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Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 3x12 - "There Is A Tide…"

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Cliffhanger? Right at the end of the year before I proceed to drink myself into a stupor? Shame on you, Disco writers, shame! I didn't quite like it as much as last week, mostly because I'm quite tired of "Die Hard on an X" plots.

I am very angry at Michael right now, and I was glad that they didn't wait until next week with the entire fallout, and Paul got to address what she did. Let's hope something more follows as the others should be quite disappointed in her as well. She has once again started a crusade no one asked her to go on, and shouldered the responsibility of saving the Federation her way all by herself, no matter who she hurts along the way. It's sad to see her fall back into this mindset after she seemingly learned her lesson at Ni'Var. She wasn't the only one driven by ingrained fear and instinct; Book threw everything away and surrendered his ace in the hole to Osyraa in a desperate attempt to save his friend Ryn, and she, like a true, if quite stereotypical villain, showed him how powerless he is by killing the Andorian anyway and ordering Aurellio to extract the information from Book via truth serum.

Vance, however, keeps being a pleasant surprise to the point I'm painfully aware that his name is always followed by those two words whenever I'm talking about him. He seemed far too eager to accept Osyraa's terms that sounded too good to be true, but even during that, he showed he's no fool by talking about replicators using shit in an apparent allusion to how full of shit he thinks Osyraa is. And then, he saved the nuclear option for last, daring her to be held accountable for her actions, which she then naturally refused. I agreed with him, because if you look under the surface, it wasn't about reaching a détente, cold war-style. He knew fully well that an union like the one Osyraa proposed would render the Federation economically dependent on the Chain, which he couldn't in good faith allow. Osyraa standing trial would've been the legal assurance that the Chain wouldn't act as a hegemon, something they wouldn't give up easily, and he sought confirmation for that. Incidentally, I've found his scenes with Osyraa actually more enjoyable than the A-plot on the ship, which was, like I indicated above, done a thousand times before. Still, I liked the glimpses into the Sphere Data developing its sentience.

It was good to see Zareh being a thorn in the crew's sides again, but he didn't add much to the plot to be honest. Of course, the "Tilly is incompetent" crowd would probably hail his insults to her about the ship being too easy to capture. Seriously, I don't even understand why Osyraa was surprised at how easy it was... has she seen Star Trek? Federation ships are captured by motley crews all the time. Ken Mitchell, on the other hand, was a delight to see again, and they worked his disability into the setting quite skillfully.
 
Cliffhanger? Right at the end of the year before I proceed to

course, the "Tilly is incompetent" crowd would probably hail his insults to her about the ship being too easy to capture. Seriously, I don't even understand why Osyraa was surprised at how easy it was... has she seen Star Trek? Federation ships are captured by motley crews all the time. Ken Mitchell, on the other hand, was a delight to see again, and they worked his disability into the setting quite skillfully.

I am beginning to think as SOON AS A WOMAN makes a mistake she is attacked in Trek. Riker has fucked up plenty of time and so has Kirk, and I never hear that shit.
 
Another 2/10. What can I say, but a major freaking disappointment this whole season is. I'm really beginning to like Osyraa. She is the good guy in all this. She came to Federation offering a union that will benefit all. Vance, like a typical Federation admiral rejected what's good for everyone. Blahh, now Federation is a goner. Good riddance.
Tells you something about Discovery that I'm now rooting for the "bad" guys to win.

Oh and who is the new bridge crew woman? Where is Nilsson?
 
TBH, I don’t understand why the show leans into the cartoonish so much in general — eeevil Georgiou, the MU, one-note comedy characters like Linus, OTT threats to all life and the universe, evil Osyraa and her silly scheme. The whole season would have worked much better for me had the Emerald Chain been given a more nuanced portrayal throughout — hard people making hard choices in a hard time — rather than saving it for a Discovery twist(TM) at the end. The show is supposedly a more adult take on Trek, but the negotiation scenes in this episode had me pining for the sophistication of Mark Lenard’s Romulan commander from TOS.

This has been an issue with Discovery almost from the beginning though (despite its flaws, I don't think the Season 1 opening two-parter had it). Basically, CBS really wants to have a product to compete with Disney, and Star Trek is its premier geek-centered IP. Therefore, they're attempting to turn Trek into the MCU.

I mean, I'm not one of those people who thinks Trek was ever hard science fiction - or that it really made a lick of sense once you scratched the surface. But TOS was often a largely faithful attempt to translate written soft-sci-fi to the small screen. And Berman Trek really filed down the weirdness of TOS, making a pretty mundane universe which had a set of consistent (albeit nonsensical) rules. But now it's A-OK to have planets explody which somehow haven't re-accreted due to gravity. Or to have the souls of the dead stick around because of semi-inexplicable reasons. Worldbuilding is entirely secondary to drama and spectacle. And big, campy villains are fine, because that's what people like in Marvel movies.

All of this would be fine with me if Discovery actually had some identifiable themes. Part of the classic Trek format is basically sitting up proudly and saying "this episode is about X." But despite much better character writing this season, I feel like Discovery is really still a show about nothing. Things happen to the Discovery crew each week, and we watch to see how they get out of it. That's it.
 
Did we really need to stop everything for Burnham to compose a farewell note to her mom?
Honestly, I would say yes. It fits in the theme with Burnham overall, especially not getting to say goodbye. The fact that she has contact with her mom is important to her. But, I suppose, that doesn't automatically translate to the audience if they don't care about Michael or her relationships. So, I guess maybe not needed but certainly something I liked in terms of the character.

I honestly think you're reading too much into this and finding sexism/gender bias where none exists.
I personally do not. I see it way too much with various female characters to think that it doesn't exist. It might be a minority position but certainly it exists.

All of this would be fine with me if Discovery actually had some identifiable themes. Part of the classic Trek format is basically sitting up proudly and saying "this episode is about X." But despite much better character writing this season, I feel like Discovery is really still a show about nothing. Things happen to the Discovery crew each week, and we watch to see how they get out of it. That's it.
I felt that way about TNG. That none of it mattered. And, if we want to get fully nihilistic then nothing in Star Trek truly does.

Except, for me, in Discovery. Michael fucking matters. She is the character who has been through a ton of shit and keeps trying to soldier on through it on her own, because that was what she was taught. It might be dramatically difficult for many but this is actually something I appreciate-Michael isn't just magically better or learns from her mistakes and moves on. She behaves like a real human being who has been through stuff and is trying to make sense of it all.

Now, that probably isn't why people watch Star Trek. But I would be hard pressed to say its about nothing, even if it probably isn't about anything that everyone would find interesting.

Mileage varies, clearly.
 
With regards to Tilly, I genuinely don't know whst they're trying to achieve with her by making her first officer at this stage where she's isn't ready for such a role by virtually any metric you wish to use.

Tilly was still cadet not so long ago, she's now an ensign, and while a lot of stuff has happened in two years or do nothing about her experience or demeanor makes me think 'lets make her second in command and bypass any number of lieutenants, lieutenant commanders etc'. I'm struggling to remember an occasion where Tilly was ever in command other than the Mirror Universe play-acting way back when.

It would be like promoting Wesley Crusher straight up to first officer and bypassing Data and Worf.

Crazy.
 
With regards to Tilly, I genuinely don't know whst they're trying to achieve with her by making her first officer at this stage where she's isn't ready for such a role by virtually any metric you wish to use.

Tilly was still cadet not so long ago, she's now an ensign, and while alot of stuff has happened in two years or do nothing about her experience or demeanor makes me think 'lets make her second in command and bypass any number of lieutenants, lieutenant commanders etc'. I'm struggling to remember an occasion where Tilly was ever in command other than the Mirror Universe play-acting way back when.

It would be like promoting Wesley Crusher straight up to first officer and bypassing Data and Worf.

Crazy.

The most likely thing they're setting up is that once the next episode is done, Vance demotes Saru for having a lapse in judgement for making Tilly his commanding officer, noting that he had many capable commanders and lt. commanders he could have turned to on the ship other than Michael.

Then, Michael is captain for Season 4, and Saru is bumped down to XO.

I'd like to think that Tilly will get a redemption arc in the following episode, but realistically, it's the season finale, and there's no way that both Michael and Tilly can save the day.
 
With regards to Tilly, I genuinely don't know whst they're trying to achieve with her by making her first officer at this stage where she's isn't ready for such a role by virtually any metric you wish to use.

Tilly was still cadet not so long ago, she's now an ensign, and while a lot of stuff has happened in two years or do nothing about her experience or demeanor makes me think 'lets make her second in command and bypass any number of lieutenants, lieutenant commanders etc'. I'm struggling to remember an occasion where Tilly was ever in command other than the Mirror Universe play-acting way back when.

It would be like promoting Wesley Crusher straight up to first officer and bypassing Data and Worf.

Crazy.
I don't think she is ready for the role and I think that is the point. I think the Discovery crew is discovering that they are damaged. They, like Michael, are so used to doing things on their own that operating within Starfleet is actually more difficult. Maybe it is just set up as cheap drama; at this point I couldn't say that for certain. But, I think what they are trying to achieve is just how out of step Discovery's crew is and what healing they need.
 
I personally do not. I see it way too much with various female characters to think that it doesn't exist. It might be a minority position but certainly it exists.
We'll have to agree to disagree. Tilly's handling of the situation was a shitshow, just like Riker's handling of the boarding in Rascals was a shitshow and his handling of the Enterprise-D's final battle was a shitshow not ordering a hundred photon torpedoes fired and instead going with some hairbrained scheme involving a plasma-coil.

Do a crap job and expect criticism no matter which bathroom you use.
 
We'll have to agree to disagree. Tilly's handling of the situation was a shitshow, just like Riker's handling of the boarding in Rascals was a shitshow and his handling of the Enterprise-D's final battle was a shitshow not ordering a hundred photon torpedoes fired and instead going with some hairbrained scheme involving a plasma-coil.

Do a crap job and expect criticism no matter which bathroom you use.
See, I see the criticism but then it moves on. With Tilly and Burnham is used as ammo again and again. Riker's failings are not used against him when he is fighting in the next film.

I expect criticism as well. But that's now how these characters are treated.
 
It was a good episode. A 9.5.

A few thoughts: Osyraa’s motives aren’t “pure”. My estimation is that the chain joining the Federation is a ruse to get dilithium.

Someone “familiar” will be Federation President. Kovich?

Do the Ni’varans show up to assist? Probably.

Anyone else think Discovery may be toast after this? With the new discovery of Planet Dilithium and the likely cause of the burn being isolated. The Federation could restore warp capability on a galactic scale.

Also, Zora likely fully understands the functioning of the Spore Drive and could help the Federation reproduce it. Even if Disco is toast, Zora survives.

Season 4 will be about restoration of the Federation. We will get some episodes of the crew going to once friendly planets and then having to convince them that the Fed is back and benevolent.

Osyraa dies at the end of the season and that paves the way for the Chain to open up realistic negotiation for joining the Fed.
 
I am soooo psyched up to see the DOTs save the day next week!
And them holding their 3 fingers up like some other 3 fingered cute thingy from another Star named sci-fi show. Not a total rip-off at all, nope, not at all :D

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Ok, so:

- Mom Burnham has been called but she doesn't appear in the preview... so I don't know what to make of it.

- The Sphere data is coming to the rescue.

- The antennaless Andorian is dead.

- In a way, things are even worse than last week.

- Michael is stabbed in her thigh and seals the wound with... a phaser... ouch... Why is there never a medical tricorder around when you need one?

- Stamets has been ejected in... a pod made of forcefields... And he likely hates Michael for what she did.

In the preview, we see Osyraa choke Michael, most likely to kill her... My guess she won't succeed.

....
 
See, I see the criticism but then it moves on. With Tilly and Burnham is used as ammo again and again. Riker's failings are not used against him when he is fighting in the next film.

I expect criticism as well. But that's now how these characters are treated.

I don’t question that there’s sexism behind some people’s criticism of Discovery, but Tilly is a young ensign abruptly promoted to a position far beyond her years. In that’s sense, she’s more Wesley than Riker, and Wesley has taken no shortage of criticism and outright hate.
 
Cliffhanger? Right at the end of the year before I proceed to drink myself into a stupor? Shame on you, Disco writers, shame! ...

Well, don't forget that the goal is to make us want to watch the next episode. I wonder if the finale will similarly end with another cliffhanger... My guess is, it will.
 
What would you do with a medical tricorder? Wave it over yourself to confirm what you knew - that you'd been stabbed in the thigh?

Well, then whatever gizmo they use to magically make these kinds of wounds disappear. Like when Riker had been disfigured by Data's cat.
 
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