syria. He wanted to go to war in Syria just as he had gone to war in Libya; the only reason he didn't was that too many people mobilized to oppose him and it was clear that public opinion was against intervention.

And then he waffled.

Secondly, you need only look at Obama's prior war for an example of why so many members of the public opposed intervention in the Syrian Civil War -- intervention in Libya led to the collapse of any meaningful central government and the rise of open-air slave markets in their major cities.

Yet when Bill Clinton intervened with NATO in the Yugoslav war, they managed a proper outcome which created new Nation States.

Obama did performa sloppy job and he screwed it up.

Where's the difference in how both PotUS going about "Interventionism"?

Thirdly, DAESH only became powerful because of interventionism. It rose to power as a direct result of the U.S. invasion of Iraq. It is true that eventually it grew to such a force it needed to be stopped, but it never would have so grown if it weren't for the U.S.'s decision to launch a war of aggression against Iraq and then occupy it for years afterwards. DAESH is literally a problem created by interventionism.

DAESH existed because Paul Bremer is to blame for the bungled mess from the Occupation after the 2nd Iraq War.
He went in and didn't know the lay of the land and made dumb unilateral decisions, like abolishing the existing Iraqi Military. Effectively creating a giant, well trained military that was out of a job and barred from doing the one job they were good at.
If they took the time to properly assess the situation and handle the solution properly, we wouldn't have a 2nd Iraq War or DAESH.

And that's a prime example of why many Federates may have not wanted to militarily intervene in the Cardassian occupation of Bajor. What if, for instance, elements of the Bajoran Resistance had perceived the Federation as an occupying, imperialist force and turned against them? What if intervention were to result on a long quagmire with Starfleet fighting both the Cardassian Guard and Bajoran nationalist forces? What if Bajoran nationalist forces were to target Federation civilian population centers in retaliation for the UFP's perceived hostility? What if intervention were to lead to a weak Bajoran government unable to control violent factions that, say, were to aid asymmetrical anti-UFP threat agents? What if Bajor descended into civil war and dragged the UFP into it?

So the better solution IYO is to sit there on the side-lines, and do NOTHING.

Let Genocide, Mass Slaughter, Planetary Strip Mining, and Mass Rape & Murders happen in front of Inter-Galactic eyes and wag your fingers at the Cardassians & Censure them with "Harsh Words" & Economic Sanctions.

Sitting back on your ivory tower, citing the Prime Directive as to the main reason why you can't do anything?

That doesn't sound like something real heroes would do.

Actually you do. The entire Kelvin Timeline relies upon a line of dominoes to fall. That line of dominoes, in reverse order, is this:

• The Jellyfish and the Narada are thrown into the black hole created by the supernova
• Which can only happen if Nero is pursuing Spock because he blames him for the supernova
• Which only makes sense if Spock failed to stop the supernova
• Which would only matter if the Romulan worlds affected were not evacuated in time
• Which would only happen if the UFP didn't send the rescue fleet
• Which only happened because of the Mars Attack
• Which only happened because Nedar masterminded the attack

Stopping Nedar from launching the Mars Attack literally stops the entire chain of events that results in the Kelvin Timeline's creation. Without Nedar, trillions of lives in the Kelvin Timeline are consigned to oblivion.

The thing you're forgetting is that they know what happens after-wards.

We, as the audience knows what happens after-wards.

Especially with Time Travel and Temporal Communications from the future feeding back the long term consequences.

The Prime Timeline does eventually learn of the existence of the Kelvin Timeline.

With that knowledge in hand, you can still change history and have all the key points of the JellyFish / Narada still happen via a carefully executed plan.

No, not, "mistreatment of Telepaths is bad." That's not the point. The point is, "Literally everything about how Telepaths and Mundanes related to each other in Earth Alliance society was fundamentally toxic." The emergence of a "Telepath supremacy deep state" was the inevitable outcome of how these two sides interacted, and it was always going to result in a war. Literally nothing about how the Earth Alliance responded to the emergence of Telepaths should be cited as worthy of admiration or emulation.

That's why we should treat each other better and learn from their mistakes.

What does that mean? Define "wanton misuse." Define "nothing to do."

Poking in the mind about subject matter that is unrelated to the question at hand when inquired about.
"wanton misuse" = Seeking answers to unrelated subject matter when asked about question ___.
"nothing to do" = If I ask you a question of what did you eat on __ day. And the Telepath starts poking around for questions about who you had sex with. That's "Nothing to do" with the question at hand.

The only answer and information that the Telepath should be poking about is related to what you ate on ___ day. That, and ONLY that. Any other line of inquiry is irrelvant and has "NOTHING TO DO" with the question asked and the truthfull-ness of it.

Hell, define citizenry.

Citizen of the UFP.

How long before you have no one willing to serve in the government or military?

Good question, we only need to look at modern societies as an example.

We seem to have plenty of folks who can and do serve in the government and military, despite being flawed & restrictive of some of their basic rights as is.

I mean, by that logic, why not just require every single Starfleet officer and every single elected official to live inside a secure bunker under 24/7 surveillance with no privacy, no homes of their own, no access to family, etc.? After all, it would be secure!

They live on a StarShip or StarBase.

That pretty much is a Bunker. It's a large, open Bunker, with very nice amenities.

Their Combadges already record their interactions. Why else would Admiral Ross need to take his combadge off to have a secure "off-the records" conversation with Julian Bashir.

And who decides which telepath gets assigned to whom? Who decides when they scan? Who decides how "deep" a scan has to be? Who verifies the other telepaths' work? Who decides who verifies the other telepaths' work?

Random draw of the lot by computer for a random group of Telepaths and machine operators to validate Telepathic Recorders.
They all scan together while monitoring each other during scanning.
The scan can only go as deep as the inquired question spoken to the person being scanned.
It's a mass collective group of random Telepaths and Psionic Recorders and Machines to serve as witness to their work that they didn't veer off the rails.

What if they get infiltrated by the Tal Shiar?

Then they will be subjected to similar scanning for Tal Shiar presence.

What does that mean? How would that work?

Telepathic Recording & Sensing machines will be used to monitor the subject being scanned along with every single Telepath doing the scanning. Every piece of data will be recorded and shown to the person being scanned as open evidence to make sure nobody is poking around where they shouldn't be.

Edited to add:



I don't think that's fair. We've never seen the Romulan legal system. We know canonically that the Klingons have rigged trials, but for all we know the Romulan Free State's courts might have an extensive system to protect the civil rights and liberties of the accused.

Or it could be another sham like the current Russian Government.

Maybe. But this is Star Trek. People evolve.

Who watches the watchers?

Zero limits have been established as to what information is relevant. Thus far it's carte blanche access to the mind of all officers.

These hyperbolic strawmen are completely missing the point.

Other Watchers that are randomized on who gets to watch others with rotating groups.
Relevancy to the question at hand is the limiter. It's far from Carte Blanche access.

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

Thanks to you, now I’m deep in a Wikipedia rabbit hole of double agents throughout history. And I have to conclude your objection is entirely valid, I can’t find a single historical example of someone so highly placed in one intelligence community being an agent for another.

Try these guys in the IRA who were actually British intelligence
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...kQFnoECAQQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0VHylJl0oRQGbx5vkSZKk-
Most famously Denis Donaldson
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denis_Donaldson
British intelligence also had people who lived for years as different people involved in Greenpeace and CND. They went as far as getting married and having children under fake alias to then do a "tah dah" and destroy lives. Here is one example
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...IQFnoECCcQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1I4Qy1_w9oT5Hm0F1VpSgq

 

[The Wormhole]

Deanna Troi may be prim / proper and not read the emotions of others, doesn't mean that other Telepathic folks won't use their power to their advantage without you knowing.

Well sure, we know that happens, TNG had a few such episodes about telepaths using their abilities for personal gain, or at least an advantage in their work. You'll note such telepaths are always depicted in a negative light, making it clear where the franchise stand on this issue.

You'll have to earn trust the old fashioned way. By doing & delivering and hope that those who employ you, believe that you're delivering on said trust.

But you're still creating an unfair environment either way. Either people can't work for Starfleet or the government because their biology prevents them from being read by telepaths, or you have people working these jobs who are granted an exception to having their privacy invaded simply because of biology and not being able to be read by telepaths. Either way is only going to create a lot of contempt from the opposite side.

It's not a matter of what I believe or want. It's called verification. It's nothing personal.

If somebody tells you ___ is happening, do you not use multiple sources to validate said claim?

It's not like you don't trust random person. But you do your home work to make sure that ___ claim is true.

That's common sense.

One can verify and validate without invading privacy. That's common decency.

The same StarFleet that allowed Section 31 to make a genetic Bio-weapon & helped deliver said Bio-weapon to exterminate "The Founders".

Starfleet didn't allow Section 31 to do anything. Section 31 acted on its own to infect Odo. True, Starfleet decided to look the other way and ignore the matter when it was revealed after the fact, which is still pretty horrible, but is not technically the same as giving consent.

Imagine the # of officers needed to infect Odo to pass on the Genetically engineered virus onto the Founders.

That's ALOT of potential collaborators who are in on it.

Probably only one actual Starfleet officer, the one Odo met with at Starfleet Medical, and even then, they could have just been an undercover Section 31 agent. Otherwise, everyone else involved would have been Section 31 agents or scientists employed by Section 31.

You don't think StarFleet / UFP don't have their own intelligence agencies that are spying on things internally and externally?

So what do you suggest that StarFleet / UFP do when they get betrayed.

Just say "Aw Shucks, you got me" and let them go?

What's your solution to traitors like: "Selok, Commodore Oh, Rizzo"?

You know what happens to real spies when they get caught, at least in the western world? Nothing. Their held in custody until such time as a deal can be made with their government for their return in exchange for something of value. This in turn creates a sense of quid pro quo in the hopes that should one of their own spies be found out in another country, those spies will be similarly treated accordingly. It's generally accepted by most governments that spying is a thing that happens and will always happen and can't be prevented. I imagine the Federation will feel otherwise. Granted, Commodore Oh is a bit of a unique case in that she caused the destruction of a planet essentially, which she would be prosecuted for if the Federation every found her.

Star Trek is FULL of Time Travel stories and I love all of them.

The amount of lives it can save, the great things it can do for society. Imagine a world where you don't have to worry about unnatural deaths. That somebody will do their best to save you from a death that isn't of natural old age.

Have you ever noticed how across all time travel fiction, Trek or otherwise, whenever a historic tragedy is prevented it always leads to a situation where the world in general becomes much worse than if it had happened? As much as tragedy and death sucks, they have to happen, often times for the greater good. For example, the Titanic sinking led to a drastic radical reevaluation of how ships at sea operate, most notably the rule put in place since that all ships must have evacuation capabilities for double their capacity. But if time travelers stepped in to prevent that, who's learning any lessons now? Even preventable disasters and unnatural deaths can impart important lessons which can lead to improving society and the world, and by undoing them you create a world which can never grow because those lessons will never be learned.

Other Watchers that are randomized on who gets to watch others with rotating groups.
Relevancy to the question at hand is the limiter. It's far from Carte Blanche access.

Thing is, corruption happens. Having people being subjected to full telepathic scan means the telepaths have access to all their secrets and can learn something compromising about them and have the ability to blackmail them for reasons which have nothing to do with security and safety, or worse the telepaths themselves who are supposed to be protecting security can themselves become the very threat they should be preventing. No system is foolproof, and telepathic screenings will carry the added indignity of potentially humiliating the victims in an extremely unnecessary manner.

 

[fireproof78]

Other Watchers that are randomized on who gets to watch others with rotating groups.
Relevancy to the question at hand is the limiter. It's far from Carte Blanche access.

I think the below sums up my view quite well:

Thing is, corruption happens. Having people being subjected to full telepathic scan means the telepaths have access to all their secrets and can learn something compromising about them and have the ability to blackmail them for reasons which have nothing to do with security and safety, or worse the telepaths themselves who are supposed to be protecting security can themselves become the very threat they should be preventing. No system is foolproof, and telepathic screenings will carry the added indignity of potentially humiliating the victims in an extremely unnecessary manner.

Exactly so. There is no restriction on access because no one can protect against telepaths if they are "mundanes." So, the mundane people must trust the telepaths to not abuse power given to them carte blanche by the government to find "inappropriate" thought with out definition. There has been no clear delineation of power, no limit to what can be scanned in the mind probe. Why would people agree to that?

 

[SJGardner]

Thanks to you, now I’m deep in a Wikipedia rabbit hole of double agents throughout history. And I have to conclude your objection is entirely valid, I can’t find a single historical example of someone so highly placed in one intelligence community being an agent for another.

Try these guys in the IRA who were actually British intelligence
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...kQFnoECAQQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0VHylJl0oRQGbx5vkSZKk-
Most famously Denis Donaldson
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denis_Donaldson
British intelligence also had people who lived for years as different people involved in Greenpeace and CND. They went as far as getting married and having children under fake alias to then do a "tah dah" and destroy lives. Here is one example
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...IQFnoECCcQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1I4Qy1_w9oT5Hm0F1VpSgq

Don't forget Kim Philby led Section Nine of MI6 in the late years of WW2, the department responsible for anti-communist counter-intelligence, while spying for the Soviets himself.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Well sure, we know that happens, TNG had a few such episodes about telepaths using their abilities for personal gain, or at least an advantage in their work. You'll note such telepaths are always depicted in a negative light, making it clear where the franchise stand on this issue.

That was those writers then, the writing staff can change and change the message.

But you're still creating an unfair environment either way. Either people can't work for Starfleet or the government because their biology prevents them from being read by telepaths, or you have people working these jobs who are granted an exception to having their privacy invaded simply because of biology and not being able to be read by telepaths. Either way is only going to create a lot of contempt from the opposite side.

Or they develop tech that makes their mind readable by either natural telepaths or machines.
Take your pick.

One can verify and validate without invading privacy. That's common decency.

They could, but there are no limits in the future when you have the powers to peer through the mind, time, & space.
There are no secrets allowed, especially when 90,000+ lives have been lost. Countless resources have been wasted, and invaluable amounts of manpower, material, security has been set-back, Mar's Atmosphere is on fire and will take who knows how many years to put out.

The people want security, UFP & StarFleet will have to take the "Kid Gloves" off now.

So either, you can get scanned mentally by a group of randomized natural Telepaths.
Have your mind scanned by a bunch of Psycho-Tricorders run by a group of randomized Scanner Operators.
Or have the Time agency report back on any investigations they find in the future and make them use future knowledge to help investigate a persons current suspicious actions.

Which would you prefer?

Starfleet didn't allow Section 31 to do anything. Section 31 acted on its own to infect Odo. True, Starfleet decided to look the other way and ignore the matter when it was revealed after the fact, which is still pretty horrible, but is not technically the same as giving consent.

It might as well be since they knew about what happened and were silent.

Probably only one actual Starfleet officer, the one Odo met with at Starfleet Medical, and even then, they could have just been an undercover Section 31 agent. Otherwise, everyone else involved would have been Section 31 agents or scientists employed by Section 31.

Julian Bashir probably knows the security behind StarFleet Medical and what can get in/out.

It's most likely not as simple as putting a vial in your pocket and sneaking things in and swapping labels.

I'm sure there are scanners in every entrance and Transporters will be scanning for people bringing stuff in/out.

The fact that Julian Bashir suspected a group of people needed to help pull off infecting odo speaks volumes.

And we all know Julian Bashir is genetically enhanced, so his knowledge of StarFleet Medical's security protocols would be factored in to his analysis of how many people would need to be complicit to infect Odo.

Which means that it would take more than one, maybe a giant group manipulating different parts of the system to hide actions done inside StarFleet Medical.

You know what happens to real spies when they get caught, at least in the western world? Nothing. Their held in custody until such time as a deal can be made with their government for their return in exchange for something of value. This in turn creates a sense of quid pro quo in the hopes that should one of their own spies be found out in another country, those spies will be similarly treated accordingly. It's generally accepted by most governments that spying is a thing that happens and will always happen and can't be prevented. I imagine the Federation will feel otherwise. Granted, Commodore Oh is a bit of a unique case in that she caused the destruction of a planet essentially, which she would be prosecuted for if the Federation every found her.

Or if the UFP/StarFleet Time Traveled back and used future actions to prosecute her before she can do any damage.

Have you ever noticed how across all time travel fiction, Trek or otherwise, whenever a historic tragedy is prevented it always leads to a situation where the world in general becomes much worse than if it had happened? As much as tragedy and death sucks, they have to happen, often times for the greater good. For example, the Titanic sinking led to a drastic radical reevaluation of how ships at sea operate, most notably the rule put in place since that all ships must have evacuation capabilities for double their capacity. But if time travelers stepped in to prevent that, who's learning any lessons now? Even preventable disasters and unnatural deaths can impart important lessons which can lead to improving society and the world, and by undoing them you create a world which can never grow because those lessons will never be learned.

Not all fiction, there are plenty of Time Travel fiction where you change history for the better by changing events in the past.

And with Time Travel being common knowledge and do-able via simple Light-Speed Break-away, you can bring the knowledge of future events, change the past, and still retain the knowledge learned without having to actually lose lives in the process.

Imagine the improvements that can be had without the loss of lives in the process or waste in resources.

Thing is, corruption happens. Having people being subjected to full telepathic scan means the telepaths have access to all their secrets and can learn something compromising about them and have the ability to blackmail them for reasons which have nothing to do with security and safety, or worse the telepaths themselves who are supposed to be protecting security can themselves become the very threat they should be preventing. No system is foolproof, and telepathic screenings will carry the added indignity of potentially humiliating the victims in an extremely unnecessary manner.

So what's your solution, never use Telepathy to your advantage, and hope for the best? Cross your Fingers, knock on wood?
Depend on the Time Travel division to clean up after the damage is done?

It's usually easier to prevent a problem in the first place by rooting it out in it's early stages then to have to go back and clean up the problem after the damage is done.

If your family could be saved by sacrificing your dignity for a few seconds, would you do it?
Or would you condemn them to die because you wouldn't give up that little bit of dignity to help out?
What if it wasn't just your family, what if there were more lives on the line?
How many deaths is worth that little bit of dignity?

I think the below sums up my view quite well:

Exactly so. There is no restriction on access because no one can protect against telepaths if they are "mundanes." So, the mundane people must trust the telepaths to not abuse power given to them carte blanche by the government to find "inappropriate" thought with out definition. There has been no clear delineation of power, no limit to what can be scanned in the mind probe. Why would people agree to that?

I already told you what the delineation is. Go read my previous posts.

Well, if you don't agree to be scanned, you'll always be on the suspect list should something go wrong.
If somebody else volunteers willingly, they get cleared away quickly and move off the suspect list.
If you're the last one of the group who refuses to volunteer to be scanned, then more suspicion will fall on you.

Then the investigation team will start prying into every little detail of what you have done.

Then they'll contact their future counterparts through the Department of Temporal Investigations and use "Future Knowledge" to help narrow the suspects.

You might not like what the future finds out about you or what you have done, may have done in the future, or may not have done in the past.

Remember, they have the ability to peer through time & space, and then they have no bounds because they can observe your reality over long periods of time.

With the Temporal Powers they have, they can watch you like you were a character in a secretly filmed Reality Show.

Guess what else they will find and feed back through investigations.

If you thought your privacy was violated by a few itty bitty mind scans.

Imagine what Official Temporal Investigations will learn when they monitor giant chunks of your life and everything leading up to whatever incident they are investigating.

=D

Years to decades of your life, logged and monitored / processed by countless analysts along with AI computers.

All your personal actions, your daily routine, your sex life, your showers, etc.

Nothing will be safe from the eyes of Temporal Investigations when they have to scrub through enormous chunks of your life to find the relevant piece of info.

 

[Ragitsu]

your sex life

Well, you'd want to go easy on them, wouldn't you?

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Well, you'd want to go easy on them, wouldn't you?

Sexpionage is a real issue.

Same with Honey Traps along with leaking information while in bed / sex.

We're all adults here, and in the 22nd century and beyond, we should move past modern Puritanical views on Sex, no matter the type, the species, how many partners, whatever kink / fetish you may have.

There are no limits on sex in the future, and you shouldn't shame somebody for having preferences that may differ from what you find to be normal.

Please be respectful of what they might enjoy or not enjoy.

That persons Sexual Preferences & Sex Life aren't for you to judge.

Leaking of critical information is a real problem.

 

[Ragitsu]

Sexpionage is a real issue.

Same with Honey Traps along with leaking information while in bed / sex.

We're all adults here, and in the 22nd century and beyond, we should move past modern Puritanical views on Sex, no matter the type, the species, how many partners, whatever kink / fetish you may have.

There are no limits on sex in the future, and you shouldn't shame somebody for having preferences that may differ from what you find to be normal.

Please be respectful of what they might enjoy or not enjoy.

That persons Sexual Preferences & Sex Life aren't for you to judge.

Leaking of critical information is a real problem.

I was jesting. You know...their job is going to fly by because of a lack of pertinent activity.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

I was jesting. You know...their job is going to fly by because of a lack of pertinent activity.

We'll see, it all depends on what is "Pertinent" to the investigation.

 

[fireproof78]

Then the investigation team will start prying into every little detail of what you have done.

And it's confirmed-thought police. Thank you for confirming my suspicion. This is pretty much out of step with Star Trek as a whole, and the path of the franchise. It's the same type of attitude that created "The Drumhead" and the attempted coup by Leyton in "Paradise Lost." It just comes in the name of security and promises freedom while invading privacy.

I already told you what the delineation is. Go read my previous posts.

"Information that is pertinent" or some sort of vague nonsense. There was no limit whatsoever.

Good to know how this will progress.

 

[Tuskin38]

Why are you people still entertaining this fascism?

 

[fireproof78]

Why are you people still entertaining this fascism?

I've said my piece on what it actually is. No limits and no protections. I'm done here.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

And it's confirmed-thought police. Thank you for confirming my suspicion. This is pretty much out of step with Star Trek as a whole, and the path of the franchise. It's the same type of attitude that created "The Drumhead" and the attempted coup by Leyton in "Paradise Lost." It just comes in the name of security and promises freedom while invading privacy.

Ben Sisko made the hardest sacrifice/decision in "The Pale Moonlight". And it was a key / pivotal decision that won the Dominion War.

"Information that is pertinent" or some sort of vague nonsense. There was no limit whatsoever.

Good to know how this will progress.

So you're going to do absolutely nothing, let Commodore Oh, & the Zhat Vash / Tal Shiar win by murdering 90,000+ innocent UFP Citizens, destroy countless vessels, destroy mars, leak countless state secrets.

Let countless Romulan Lives perish because the Rescue Fleet gets sabotaged by one of their own.

All in the name of your personal dignity.

Future Infiltrators will do the same thing or worse.

You'd rather see the innocent people die to hold onto your little dignity and help prevent another incident or use time travel to fix it?

How about this, UFP / StarFleet will need Warrants before they scan your mind for Telepathy.

Will that make you feel better?

UFP / StarFleet can't willy nilly scan you. They need "Probable Cause" and a "Warrant Approval from a judge" before they can scan you.

At least you're under suspicion and they went through the proper legal process before they can legally scan you telepathically.

Does that make it better for you? They went through all the standard legal channels during a investigation?

 

[thribs]

Just have Q snap them away. Surprised he hasn’t done it for Discovery

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Just have Q snap them away. Surprised he hasn’t done it for Discovery

When has "Q" ever been helpful in a crisis that wasn't of his own doing?

 

[The Wormhole]

So what's your solution, never use Telepathy to your advantage, and hope for the best? Cross your Fingers, knock on wood?

If the alternative is living in the fascist police state you keep outlining, then Sweet Fuck YES, that is my solution.

 

[JoaquinSlowly]

If the alternative is living in the fascist police state you keep outlining, then Sweet Fuck YES, that is my solution.

Super same. The solution to prevent potential corruption by providing a new, direct avenue for corruption through wild overreach is one of the most anti-Trek notions ‪‪I can imagine.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

If the alternative is living in the fascist police state you keep outlining, then Sweet Fuck YES, that is my solution.

Fine, we'll require warrants approved by judges along with "Probable Cause" during the investigation before the Telepathic scanning becomes a viable option.

Does that make you feel better? There's more checks & balances.

The UFP / Government can't randomly scan you.

So what will you do about Commodore Oh issue and the 90,000+ dead and how to prevent that from happening?