The Lesley Crusher idea

[Shamrock Holmes]

I was in high school when TNG premiered, but IIRC what cheesed me off most about Wesley was his eager-to-please disposition and what felt like his frequent saving of the ship and his interactions with the senior staff. It wasn't that I was jealous; it was that I thought it was flat-out unrealistic. Where were his friends? How did he spend his time when he wasn't playing Acting Ensign? Are there really teenagers who act this way?

As someone who spent more time around his teachers rather than his classmates when the option was available I never found it particularly odd (although IMO both Nog and Seaquest's Lucas Wolenczak were better at this). However, I do agree that Wesley's character would have been better served by showing more of his interractions with his peers or even other junior officers (What relationship if any did he have with Ogawa, Gates, Jae, Wallace? Did he and Taurik ever meet?).

I think there were a number of pre-TrekLit novels that did a better job with his character than the series often did (The Eyes of the Beholders by AC Crispin, Perchance to Dream by Howard Weinstein and Q-in-Law are three that stand out as having a decent bit of character time for Wes in a more realistic way).

 

[Orphalesion]

I think there were a number of pre-TrekLit novels that did a better job with his character than the series often did (The Eyes of the Beholders by AC Crispin, Perchance to Dream by Howard Weinstein and Q-in-Law are three that stand out as having a decent bit of character time for Wes in a more realistic way).

What did they do better?

 

[Phoenix219]

I have known people like that in real life. The attach themselves to an organization like emt, firefighter, and wear as much official garb and carry as many official gadgets as they can to give themselves legitimacy. It's a weird mix of brown nosing and arrogance and a bit of know-it-all syndrome.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

What did they do better?

The Eyes of the Beholder had Wesley as one of the mentors (along with Selar) of a young blind Andorian girl who was orphaned during Q Who?, Perchance to Dream had him as the squad leader of a group of Enterprise teens on a pre-Academy training mission (with Troi and Data as observers); Q-in-Law had him forge a friendship with the teenage "Romeo and Juliet-style" couple at the centre of the plot and struggle with the moral and ethnical issues surrounding them "gifting" a girl to him with no restrictions.

I suppose that we got hints of most of that in various episodes it just seemed more in the books.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

The only part that I didn't like was a scene in Q-in-Law were Wes reacted quicker than two lieutenants and an ensign (all exclusive to that book) to an emergency situation on the Bridge. Oddly, while Peter David notes that O'Brien "distantly outranked him" (which retroactively appear to be the case), but more relevantly fails to note Wesley being the lowest ranked person on the Bridge. Unless there's a rule that "helmsman commands unless a senior officer is present", then either Clapp or Burnside should have taken command after Worf -- the duty officer -- left the Bridge.

 

[Charles Phipps]

As someone who spent more time around his teachers rather than his classmates when the option was available I never found it particularly odd (although IMO both Nog and Seaquest's Lucas Wolenczak were better at this). However, I do agree that Wesley's character would have been better served by showing more of his interractions with his peers or even other junior officers (What relationship if any did he have with Ogawa, Gates, Jae, Wallace? Did he and Taurik ever meet?).

I think the problem wouldn't have been helped because those people who wanted Star Trek to not be the kind of series where a teenager is the helmsman on a starship would not appreciate more inclusion of teenagers. Mind you, I blame them and not the concept. Star Trek is silly and that's part of the fun.

 

[DonIago]

My problems with Wesley have relatively little to do with him simply manning the helm. I could accept that easily enough as a sort of internship...though it is a bit of a stretch that he'd be doing so during red alert situations.

 

[Therin of Andor]

The Traveler would have had to be a female otherwise the creepiness would have gone off the scale.

Remember in Diane Duane's original novel, "The Wounded Sky", the alien being with the power to move the starship into other distant locales was a female, transparent "glass" arachnid. (In the book's blurb she was a "pretty alien scientist"!)

 

[Orphalesion]

though it is a bit of a stretch that he'd be doing so during red alert situations.

But Star Trek is a drama show, so naturally you want your main character where the action is. So to me that's an acceptable stretch

 

[DonIago]

Out of universe, sure. In universe, not so much.

 

[suarezguy]

I first started watching TNG (reruns) around 9 so for me Wesley was while still a kid also quite notably older, very much both someone like me as well as someone to aspire to be, and for me he worked a lot and I liked him in both roles/ways.

I think the he was always saving the ship/smarter than the adults Groan complaint is very overstated, I think he only did it two or three memorable times.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

I think he only did it two or three memorable times.

And at least a couple of those -- Where No One Has Gone Before and When the Bough Breaks -- were actually quite reasonable if you squint.

 

[Sisko_is_my_captain]

Q-in-Law had him forge a friendship with the teenage "Romeo and Juliet-style" couple at the centre of the plot and struggle with the moral and ethnical issues surrounding them "gifting" a girl to him with no restrictions.

Oh man, I had forgotten about the gifted girl and how Wes inevitably ended up banging his head on the wall in sexual frustration. He really was a gentleman with her, though, IIRC. Although whether that was more because he was a virgin terrified by the adults into dutiful abstinence, or a genuinely decent person, I don't recall.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

His mental dialogue seemed to lean towards the latter IIRC, but it's been a while since I've read the whole book so...

 

[lesliecrusher]

My username obligates me to resurrect this thread lol clearly, I've thought about this idea a lot over the years. I always appreciated that the writers (or some of them, anyway) acknowledged that a female teenaged character would be doing something different that probably would have been worth doing at the time. However, I also understand that if the character had been written the same but as a girl, the amount and intensity of dislike would have likely been a lot more than annoyance.

The casting call draft for the character is a hoot:

LESLIE CRUSHER – An appealing 15 year old Caucasian girl (need small 18 or almost 18 to play 15). Her remarkable mind and photographic memory make it seem not unlikely for her to become, at 15, a Starfleet acting-ensign. Otherwise, she is a normal teenager.

I also admit that part of why I like to riff on this idea is more about giving Beverly the character development I've always wished she'd gotten. The mother-daughter dynamic would have given both characters a lot.

 

[Dukhat]

However, I also understand that if the character had been written the same but as a girl, the amount and intensity of dislike would have likely been a lot more than annoyance.

While I don't quite agree with that statement, the inherent problem with the character had nothing to do with their sex. It had to do with a 14 year-old kid solving all the problems that the adult crew couldn't, and making that crew look like idiots. If Wesley (or Leslie, for that matter) wasn't written to be a brainiac, and instead was just a normal kid, then I doubt there would have been such vitriol about the character than there originally was.

 

[lesliecrusher]

While I don't quite agree with that statement, the inherent problem with the character had nothing to do with their sex. It had to do with a 14 year-old kid solving all the problems that the adult crew couldn't, and making that crew look like idiots. If Wesley (or Leslie, for that matter) wasn't written to be a brainiac, and instead was just a normal kid, then I doubt there would have been such vitriol about the character than there originally was.

True, a know-it-all tends to be obnoxious in any manifestation lol

Also, I'm sorry, I'm new here and I just realized that this thread might be too old to bring back...I legit was like, "2021, that's only like a year ago!"

Um, no, it was like 4 years ago.

 

[Dukhat]

True, a know-it-all tends to be obnoxious in any manifestation lol

Also, I'm sorry, I'm new here and I just realized that this thread might be too old to bring back...I legit was like, "2021, that's only like a year ago!"

Um, no, it was like 4 years ago.

Yeah, you probably should have started a new thread, but that's a newbie mistake and not the end of the world

 

[Mutai Sho-Rin]

True, a know-it-all tends to be obnoxious in any manifestation lol

Also, I'm sorry, I'm new here and I just realized that this thread might be too old to bring back...I legit was like, "2021, that's only like a year ago!"

Um, no, it was like 4 years ago.

And your friendly geriatric moderator forgives you, especially after you learned the error of your ways. LL&P, go and sin no more.

 

[carcinoGeneticist]

While I don't quite agree with that statement, the inherent problem with the character had nothing to do with their sex. It had to do with a 14 year-old kid solving all the problems that the adult crew couldn't, and making that crew look like idiots. If Wesley (or Leslie, for that matter) wasn't written to be a brainiac, and instead was just a normal kid, then I doubt there would have been such vitriol about the character than there originally was.

If Wesley or Leslie was just a normal kid, then the character probably wouldn't be anywheres near as important to the story as what ended up happening with the character, because part of what makes Wesley stick out is that he's a bridge officer at his young age.