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City on the Edge of Tomorrow: Overrated

Thomas Elliot

Commander
Red Shirt
I was excited to watch this episode after hearing the hype. I also had to wash out the bad taste of "Assignment: Earth".

Okay, McCoy starts acting crazy. "Killers, you're all killers!" I thought it was going to be something like a triggered memory, he believed he was someone else. Nope. This drug just makes him paranoid.

They beam down to the planet to get him and encounter Roman columns sticking out of the ground. I just rolled with it. This is supposed to give the sense of something weird and otherworldly. I guess. But it turns out that the set director confused "runes" with "ruins" and I'm guessing he went with ancient Earth city ruins.

The "Guardian of Forever" is introduced in such a casual way and shows a TV of Earth's past, which is really a portal. Interesting. I liked that. But I wondered, why show only human past? Why not the past of this particular location, or of Vulcan past?

1930s Earth looked very much like a TV set. :(

"My friend is obviously...Chinese. And his ears...they got caught in a rice picker." I can imagine a person from the the 60s trying to convince someone else that Spock's alien look is really just his Chinese features, but I found it hard to believe a human from the 23rd century would come up with a like like that. Not just the Chinese thing, but also the rice picker explanation. :(

Even trying to view this by 60s standards I found it hard to believe in the coincidence that Kirk and Spock would encounter a random woman who just so happens makes a speech that predicts the future of Starfleet and the Federation. It's like, c'mon.

I didn't believe in Kirk's love or feelings for Edit AT ALL. I myself didn't like her. The way she spoke, she was like a caricature.

Bones little moments with Edith had more feeling that between her and Kirk.
After the whole thing was done I felt like, "that was it?"

So far I'm starting to greatly dislike the episodes where they go back to Earth's past just so the producers don't have to come up with any alien worlds or peoples.

The original story by Harlan Ellison and the space drugs and firing squad is definitely interesting, and the giant beings being the actual Guardians would have made the episode so much better. The latter, not the space drug dealing and firing squad.

If they had made the character of Edith Keeler more subtle with her optimism, cast a different actress, developed the romance between her and Kirk better, this could have been a much better episode. I've seen very little of Kirk's romances, but so far the only shipping that seems plausible is between him and Saavik.
 
So far I'm starting to greatly dislike the episodes where they go back to Earth's past just so the producers don't have to come up with any alien worlds or peoples.

I feel your pain. I abhor parallel planet episodes simply for the reason you stated above.

Meanwhile, back to City, the filmed episode caused a rift between Harlan Ellison and the Trek production staff. IIRC, Bob Justman stated that Ellison’s original screenplay was just too expensive to film. Like other TOS episodes, it has flaws but when I compare and contrast it to other lower quality episodes, then I tend to appreciate it more.
 
Like other TOS episodes, it has flaws but when I compare and contrast it to other lower quality episodes, then I tend to appreciate it more.
It's not bad. Just over hyped. Probably if I watched a bunch of the regular episodes of aliens and strange planets this one would have been a nice break from all that. But watching it right after Assignment: Earth was a bad idea.

The "runes for ruins" story has changed over the years. "Runes" doesn't appear in any version of Ellison's story outlines or scripts. Final paragraph: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_City_on_the_Edge_of_Forever#Filming_and_post_production

Sir Rhosis
Ahhh, interesting. Honestly, it makes sense that back then, random roman columns would be meant to evoke an ancient alien civilization. I mean, the Romulans themselves were heavily based on Romans, right?

Oh, BTW, I think the episode title is City on the Edge of Forever.
Doh.
 
I don't know what this Blake's 7 is, but I'm ready to find out.
Blake's 7 (1978–82) was a sort of anti-Trek, where a corrupt Federation ruled with an iron fist and the nominal heroes are a set of escaped "criminals" who happen upon an abandoned super-powerful alien-built starship (below) which they employ in an attempt at rebellion and name the Liberator.

liberator.jpg
The green sphere is the engine. The ship flies thataway ———>​

The show ran for four years and 52 episodes on the BBC. It's BBC so it's relatively low budget, but the writing of the character interplay is often great, and the character of Avon was the breakout of the show much as Spock was on Trek. Fair warning, the first episode is verrrrrry tonally different from what follows.

It's been said to have been an influence on Firefly and a few other shows.
 
It started off really well with the freedom fighters hitting at Federation installations throughout the galaxy and at other planets forcibly colonized by the Terran security guards but later episodes were typically camp and bad! Monsters are few and far between and no parallel earth stories exist in it's fifty two shows! :techman:
JB
 
Servalan is like the Borg Queen with feathers.

While CotEoF is not my number one like it is on many lists, there is a lot to like. I rather like the Guardian as opposed to the aliens in the original version.

I think Ellison's version was ahead of its time, and would feel more at home in the STD era. The moral dilemma of a bad man making a good choice with bad consequences would have given the story even darker undertones.

I think the space pirate sub plot would have been a bit too involved and there was something more frightening about being marooned on the planet with only the past for escape.

In some ways, it might have been nice to see Scotty and Uhura along for the ride, and particularly Uhura, but of course, she was a late edition after Rand was written out. The loss of Rand's last shot as an action heroine was a real shame but given that Uhura just gets scared in the final version, poor Rand would have had little to do again if she had appeared.

I like the romance because it grows over time, far more realistic than falling for a guest star in the space of an episode. Some of her dialogue is a bit too prophetic but I like her overall.

The City on the Edge of Forever is the city on the cusp of history but it might have been nice to see more of the alien ruins.
 
Even trying to view this by 60s standards I found it hard to believe in the coincidence that Kirk and Spock would encounter a random woman who just so happens makes a speech that predicts the future of Starfleet and the Federation. It's like, c'mon.
She only predicted nuclear energy and spaceflight, which were a common sci-fi and early real world topic at the time
 
Without being $poilery for anyone who's not seen it...

As Terry Nation was less and less involved in Blake's 7 the grittier tone went with it. Chris Boucher was a better writer—certainly at dialog zingers—but he writes women characters badly and stereotypically and I blame him for letting Servalan go from brilliant to pantomime.

What's I liked about the show was that Blake was such a mess. He had these noble ideas but was poor at executing them. He was no shining hero, but a flawed man trying to do the impossible and finding his morality slipping away as he became increasingly obsessed. "We did it! We did it! I did it!" in "Pressure Point" reveals who he's become and how personal this crusade has gotten.

Series A & B are, in my opinion, the best. Series C goes a bit rudderless post the events in Star One, and series D, where they basically have to reboot, is a hot mess with a few good episodes (my fave is "Gold").

Travis Mk. 1 all the way!

I'm sure @Ryan Thomas Riddle can chime in. ;)
 
Without being $poilery for anyone who's not seen it...

As Terry Nation was less and less involved in Blake's 7 the grittier tone went with it. Chris Boucher was a better writer—certainly at dialog zingers—but he writes women characters badly and stereotypically and I blame him for letting Servalan go from brilliant to pantomime.

Series A & B are, in my opinion, the best. Series C goes a bit rudderless post the events in Star One, and series D, where they basically have to reboot, is a hot mess with a few good episodes (my fave is "Gold").

Travis Mk. 1 all the way!

I'm sure @Ryan Thomas Riddle can chime in. ;)

Chris Boucher problematic writing of women is prevalent in his own creation, Star Cops. The women are either submissive or bitchy. There's no in-between. And the men treat them as not nearly as capable as them.

Blake's 7 is great. I'd seen it years ago as a teenager, but found it hokey (and I loved the Tom Baker Doctor Who era). Maurice got me into it recently, and I loved it. The show appeals to my anti-authortarian nature. I agree with Maurice on the quality—Series A/B are very strong. Series C has a really fantastic finale. Series D is such a mess that I stopped after watching "Gold."

Watching Series D, I realized that the episode I saw as a teen was from this series. No wonder I didn't get into it earlier. If you're a Babylon 5 fan, I recommend B7 because you'll see how it influenced JMS, especially with the B5 crew going up against EarthGov.
 
City is the best episode of Star Trek.
Great acting, great interaction between Kirk and Edith. Very believable. In fact weren't they an item for say 5 minutes.
How many white people would have interacted with Chinese people in the 30s? Not just looked at them from afar. Say know the difference between the Asian races. Not many New York policeman I think.
I'm sorry you're bored with episodes that go back to Earth. But these were the first. Be bored with them in TNG and Voyager which had a lot more money to spend than original Star Trek.
Yes its unlikely that they would have coincidentally met Edith like McCoy did but Spock said there were eddies in time blah blah that led them to the same place. Much more believe than nuTrek getting the same exact crew together.

And Blakes7 is the best.
 
She only predicted nuclear energy and spaceflight, which were a common sci-fi and early real world topic at the time
But she also talked about man coming together to explore space, and to eliminate world hunger and stuff like that, which was exactly what Starfleet and the Federation accomplished. It's a little too on the nose and coincidental. I was just waiting for her to say, "...and in the future, once we're able to make this, trek through the stars, racism and nationalism will be a thing of the past, and we'll see people of all diverse backgrounds serving aboard space crafts and..."
 
. . . "My friend is obviously...Chinese. And his ears...they got caught in a rice picker." I can imagine a person from the the 60s trying to convince someone else that Spock's alien look is really just his Chinese features, but I found it hard to believe a human from the 23rd century would come up with a like like that. Not just the Chinese thing, but also the rice picker explanation. :(
Well, it is a comedy relief scene. And it's funny. Kirk clumsily tries to ad-lib a plausible explanation for Spock's unusual appearance, and the cop couldn't care less! All he cares about is doing his job -- and he's just caught two thieves red-handed.
Yep. That whole "runes" thing is one of about 40 myths about that episode.
Like the one Gene Roddenberry perpetrated about Ellison's script: "He had my Scotty dealing drugs!"
 
I like Joan Collins as Edith she was also good in fantastic journey. I know Harlon must of
been hard for rodenberry to work with but I wish he wrote more for star trek and am thsnkfull he took over as host of hour 25 when mike hodel passed.you van listen to old hour 25 shows on u tube
 
Looking at the paper trail it's clear the Trek people didn't know how to deal with Harlan's story. The script he delivered is beat for beat the story outline they approved, but the show was evolving and no one seemed able to articulate actionable suggestions for him to make his story work for what the show was becoming.
 
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