Discovery is losing me in Season 3, anyone else?
- Thread starter Ometiklan
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You are one of the more reasonable fans here then. For years now, saying that you like a straight white male character around here has led to the automatic (and outright wrong) assumption that you (the general "you") are a bigot, mysoginist, and a homophobe. It's both insulting and a form of bigotry in itself. Not only that, but it's tiring and pathetic. Why bigotry against white males is acceptable when every other form of bigotry isn't is something I will never understand. It's extremely hippocritical.
IMHO there's a difference between saying "I really like Anson Mount's Pike!" and "It's so refreshing to see a straight, white, male character!" The latter makes it a backhanded criticism of all of the LGBT, non-white, or female characters.
And those comments about male characters were rarely made in isolation. They were usually made by people who had a history of popping up around the site anytime an opportunity to make gender or race based posts arose
Certain posters deserved everything they had directed at them. But they're no longer here. Either because they went elsewhere or they've been banned.
I like Pike and I liked him when I first saw "The Cage" as a kid, 30 years ago. Minus the one line he said ("She does a good job alright, it's just that I can't get used to having a woman on the bridge"), but that's just the way things were when it was made. If they could've added 20 minutes, I think "The Cage" would've made for a good Star Trek Movie, 15 years before we even had one.
I like Pike and I liked him when I first saw "The Cage" as a kid, 30 years ago. Minus the one line he said ("She does a good job alright, it's just that I can't get used to having a woman on the bridge"), but that's just the way things were when it was made. If they could've added 20 minutes, I think "The Cage" would've made for a good Star Trek Movie, 15 years before we even had one.
Yeah, I mean it's not particularly inspiring though. It's just weird, the show tries really hard to be inspirational in some ways, with the diversity and diving into non-binary issues and things of that nature, but then tells stories in a way that embrace violence and generally show a casual disregard for life. The show really should be trying to emphasize de-escalation and using violence only as a last resort. A message like that is really important, especially today. Stuff like this is why wars drag out longer than they should and why a lot of people die needlessly.
For me the worst part was not so much the scene itself, but that she got promoted immediately after, meaning the Federation is totally fine with that level of aggression.
I don't see that as being different from what the Federation has done before, but obviously mileage will vary.
And, mileage varies because I don't look to Star Trek for inspiration. It simply doesn't carry that weight for me.
DISCO has nice beats, for sure.
But for me, it has worn thin. A lot of the big emotional episodes are not earned (S2 Ariam). Too much stupidity/plot driven nonsense (Saru/Kelpian, S2 finale, Klingon S1 resolution, silly Burn explanation, etc).
The biggest flaw is they fail to stick the landing on the main story arc every year. The explanation for the Burn is silly. As was the S2 finale with all those jumps of the one use time crystal. S1, which disappointed me, seems like the clear winner in restrospect.
However, each episode is well acted. Produced well. And there are some really good episodes. And very rarely a really bad one (Tom and Harry holodeck adventures!!!).
I am not a big fan of the serial nature of the show. I like episodic better. Episodic can be ridiculous at times (Voyager is all better, with infinite shuttles), but so can throwing aside too much development and good sense in service of plot twists.
I think Disco has veered too much towards plot service.
But for me, it has worn thin. A lot of the big emotional episodes are not earned (S2 Ariam). Too much stupidity/plot driven nonsense (Saru/Kelpian, S2 finale, Klingon S1 resolution, silly Burn explanation, etc).
The biggest flaw is they fail to stick the landing on the main story arc every year. The explanation for the Burn is silly. As was the S2 finale with all those jumps of the one use time crystal. S1, which disappointed me, seems like the clear winner in restrospect.
However, each episode is well acted. Produced well. And there are some really good episodes. And very rarely a really bad one (Tom and Harry holodeck adventures!!!).
I am not a big fan of the serial nature of the show. I like episodic better. Episodic can be ridiculous at times (Voyager is all better, with infinite shuttles), but so can throwing aside too much development and good sense in service of plot twists.
I think Disco has veered too much towards plot service.
I understand so many of your posts now...
Thanks, I guess...?
He's trying to say you gave him a soundbite.Thanks, I guess...?
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Agree, especially the part of sticking the landing, which I think comes back to the serial style and their desire to have everything neatly wrapped up in the last episode of the season. The writers just aren't good at it. It's like, how many times are they going to repeat the exact same formula until they realize it's not a good fit?
When people stop buying it.
By then it's way too late.
That's the nature of the market.
I mean, if you are smart, you will be proactive and make improvements to your product before you start to see a decline in your sales.
But, there are some improvements that are not readily identifiable. The intangibles as it were. And, honestly, despite the commentary here is there enough information for the production team to see it as a problem? Genuine question.
I'm not sure. I think it depends on the target market. The show seems to be pivoting away from sci-fi and towards character driven drama and emotional beats which I assume is an attempt to appeal to a broader demographic (like a soap opera, but in space). In these types of shows, the characters are front and center and the plot doesn't matter as much (the purpose of the plot is really just to get you from one emotional beat to the next). If this is what Discovery is trying to be and who its trying to appeal to, then no it's not a problem. If the show is also trying to appeal to a more traditional sci-fi fan, then yes I would say it's a problem.
But at the same time, I don't think the show can be everything to everyone so they have to decide which route maximizes their revenue and execute accordingly. I was more responding to the idea that the show wouldn't be interested in making improvements until they see a revenue decline, which is just a really bad business plan.
Except how are they to make improvements unless they know what the market will bear?
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