What's in a Name? Dagger of the Mind & Mirror, Mirror

[Henoch]

Adams's plan for Kirk? Just take his actions at simple face value:
1. Brainwash Kirk so he is "madly in love with Helen, Captain. You'd lie, cheat, steal for her, sacrifice your career, your reputation." His plan is to hold Helen on Tantalus and force Kirk to do his bidding by threatening her life.
2. Adams lets Kirk return to the Enterprise to clear up the official report on Van Gelder, order the return Van Gelder to Tantalus.
3. Kirk tells Spock and McCoy that Helen was so impressed with Adams's work that she requested transfer to the facility which Kirk approves. "Yeoman, please gather up her belongings from her quarters and beam them down."
4. Order the Enterprise to leave Tantalus and continue on to the mission task. (My theory: Over a short time, Kirk may resign from Starfleet and secretly return to Tantalus to be with Helen where they live in brainwashed loving bliss with each other. Adams is not a monster, after all. Happy ending.)

Adam's downfall was he was unaware of the ancient Vulcan technique of Mind Meld, and Helen's kickass capability.

 

[vandevere]

Adams's plan for Kirk? Just take his actions at simple face value:
1. Brainwash Kirk so he is "madly in love with Helen, Captain. You'd lie, cheat, steal for her, sacrifice your career, your reputation." His plan is to hold Helen on Tantalus and force Kirk to do his bidding by threatening her life.
2. Adams lets Kirk return to the Enterprise to clear up the official report on Van Gelder, order the return Van Gelder to Tantalus.
3. Kirk tells Spock and McCoy that Helen was so impressed with Adams's work that she requested transfer to the facility which Kirk approves. "Yeoman, please gather up her belongings from her quarters and beam them down."
4. Order the Enterprise to leave Tantalus and continue on to the mission task. (My theory: Over a short time, Kirk may resign from Starfleet and secretly return to Tantalus to be with Helen where they live in brainwashed loving bliss with each other. Adams is not a monster, after all. Happy ending.)

Adam's downfall was he was unaware of the ancient Vulcan technique of Mind Meld, and Helen's kickass capability.

And he also underestimated Van Gelder's determination to escape and let others know what was being done on Tantalus. I'm sure Adams had Van Gelder held in what he thought was secure containment.

In spite of crippling psychosis, Van Gelder (A) heard there was a starship arriving that would beam up materials for delivery to Stockholm, (B) was capable of understanding what that meant, and (C) was capable of coming up with an escape plan and carrying it out.

Again, all of this whilst under the effects of crippling psychosis...

 

[Henoch]

Part of me wants to believe that Adams didn't specifically brainwash Van Gelder against escape from Tantalus. With its security systems and remote visitations, Adams didn't anticipate the scenario. I think this is confirmed based on how "pain free" Van Gelder acted during his escape. The crippling psychosis only started during his attempts to tell anyone who he is and what is happening on Tantalus.

 

[FormerLurker]

Did you keep bumping your head on the ceiling?

No. Above me in the darkness is where the presence that made me uneasy lurked.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

No. Above me in the darkness is where the presence that made me uneasy lurked.

I thought you were quoting from Michael O'Donoghue's "Last Voyage of the Starship Enterprise" sketch from SNL (8:37 in the clip below).

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[Captain Tracy]

Adams's plan for Kirk? Just take his actions at simple face value:
1. Brainwash Kirk so he is "madly in love with Helen, Captain. You'd lie, cheat, steal for her, sacrifice your career, your reputation." His plan is to hold Helen on Tantalus and force Kirk to do his bidding by threatening her life.
2. Adams lets Kirk return to the Enterprise to clear up the official report on Van Gelder, order the return Van Gelder to Tantalus.
3. Kirk tells Spock and McCoy that Helen was so impressed with Adams's work that she requested transfer to the facility which Kirk approves. "Yeoman, please gather up her belongings from her quarters and beam them down."
4. Order the Enterprise to leave Tantalus and continue on to the mission task. (My theory: Over a short time, Kirk may resign from Starfleet and secretly return to Tantalus to be with Helen where they live in brainwashed loving bliss with each other. Adams is not a monster, after all. Happy ending.)

Adam's downfall was he was unaware of the ancient Vulcan technique of Mind Meld, and Helen's kickass capability.

That's very good; and, could quite likely be Adams' goal/rational/extended plan; and, just as it was with Van Gelder, it is likely Kirk's conditioning is not going to be able to keep Kirk from warning Spock and McCoy as soon as he is back on the ship - and stop that plan from succeeding.

What's interesting is, the more we discuss Adams, the more it seem to me, the protection of his sinister secret is the thing of paramount importance; which makes Dr. Adams feel much more a truly evil monster to me, than just another scientist gone off the rails - like Dr. Daystrum, for example

 

[cgervasi]

I like these speculations about Adams' long-term plans. When I first saw the show, as a kid, I thought when Adams' caught Kirk and Noel in the treatment room on their own, he figured they were very close to figuring out the whole thing. When Adams catches them and wants to stop them, he doesn't think of using a phaser. As he said earlier, medical equipment is to him what a phaser is to Kirk. So he uses the medical equipment as a weapon, carrying along Noel's fantasy romance suggestion without a solid plan. It's like Kirk was about to expose the whole thing, so he had nothing to lose by attacking him at the moment.

Now when I watch it I don't see Adams as caught and acting in desperation. He's so used to be the absolute ruler, literally controlling peoples minds, a whole genre of dirty story or so I've heard, that he's lost track of his limitations. It's another variation on the Star Trek theme of absolute power leading to decadence.

I think the episode is also saying Adams' work to reform prisons and mental hospitals got him a get-out-of-jail-free card. Advocates for humane treatment of prisoners wouldn't want to believe Adams was a criminals. They'd want to believe it was whoever supported more punitive treatment of criminals. So Adams starts as a advocate for reducing abuse in prisons, succeeds and is widely credited as a great humanitarian, and he ends up using the impunity that comes with that to abuse prisoner. It's ironic, and it rings more true to me now in middle age than as a child.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

I think the episode is also saying Adams' work to reform prisons and mental hospitals got him a get-out-of-jail-free card. Advocates for humane treatment of prisoners wouldn't want to believe Adams was a criminals. They'd want to believe it was whoever supported more punitive treatment of criminals. So Adams starts as a advocate for reducing abuse in prisons, succeeds and is widely credited as a great humanitarian, and he ends up using the impunity that comes with that to abuse prisoner. It's ironic, and it rings more true to me now in middle age than as a child.

Somebody might correct me on this, but I think Star Trek was airing at a time when the American left was just beginning to get the idea that mental hospitals were cruel and therefore should be eliminated. This grew into what was called the deinstitutionalization movement, which has arguably gone way too far, and the insane are now either homeless or in jail.

But the show didn't take a very strong stand on the issue. Both of our insane asylum episodes start them out as very bad places, but end up saying it just matters who is in charge. Come to think of it, that was smarter than what America ended up doing.

 

[Captain Tracy]

I like these speculations about Adams' long-term plans. When I first saw the show, as a kid, I thought when Adams' caught Kirk and Noel in the treatment room on their own, he figured they were very close to figuring out the whole thing. When Adams catches them and wants to stop them, he doesn't think of using a phaser. As he said earlier, medical equipment is to him what a phaser is to Kirk. So he uses the medical equipment as a weapon, carrying along Noel's fantasy romance suggestion without a solid plan. It's like Kirk was about to expose the whole thing, so he had nothing to lose by attacking him at the moment.

Now when I watch it I don't see Adams as caught and acting in desperation. He's so used to be the absolute ruler, literally controlling peoples minds, a whole genre of dirty story or so I've heard, that he's lost track of his limitations. It's another variation on the Star Trek theme of absolute power leading to decadence.

I think the episode is also saying Adams' work to reform prisons and mental hospitals got him a get-out-of-jail-free card. Advocates for humane treatment of prisoners wouldn't want to believe Adams was a criminals. They'd want to believe it was whoever supported more punitive treatment of criminals. So Adams starts as a advocate for reducing abuse in prisons, succeeds and is widely credited as a great humanitarian, and he ends up using the impunity that comes with that to abuse prisoner. It's ironic, and it rings more true to me now in middle age than as a child.

Yes!, Yes! Yes! THIS.

Excellent.

Through our discussions of the Adams' character, and, the horrifying extrapolated revelation - thank you, @ZapBrannigan - which draws on speculative implications, yet arrives at a plausible conclusion of what is most likely really going on beneath of surface of the planet, down in the deep abyss that is used a dungeon of torment and suffering;

and,

took me from only ever seeing Adams as this Saturday-morning, hammy-buffoon who misuses his techno-gizmo on the Captain; and - just as you have pointed-out so well, above - to, in my case, nearly 50 years later, seeing Adams as one of the most horrible and terrifying unseen monsters in the pantheon of Star Trek villains.

The net-effect on me is, 'Dagger', was always just a good, but more of less routine TOS episode;

and now,

has been turned into a VERY terrifying story; by implication of what we don't see: the victimization of Adams' patient-prisoners; we do not hear their screams of panicked violation, while kept helpless in the night;

and thereby, for me, raising 'Dagger,' the TV episode, into one of TOS's most horrifying - all these years later!

Somebody might correct me on this, but I think Star Trek was airing at a time when the American left was just beginning to get the idea that mental hospitals were cruel and therefore should be eliminated. This grew into what was called the deinstitutionalization movement, which has arguably gone way too far, and the insane are now either homeless or in jail.

But the show didn't take a very strong stand on the issue. Both of our insane asylum episodes start them out as very bad places, but end up saying it just matters who is in charge. Come to think of it, that was smarter than what America ended up doing.

Yes!!!

With just one such popular catch-phrase of the day being: Question Authority.

Donn Pierce's 1965 novel, and the subsequent Oscar-award winning film, for Best Adapted Screenplay, explored the - unseen-to-the-public - horrific, brutal, and harsh reality lurking within and behind the locked doors of American institutional-systems; in 1967's, Cool Hand Luke;

and,

While the movie would not come out until 1975, Ken Kesey's novel, One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest, - while presented as comedy/drama - was published in 1962; and yet, still points to much of which you have stated in your post.

Excellent.

 

[Neopeius]

has been turned into a VERY terrifying story; by implication of what we don't see: the victimization of Adams' patient-prisoners; we do not hear their screams of panicked violation, while kept helpless in the night;

and thereby, for me, raising 'Dagger,' the TV episode, into one of TOS's most horrifying - all these years later!

Mindrape is my wife's hot button -- it just squicks her to no end. So this particular episode has always been the most disturbing for her. It's really quite a good piece, very horrific. Out of the 12 episodes we've seen thus far, it ranks #5 in aggregate.

Interestingly, Trek's sister show across the Atlantic, Space Patrol Orion, had a similar setting for an episode around the same time. Cora covered it.

 

[cgervasi]

Both of our insane asylum episodes start them out as very bad places, but end up saying it just matters who is in charge.

So many Star Trek episodes are about how having too much power makes people decadent. At the beginning of Dagger of the Mind, Kirk praises how humane institutions following Adams' methods are. McCoy says a cage is a cage. It seems like McCoy is right because jailers will inevitably become despotic.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

Somebody might correct me on this, but I think Star Trek was airing at a time when the American left was just beginning to get the idea that mental hospitals were cruel and therefore should be eliminated. This grew into what was called the deinstitutionalization movement, which has arguably gone way too far, and the insane are now either homeless or in jail.

That can largely be traced to the Reagan Administration repealing most of the Mental Health Systems Act of 1980.

But since this isn't The Neutral Zone, I'm just going to leave it there. I'm not going to get dragged into a big debate/argument about it.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

That can largely be traced to the Reagan Administration repealing most of the Mental Health Systems Act of 1980.

But since this isn't The Neutral Zone, I'm just going to leave it there. I'm not going to get dragged into a big debate/argument about it.

The Mental Health System Act was part of the deinstitutionalization movement. The "community mental health support systems" bit is an airy concept that was supposed to replace mental hospital confinement. It wasn't going to work with Federal money any more than it has worked with state and local money. The whole theory has been a disaster. So I still think America made a mistake with deinstitutionalization, and neither political party has come close to fixing it.

 

[1001001]

Moving on...