Unpopular Trek opinions game

[Discofan]

There are human beings on Earth who have the same or similar difficulties with emotions as Data, due to variations in neurology etc.. That doesn't make them less human.

I beg to differ. Even humans who have trouble expressing them or reading them in others, do have emotions. Data, as he keeps reminding us, doesn't feel ANY emotion and is completely incapable of processing them. His first relationship with a woman is embarrassing to watch. The doctor never had that kind of trouble.

Just wanted to respectfully point out... "Feel" or "sense" would be a better word in this case. "Resent" in modern English specifically refers to a negative, grudging feeling toward someone or something, different from French "ressentir."

Kor

You're absolutely right of course and I knew that but sometimes even when you know something and when you've applied it rightly a hundred times, well, you will make a mistake the hundred and first time... inexplicably. I suppose that that's what being human is all about. "Errare Humanum Est"... That phrase is more than two thousand years old.

 

[BillJ]

You're not being honest. The doctor is human from the very start. At worst he lacked social skills but he acquired them in a few years. Data couldn't understand anything human, not love, not humor, not anything after years of having been among humans. As I said, it's not even a close call. The doctor is the closest thing to a human being that was ever artificially produced. Data at his best was only an imitation and sometimes not even a good one.

The Doctor was programmed to act like a prick, and did so more often than not. His personality was purely based on Zimmerman's. Data was built, then allowed to develop his own personality. Which he did as the show progressed.

 

[Discofan]

The Doctor was programmed to act like a prick, and did so more often than not. His personality was purely based on Zimmerman's. Data was built, then allowed to develop his own personality. Which he did as the show progressed.

It's preferable to be a prick to an unfeeling automaton that keeps making wrong assumptions about human feelings.

We're all pricks at times, but most of us have never been unfeeling string puppets. At least I hope so. Before he dated a woman data read everything he could find on the subject and still he couldn't get it right, not by a mile!!!

 

[BillJ]

We're all pricks at times, but most of us have never been unfeeling string puppets.

But that wasn't Data, as the Enterprise crew acknowledged more than once. Data may not have understood them, but clearly there was something there. Not to mention he picked up D'Sora on the rebound and she also didn't seem fully committed to the relationship.

Before he dated a woman data read everything he could find on the subject and still he couldn't get it right, not by a mile!!!

I'm sure there are dozens of movies out there where the guy thinks he knows everything about women and yet still doesn't get it right.

I'm still trying to figure out your point because it was originally about Zimmerman being better than Noonien Soong. When it gets pointed out that simply isn't the case, you try to pick on Data's character flaws. Which are far more realistic than the Doctor's.

 

[Discofan]

But that wasn't Data, as the Enterprise crew acknowledged more than once. Data may not have understood them, but clearly there was something there. Not to mention he picked up D'Sora on the rebound and she also didn't seem fully committed to the relationship.



I'm sure there are dozens of movies out there where the guy thinks he knows everything about women and yet still doesn't get it right.

I'm still trying to figure out your point because it was originally about Zimmerman being better than Noonien Soong. When it gets pointed out that simply isn't the case, you try to pick on Data's character flaws. Which are far more realistic than the Doctor's.

You didn't point out anything. As I said but you keep ignoring it. The doctor is much closer to a human being than data could ever hope to be. The doctor may have been a prick at the beginning (and he was) but a prick is a human being, a blank slate isn't. Zimmerman achieved without breaking a sweat what took decades to Soong to not get quite right.

Data's relationship with a woman was a ridiculous fiasco, a disaster and yet you keep defending it. Why? To me, that sounds desperate.

It's in cases like that that you see something is missing in Data's programming that the doctor had from the very start.

I keep proving to you that I am right and you keep ignoring it.

 

[BillJ]

Zimmerman achieved without breaking a sweat what took decades to Soong to not get quite right.

Juliana Tainer proved Soong got it "right", and long before Zimmerman. And Zimmerman had nothing to do with the Doctor's sentience, as proven by the fact all other Mark I EMH's are breaking rocks.

I keep proving to you that I am right and you keep ignoring it.

Man, I wish the world actually worked this way. Where you just declare that you win. But, hey, keep at it.

 

[Kor]

Data developed preferences in the areas of arts and music, he experienced something positive from friendship with Geordi and others as well as from the company of his cat Spot, and he has the ongoing aspiration to be more human.

I think all this indicates that even without the emotion chip, somewhere, deep within his positronic matrix, there must have been some kind of rudimentary emotional response even if he didn't understand it as such on a "conscious" level. The emotion chip definitely made it more intense and discernible as a range of human emotions, though.

Kor

 

[Discofan]

Juliana Tainer proved Soong got it "right", and long before Zimmerman. And Zimmerman had nothing to do with the Doctor's sentience, as proven by the fact all other Mark I EMH's are breaking rocks.



Man, I wish the world actually worked this way. Where you just declare that you win. But, hey, keep at it.

Coincidentally that's what you do. You bring nothing to the table but keep pretending that that nothing is everything.

 

[BillJ]

Data developed preferences in the areas of arts and music, he experienced something positive from friendship with Geordi and others as well as from the company of his cat Spot, and he has the ongoing aspiration to be more human.

I think all this indicates that even without the emotion chip, somewhere, deep within his positronic matrix, there must have been some kind of rudimentary emotional response even if he didn't understand it as such on a "conscious" level. The emotion chip definitely made it more intense and discernible as a range of human emotions, though.

Shh... Discofan has already declared victory!

 

[BillJ]

Coincidentally that's what you do. You bring nothing to the table but keep pretending that that nothing is everything.

Did you want to do a victory dance?!

 

[Discofan]

Data developed preferences in the areas of arts and music, he experienced something positive from friendship with Geordi and others as well as from the company of his cat Spot, and he has the ongoing aspiration to be more human.

I think all this indicates that even without the emotion chip, somewhere, deep within his positronic matrix, there must have been some kind of rudimentary emotional response even if he didn't understand it as such on a "conscious" level. The emotion chip definitely made it more intense and discernible as a range of human emotions, though.

Kor

Data's idea of art is to randomly mix other people's talents. Like when he plays the violin sixty percent like say Menuhin and forty percent like Perlman. That's not art, that's bullshit. You don't create art with numbers!!!

 

[Discofan]

As we see in one episode even the doctor(s) that end up "breaking rocks" have developed sentience...

Did you want to do a victory dance?!

I'll wait for you to say something relevant. I hope I'll live that long.

 

[fireproof78]

Man, I wish the world actually worked this way. Where you just declare that you win. But, hey, keep at it.

Welcome to the Internet.

 

[BillJ]

I'll wait for you to say something relevant. I hope I'll live that long.

In time, you'll come around... or you won't. No sweat off of my balls.

 

[Kor]

Data doesn't give himself enough credit when it comes to his artistic endeavors, his ability to come up with creative solutions to problems, or the fact that he feels something.
But Picard recognizes it:

PICARD: The good doctor was kind enough to provide me with a recording of your concert. Your performance shows feeling.
DATA: As I have recently reminded others, sir, I have no feeling.
PICARD: It's hard to believe. Your playing is quite beautiful.
DATA: Strictly speaking, sir, it is not my playing. It is a precise imitation of the techniques of Jascha Heifetz and Trenka Bronken.
PICARD: Is there nothing of Data in what I'm hearing? You see, you chose the violinists. Heifetz and Bronken have radically different styles, different techniques, yet you combined them successfully.
DATA: I suppose I have learned to be creative, sir, when necessary.

But perhaps we might move on to a different unpopular "Trek" opinion, for the sake of variety...

Kor

 

[Lord Garth]

I like the TAS theme. Very '70s.

 

[Vger23]

Like a slave? Star Trek fans really are creepy racists, aren't you?

 

[Discofan]

In time, you'll come around... or you won't. No sweat off of my balls.

Whatever you say...

 

[1001001]

Okay that's enough of that.

 

[Datalore1701]

Disagree. I'll take the reboot movies over all of the TNG movies except FIRST CONTACT. And trust me, the world is full of movies that are lot more loathsome and execrable . . . and I've seen many of them.

Unpopular opinion: "Catspaw" is seriously cool.

I agree, but I enjoy the reboot movies for different reasons to the TNG movies. Also "Catspaw" doesn't deserve all the criticism is cops.