My DS9 Rewatch Odyssey
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They have kids. Kids are civilians. If Sisko thinks of Kids and their families as soldiers then he's an even bigger asshole than I thought.
There are limits to how much you can stretch things to justify terrible actions.
War sucks. Don't bring your children.
Then the Maquis parents who kept their kids on those colonies...knowing full well how Cardassians treat people, all while staging their own aggressive actions... are terrible parents. They should have had them stay with relatives further inside Federation space. Or simply take them and leave the colonies. Their parenting skills are on par with the Hansens and taking their little girl with them looking for Borg.
I am actually on the side of the Maquis, because they never should have had to give up their worlds. But when they went from defense to open aggression and attacking outside their territory, they lost my sympathy.
Hell, I could see any of the Maquis who were as crazy as Eddington was deliberately keeping their children around thinking that would make the Federation less likely to take action against them.
It probably worked in some cases, too.
It's a time-honored tactic for terrorists to blend in with civilian populations to weaken the appetite to attack them.
It probably worked in some cases, too.
It's a time-honored tactic for terrorists to blend in with civilian populations to weaken the appetite to attack them.
That still doesn't excuse Sisko's behavior a single bit. You know that's funny because the American system of justice specifically forbids attacking a victim's character as a system of defense. Nothing you can say about their parents and their faults justifies one bit what Sisko did. You can't even be sure that the whole maquis was behind these attacks for all we know, Eddington could be head of a rogue organization that was disapproved by the majority but even if it was unanimous, even if every adult was Ok with what Eddington was doing that STILL do not EXCUSE SISKO ATTACKING THESE KIDS!!!
Let's face it Sisko is a criminal in this episode and if there was any justice in this parody of a show, he'd have been court-martialled, demoted to able crewman, and would spend the next ten years in a penitential colony!!
Maybe the same place where Michael Burnam was headed after her court-martial.
This is not about sympathizing with the Maquis, this is about Sisko!! How hard is it to understand?
In the USA, if you kill someone on their way to execution, you'll be charged with murder! The excuse,"hey, he was about to die anyway." is no excuse as far as the law is concerned.
In my country, this isn't a problem since we don't have the death penalty. It's been abolished nearly fifty years ago and even then it was rarely used.
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Yeah, so it's normal to kill children as long as you've rationalized it beforehand, right?
That's clearly not what he wrote.Yeah, so it's normal to kill children as long as you've rationalized it beforehand, right?
War changes the normal moral calculations, and the presence of civilians being increasingly difficult to disentangle from the militiary in the course of war. Being willing to attack targets in the presence of civilians has been generally seen as giving moral license to do the same to the other side.
Or, as Churchill put it, "You do your worst, and we will do our best."
Totally on the same wavelength. I actually thought of Kirk deliberately destroying Landru and Vaal in TOS and leaving those civilisations in a likely state of PTSD and inability to function. Then there’s Picard letting an entire planet die just because...Prime Directive. You missed out one of the very worst for me: Janeway marching Tuvix to his death, something I never ever forgave the character for. Those are things I couldn’t justify and the latter only happened because the writers had written themselves into a corner.
With regard to “For the Uniform”, while I do sympathise with the fact the Federation lost the Maquis their homes, the fact is that law is law and you can like it or not, but if you deliberately go against the law you’re going to have to deal with the repercussions. The Maquis have well and truly crossed a line: they pretty much immediately immolated all the noble values of the Federation in order to become terrorist and killers. Their first official act was to destroy an entire Cardassian ship with all hands aboard. They’re unable to see beyond the tips of their own noses because they are blinded by a sense of victimisation and entitlement. Like bratty children, they want what they want and they don’t care about the consequences of their actions.
I can’t help but side with Sisko here. He basically gave the Maquis a taste of their own medicine. If you can’t take it yourself you shouldn’t dish it out. Make no mistake, this situation needed a “take no shit” approach and it worked. I still think Sisko may have got a slap on the wrist from Starfleet for his radical actions, but he got results and he successfully contained the Maquis threat. Some seem to think he’s committed genocide but there are absolutely no indications that a single person was hurt. If they had been it most certainly would have been noted in the log at the end.
I also agree that if the Maquis were so concerned about their kids they shouldn’t have joined a fucking terrorist organisation and made their kids live amid what is, for all intents and purposes, a war zone. FarscapeOne is totally right—this places them akin to VOYAGER’s Hansens’ on the horrendous parents scale!
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“IN PURGATORY’S SHADOW”
“WHAT did you say?”
“I said your former Captain had terrible taste in tea.”
“That’s what I thought you said...”
“In Purgatory’s Shadow” is a series high point; one that sees DS9 playing to its greatest strengths and deftly interweaving plot and character development while advancing the overall series arc in a way that’s frankly flawless.
After an unfocused start to the fifth season, I believe “Rapture” was the episode that saw the writers crystallise their vision and reach a new and much needed sense of focus, drive and commitment. This is basically where the series has been headed from the moment the Dominion were introduced two and a half seasons ago and, although it’s taken a long time to get to this point, it’s really rather glorious.
“Purgatory” has the feel of a season finale, with a great deal of setup and an inevitable cliff-hanger looming. In many respects, there’s a feel of chess pieces being moved about a board, but, fortunately, the execution is uniformly brilliant. It’s great to get some follow up to the third season’s watershed episode “The Die is Cast” with the unexpected return of a character we’d all probably assumed dead. It’s a Garak-heavy episode and Andrew Robinson is at his scene-stealing best, and, once again, he and Worf make an excellent, highly entertaining pairing (my favourite line: “I’d like to get my hands on that fellow Earl Grey and teach him a thing or two about tealeaves”, not to mention the hilarious exchange where Garak claims to want to join Starfleet!).
Twists and turns abound, from the return of Enabran Tain and the revelation that he is Garak’s father (and a fairly shitty one at that), to the reappearance of Martok (the real Martok this time!) and the presence of a certain doctor at the Jem’Hadar’s internment camp. Sure, there’s a touch of small universe syndrome going on—presumably the Dominion have no shortage of such prisons, yet this one happens to be chock full of familiar faces. But, aside from that, it makes for utterly compelling viewing.
The Bashir-Changeling story is one of the show’s all-time greatest twists, although I frankly wish they hadn’t given him the old-style uniform, which implies this was planned well in advance when I’m pretty sure it was only decided when the writers came to breaking the scripts for this two-parter. I’m still not entirely convinced it WAS the Changeling operating on Sisko in “Rapture”, for instance—I can understand how a Changeling could mimic Bashir’s appearance, but how would it acquire years worth of medical training and experience? In my head cannon, perhaps Bashir was simply wearing his old uniform the day he was caught because they hadn’t yet been made mandatory...or perhaps he spilled raktajino over his new outfit and had to change into his blue-shouldered suit. In an ideal world, if DS9 had been more meticulously planned, we’d have seen subtle clues for weeks or months in advance, something DISCOVERY later did nicely with Captain Lorca. Not to be a downer, though—it’s a fascinating and thoroughly creepy twist, featuring a particularly amusing red herring of a scene where Bashir-Changeling—which I’ll henceforth call Bashireling—takes sandwiches to O’Brien and Dax as they’re working to collapse the wormhole. The way the sequence is directed, we half expect he’s about to do something majorly bad, such as phaser down everyone in Ops, but...no, he’s just, bizarrely, delivering lunch. I also loved his subtle “here goes nothing” as the plan is set in motion and fails—fails because he sabotaged it, the rotter.
It’s great to have Dukat back and edging back into the part he was born to play: series antagonist. Really, the last couple of seasons the writers haven’t seemed to know quite what to do with him, trying perhaps a little too hard to present him as a reformed and likeable guy with a “colourful past” and giving him a rather unsuccessful stint as dashing, romantic freedom fighter. But he’s superb here, and this episode neatly sets up the mind-blowing twist to come in the second part. I loved his menacing scene with Kira and the confrontation with Garak in which Garak not only emerges unscathed but also unleashes some superb, witty retorts that truly put Dukat in his place. I’m not terribly sold on Melanie Smith’s performance as Ziyal (the third) here, but she does the job, and it’s interesting to see the narcissistic rage she unwittingly unleashes in her father when she chooses Garak over him. Ouch.
Lots of great character moments abound and just about all the cast get a moment to shine. It seems crazy to think that these were the very same writers that wrote the abomination that was “Let He Who is Without Sin...” because they do such great character work here and keep the plot on course right up to what must be the greatest Star Trek cliff-hangers since “The Best of Both Worlds, Part I”. As Sisko mutters at one point, “May God help us all!” Here’s a niggle, though. Starfleet has known about the Dominion for nearly three years now. Preparations to fend off an invasion began immediately after Sisko’s first encounter with them and the destruction of the Odyssey. Sure, we have the Defiant now, but shouldn’t Starfleet have stayed at least on permanent yellow alert? The nearest starships are TWO DAYS AWAY from the station! Whoever is responsible for fleet deployment truly needs a kick up the ass. Just because the threat appeared to become less immediate, Starfleet should never have let their guard down.
Anyway, that about covers it! A thoroughly engaging, exciting, enjoyable episode that really sees the series playing to all its strengths and delivering some killer twists and one of Trek’s best cliff-hangers to boot. Rating: 10
“WHAT did you say?”
“I said your former Captain had terrible taste in tea.”
“That’s what I thought you said...”
“In Purgatory’s Shadow” is a series high point; one that sees DS9 playing to its greatest strengths and deftly interweaving plot and character development while advancing the overall series arc in a way that’s frankly flawless.
After an unfocused start to the fifth season, I believe “Rapture” was the episode that saw the writers crystallise their vision and reach a new and much needed sense of focus, drive and commitment. This is basically where the series has been headed from the moment the Dominion were introduced two and a half seasons ago and, although it’s taken a long time to get to this point, it’s really rather glorious.
“Purgatory” has the feel of a season finale, with a great deal of setup and an inevitable cliff-hanger looming. In many respects, there’s a feel of chess pieces being moved about a board, but, fortunately, the execution is uniformly brilliant. It’s great to get some follow up to the third season’s watershed episode “The Die is Cast” with the unexpected return of a character we’d all probably assumed dead. It’s a Garak-heavy episode and Andrew Robinson is at his scene-stealing best, and, once again, he and Worf make an excellent, highly entertaining pairing (my favourite line: “I’d like to get my hands on that fellow Earl Grey and teach him a thing or two about tealeaves”, not to mention the hilarious exchange where Garak claims to want to join Starfleet!).
Twists and turns abound, from the return of Enabran Tain and the revelation that he is Garak’s father (and a fairly shitty one at that), to the reappearance of Martok (the real Martok this time!) and the presence of a certain doctor at the Jem’Hadar’s internment camp. Sure, there’s a touch of small universe syndrome going on—presumably the Dominion have no shortage of such prisons, yet this one happens to be chock full of familiar faces. But, aside from that, it makes for utterly compelling viewing.
The Bashir-Changeling story is one of the show’s all-time greatest twists, although I frankly wish they hadn’t given him the old-style uniform, which implies this was planned well in advance when I’m pretty sure it was only decided when the writers came to breaking the scripts for this two-parter. I’m still not entirely convinced it WAS the Changeling operating on Sisko in “Rapture”, for instance—I can understand how a Changeling could mimic Bashir’s appearance, but how would it acquire years worth of medical training and experience? In my head cannon, perhaps Bashir was simply wearing his old uniform the day he was caught because they hadn’t yet been made mandatory...or perhaps he spilled raktajino over his new outfit and had to change into his blue-shouldered suit. In an ideal world, if DS9 had been more meticulously planned, we’d have seen subtle clues for weeks or months in advance, something DISCOVERY later did nicely with Captain Lorca. Not to be a downer, though—it’s a fascinating and thoroughly creepy twist, featuring a particularly amusing red herring of a scene where Bashir-Changeling—which I’ll henceforth call Bashireling—takes sandwiches to O’Brien and Dax as they’re working to collapse the wormhole. The way the sequence is directed, we half expect he’s about to do something majorly bad, such as phaser down everyone in Ops, but...no, he’s just, bizarrely, delivering lunch. I also loved his subtle “here goes nothing” as the plan is set in motion and fails—fails because he sabotaged it, the rotter.
It’s great to have Dukat back and edging back into the part he was born to play: series antagonist. Really, the last couple of seasons the writers haven’t seemed to know quite what to do with him, trying perhaps a little too hard to present him as a reformed and likeable guy with a “colourful past” and giving him a rather unsuccessful stint as dashing, romantic freedom fighter. But he’s superb here, and this episode neatly sets up the mind-blowing twist to come in the second part. I loved his menacing scene with Kira and the confrontation with Garak in which Garak not only emerges unscathed but also unleashes some superb, witty retorts that truly put Dukat in his place. I’m not terribly sold on Melanie Smith’s performance as Ziyal (the third) here, but she does the job, and it’s interesting to see the narcissistic rage she unwittingly unleashes in her father when she chooses Garak over him. Ouch.
Lots of great character moments abound and just about all the cast get a moment to shine. It seems crazy to think that these were the very same writers that wrote the abomination that was “Let He Who is Without Sin...” because they do such great character work here and keep the plot on course right up to what must be the greatest Star Trek cliff-hangers since “The Best of Both Worlds, Part I”. As Sisko mutters at one point, “May God help us all!” Here’s a niggle, though. Starfleet has known about the Dominion for nearly three years now. Preparations to fend off an invasion began immediately after Sisko’s first encounter with them and the destruction of the Odyssey. Sure, we have the Defiant now, but shouldn’t Starfleet have stayed at least on permanent yellow alert? The nearest starships are TWO DAYS AWAY from the station! Whoever is responsible for fleet deployment truly needs a kick up the ass. Just because the threat appeared to become less immediate, Starfleet should never have let their guard down.
Anyway, that about covers it! A thoroughly engaging, exciting, enjoyable episode that really sees the series playing to all its strengths and delivering some killer twists and one of Trek’s best cliff-hangers to boot. Rating: 10
I will say in retrospect, IIRC, I feel as though FauxBashir's making it a little too obvious that he's not himself. It's not quite overt enough to catch the first time around, but on subsequent viewings I remember thinking he was playing it up a bit.
But yes, another great episode that once again changes the direction of the series, to what will be great effect.
But yes, another great episode that once again changes the direction of the series, to what will be great effect.
I'd forgotten what a strong episode this is… and, found myself agreeing with every sentence of the review. This really is DS9 in top form, it works so well on every level. I did have the same quibble about Bashir’s changeling never getting noticed….and why he didn’t cause more trouble than he did. Aside from that, loved the plot surprises, the suspense, and all the character bits woven in--Odo and Kira, Worf and Dax, Kira and baby Kirayoshi, Garak and Worf, Garak and Tain.
Interesting that Gabrielle Beaumont was the first woman to direct Star Trek episodes - TNG, DS9 and VOY.
Interesting that Gabrielle Beaumont was the first woman to direct Star Trek episodes - TNG, DS9 and VOY.
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Excellent review!
Totally agreed that this is DS9 at its finest. It does have a season ending cliffhanger feel... thankfully, we didn't have to wait a summer for part two when this aired. Just next week.
There's actually an explanation for the lack of Starfleet ships nearby right in the episode... Sisko said their forces are spread thin because of the recent Borg attack and Klingon War.
I loved your picture with the caption. Hilarious because that's pretty much exactly what happened! It was a nice nod and dig at TNG at the same time.
(I also see you like my word fusion of 'Bashir Changeling'...
)
Flawless episode. Deserving of a 10.
Totally agreed that this is DS9 at its finest. It does have a season ending cliffhanger feel... thankfully, we didn't have to wait a summer for part two when this aired. Just next week.
There's actually an explanation for the lack of Starfleet ships nearby right in the episode... Sisko said their forces are spread thin because of the recent Borg attack and Klingon War.
I loved your picture with the caption. Hilarious because that's pretty much exactly what happened! It was a nice nod and dig at TNG at the same time.
(I also see you like my word fusion of 'Bashir Changeling'...
)Flawless episode. Deserving of a 10.
She did 7 TNG episodes and 1 each of DS9 and VOYAGER... this one and "BLINK OF AN EYE", both excellent episodes. "Booby Trap", "Suddenly Human", "Face Of The Enemy", "Lower Decks"... she had a great track record.
(Though Kim Friedman would be the first woman directing DS9 and VOYAGER. Beaumont for TNG, and the franchise overall.)
I thought of "THE RETURN OF THE ARCHONS", too, but there were some people on that planet that were exempt from the Red Hour, plus they had an underground movement. Kirk just accelerated that process, so I can't give him the full credit.
As for Janeway, "TUVIX" is a horrible scenario, but I'm not sure what else could be done at that moment. I'm not sure I agree with her decision, but I fully get it. She killed one person to bring back two. That ending was a Kobayashi Maru, no matter which decision was used.
(Frankly, with Janeway, there are SO many situations I could have used, but I wanted to keep it a little lean so the point would come across. Devil's advocate: she made so many more reprehensible decisions than her counterparts of other shows, but she was in a much more desperate situation than every other captain. Not saying that excuses them, but it certainly mitigates some of her choices a bit.
Tell me. Why, but why do you guys keep forgetting that Sisko HIMSELF said "We don't put civilians at risk not even to save ourselves. If you don't believe that you don't deserve to wear that uniform."
IT'S SISKO HIMSELF that is condemning his OWN actions!!!
Cant' you see that???
It's funny because "In purgatory" and the next one "By inferno... " have an obvious plot hole and that hole will, later on, be exploited in "Inquisition."
I mean why would the Jems have left the runabout unattended and ready to beam them up, plus why wouldn't have they then pursued the runabout with their much faster ships (as shown in Treachery) to recapture them!!!
Anyway, that thing aside these a very nice couple of episodes.
I mean why would the Jems have left the runabout unattended and ready to beam them up, plus why wouldn't have they then pursued the runabout with their much faster ships (as shown in Treachery) to recapture them!!!
Anyway, that thing aside these a very nice couple of episodes.
The key word has been emphasized.
Moreover, it is entirely possible for there to be dissonance between the expression of ideals and tactics Starfleet will employ. They wouldn't be the first, nor the last.
BTW, something needs to be recognized in Rules of Engagement. Starfleet was not investigating or prosecuting Worf for killing civilians when it was believed that the ship destroyed had passengers. Sisko never promises to investigate or prosecute Worf to Chpok. Worf is under arrest at the beginning of the episode, but that would seem to be exclusively tied to the extradition hearing. No one among the crew expresses the idea that Worf committed a crime, only that he made a mistake.
I think it can be reasonably said that Starfleet has no ruling prohibiting killing civilians, or that the the contingencies in such a rule are numerous, or the application of such a rule is lax.
I think it can be reasonably said that Starfleet has no ruling prohibiting killing civilians, or that the the contingencies in such a rule are numerous, or the application of such a rule is lax.
Kirk certainly made some drastic, destructive decisions--in “A taste of Armageddon” and especially “A private little war.”
Sometimes I wonder about the choice of titles - Purgatory implies a purification, suffering to work off wrongs …I guess in a way it could apply to Garak seeking out his father after being exiled by him.
Sometimes I wonder about the choice of titles - Purgatory implies a purification, suffering to work off wrongs …I guess in a way it could apply to Garak seeking out his father after being exiled by him.
