Well, it's a botched job. I mean after ten years, not one of them has been promoted or assigned to another ship!!! That's unbelievable! They don't even show any signs of aging, that's some sloppy work. It's telling the audience: "We don't give a S***T it's the last episode anyway!"
What are your controversial Star Trek opinions?
- Thread starter Amasov
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Well, it's a botched job. I mean after ten years, not one of them has been promoted or assigned to another ship!!! That's unbelievable! They don't even show any signs of aging, that's some sloppy work. It's telling the audience: "We don't give a S***T it's the last episode anyway!"
The biggest thing I don't like about TATV is that it ignores all of the dramatic potential from Terra Prime. You have Trip and T'Pol struggling in an emotional scene and then that relationship gets swept under the rug. Why?
Well, it's also a holodeck simulation, so that means that it's not what really happened, it's what the computer "imagines" happened given the info he's been given. It's exactly like the Da Vinci simulation, it's not the real Da Vinci, it's a simulation of one that is very limited, plus I don't see how it could contain his genius. If the computer could emulate geniuses then why can't it BE a genius and make science progress at the speed of light!!!
That way lies the singularity
Yes it would have better if the finale leaned into what we saw hinted to for their future from “Twilight” and “E2” - T’Pol & Trip both being given command and are married, Reed promoted to commander or growing a goatee, Sato promoted to lieutenant and awaiting marriage, Mayweather scarred from battle and married off to Gannet or a MACO or someone else, Phlox busy inventing cures, signs of Archer and Phlox starting to grey and look older, and the ship itself does in fact upgrade to shields, tractor beams, & blue phase cannons.
But I also feel that it was left in a way that a subsequent season could have started in 2161 on Earth, with various flashbacks to events between 2155 and 2160 on Enterprise if necessary, as the crew gets ready for the next stage of their lives.
Of course, ENT never did get picked up by another network or uncancelled years later like other shows, so bitterness still remains over the finale.
Hide and Q: breaks the sound barrier of offensiveness.
I mean when Riker gives Gerdi LaForge his sight back. I mean after a few seconds the latter begs him to make him blind again... What???
Who the hell wrote this crap!!! Geordi's justification is "that the price is too high!" What price? What the hell is wrong with these people? The other gifts I agree are either stupid or downright offensive. A Klingon whore for Worf... yeah.
Make Wesley ten years older... IOW ten years closer to death... who wants that?
But there's no way in hell that Geordi if he was written like a real person would refuse to see!!!
How about the little girl. I bet if Riker had given her her life back she would have begged Riker to leave her dead.
Oh boy!!!
Then Data says something like Q never learned to handle us. How could he? You're a bunch of imbeciles!!!
I mean when Riker gives Gerdi LaForge his sight back. I mean after a few seconds the latter begs him to make him blind again... What???
Who the hell wrote this crap!!! Geordi's justification is "that the price is too high!" What price? What the hell is wrong with these people? The other gifts I agree are either stupid or downright offensive. A Klingon whore for Worf... yeah.
Make Wesley ten years older... IOW ten years closer to death... who wants that?
But there's no way in hell that Geordi if he was written like a real person would refuse to see!!!
How about the little girl. I bet if Riker had given her her life back she would have begged Riker to leave her dead.
Oh boy!!!
Then Data says something like Q never learned to handle us. How could he? You're a bunch of imbeciles!!!
Picard giving him an "atta-boy" for not even trying is more irritating.
I've just re-watched TNG's "The Neutral Zone", there are a lot of stupid lines in that episode but the one IMO that really gets the cake is Beverly's "People were afraid of dying back then."
What???
Of course, we're afraid of dying, you imbeciles!!! That just means we're alive!!!! But seriously this episode is one stupid remark after another... It's almost like perpetual motion!!!
What???
Of course, we're afraid of dying, you imbeciles!!! That just means we're alive!!!! But seriously this episode is one stupid remark after another... It's almost like perpetual motion!!!
The Neutral Zone is the episode that made me really dislike the main characters. They had no real sympathy for people of the 20th century and it stood out painfully. And these are our heroes?
I never understood the anger at "These Are the Voyages" until now. Granted, I always got the frustration that it focused on TNG characters, but just because I got it doesn't mean I truly understood it. Because, at the end of the day, I'm just not an ENT Fan. Then I started thinking about it in Disco terms. I decided to reframe everything done in the ENT episode in a DSC context.
The Disco Version of "These Are the Voyages":
The Disco Version of "These Are the Voyages":
- In 2399, toward the end of when Picard Season 1 was set, Riker and Troi decide to show Kestra a recreation of the USS Discovery. Riker always wondered (just go with it) about what really happened to Discovery. Was it really actually destroyed like they said, or did something else happen?
- Then Q pops up. And he tells them he'll show them what really actually happened.
- Now Riker and Troi are crew members of the Discovery in the 32nd Century.
- Tilly dies saving Discovery from thugs, probably from the Emerald Chain. Tilly, not Stamets, because the point is they're killing off one of the Big Three. And in DSC it's Burnham, Tilly, and Saru. Tilly, like Trip, was the main lead's best friend.
- At the end, Burnham gives a speech at a ceremony celebrating the complete reformation of The Federation.
- Q sends Riker and Troi back to 2399. This gives Riker the confidence to rejoin Starfleet to help Picard.
- Then we cut to a montage with two other starships (not from DSC) before finally getting to Discovery. End of Series.
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That’s still less insulting than TATV. Since the characters are playing themselves and not holocharacters. If Q had simply placed Riker and Troi on the NX-01 disguised as crewmen (we know he can after "Tapestry" with Picard looking younger to everyone around him), I don't know if such complaints would have cropped up.
And I maintain that you remove the holodeck aspect from TATV, that episode is tolerated more. And will be liked a bit more than VOY’s finale.
As for the Pegasus subplot…is it really a stretch to believe that 22nd century Starfleet would experiment with cloaking tech in the aftermath of the Romulan War after we saw the Romulans using cloaking tech a century ahead of schedule? And after their encounters with the Suliban? Seems like that subplot could have been used to refer a Daedalus version of the Pegasus in this time period that also got destroyed attempting a similar experiment.
Last night marked the 20th Anniversary of the VOY finale. It is a hundred times the series finale that ENT's was.
Wait, is that supposed to be controversial?
It's no secret I like ENT more than I do VOY but wow, are "Endgame, Part I" and "Endgame, Part II" clearly and vastly superior to "TATV..."
Wait, is that supposed to be controversial?
It's no secret I like ENT more than I do VOY but wow, are "Endgame, Part I" and "Endgame, Part II" clearly and vastly superior to "TATV..."
In my head, Enterprise finished with Terra Prime. There was some crazy stuff with Frakes and Sirtis doing some cosplay after that but I just make sure I'm good and drunk when I watch that. The writers clearly were.Last night marked the 20th Anniversary of the VOY finale. It is a hundred times the series finale that ENT's was.
Wait, is that supposed to be controversial?
It's no secret I like ENT more than I do VOY but wow, are "Endgame, Part I" and "Endgame, Part II" clearly and vastly superior to "TATV..."
At least VOY's finale was executed with some creative effort. ENT went off the air with little more than a lazy shrug.
Actually, now that I have had time to sleep on it, the holodeck isn’t even the problem. Since if the finale dealt with one of the shuttlepods going mysteriously going missing during an away mission in 2155, leaving Archer, Sato, and the Enterprise behind (because IAMD preordains their futures through their bios), and we find the rest of the main cast being briefed on a Galaxy class ship by Riker and Troi in 2380 on all of the changes in over 200 years all while not being able to send them back, that would have been a much better finale. And let the NX-01 crew use the holodeck to watch Archer’s speech instead. Could have even still made a reference to the Pegasus incident if the writers wanted to.
That this idea was here the whole time and never considered at all…
That this idea was here the whole time and never considered at all…
EVERYTHING is better that TATV! It's the Star Wars Holiday Special of Trek- never to be seen again (but unfortunately cannot be unseen).Last night marked the 20th Anniversary of the VOY finale. It is a hundred times the series finale that ENT's was.
Wait, is that supposed to be controversial?
It's no secret I like ENT more than I do VOY but wow, are "Endgame, Part I" and "Endgame, Part II" clearly and vastly superior to "TATV..."
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