Poll Did the sequel trilogy add anything meaningful to the saga?

[fireproof78]

One thing I wish the ST had done is to really show us this fancy New Republic from the get-go. Give us a better sense of what exactly came of all the heroic escapades of the Alliance to Restore the Republic thirty-five or so years prior. Do we have a thriving, prosperous galactic community that has gotten kind of complacent about possible threats to galactic security? Or do we have a loose coalition that barely manages to hold together cohesively, and is too worried about internal problems and bickering to notice external threats? I understand some of the new books described the New Republic more, but from the movies themselves we simply don't know!

What we got instead with the "Resistance" out in the galactic badlands just seemed to echo the situation of the OT-era Rebellion too closely, and make it look like nothing really changed in the last three decades. The Republic is name-dropped a couple times, but we don't really get a sense of what's at stake, since we once again have this ragtag group of misfits out in the galactic rim, now making guerrilla runs against some Imperial-wannabe upstarts. Then when the Death Star Mk. III destroys some New Republic planets and capital ships with its Giant Plasma Weapon of Doom (tm), we don't really care, since we were never really made to care in the first place, and the situation of the protagonists themselves hasn't really changed.

I would have loved to have been immersed in this hard-won peaceful New Republic, and then have that world unexpectedly uprooted and shattered by the First Order (or whoever).

Kor

One of the few things I do wish for from the ST was more political exploration.

However, I'll completely disagree that people don't really care. I cared when the Republic blows up. It changes the course of war. I just wish I had more of the New Republic. But, that's what books are for for me. Same with Episode 1.

 

[Owain Taggart]

One of the few things I do wish for from the ST was more political exploration.

Which is kind of ironic given that after the PT, people were all like, "No, no more politics! That's not what SW is about!" But IMHO, I think there has to be at least a little bit of it to explore the state of the Galaxy. I do think Lucas knew what he was doing in setting everything up. It's not like we're asking for a SW movie about a young hotshot lawyer. Although that'd be kind of cool (Yes, that one is a joke).

 

[fireproof78]

Which is kind of ironic given that after the PT, people were all like, "No, no more politics! That's not what SW is about!" But IMHO, I think there has to be at least a little bit of it to explore the state of the Galaxy. I do think Lucas knew what he was doing in setting everything up. It's not like we're asking for a SW movie about a young hotshot lawyer. Although that'd be kind of cool (Yes, that one is a joke).

It is ironic given the outcry. My biggest issue with the PT politics is that it made little sense. And I do agree the ST could have benefited from some sort of "state of the galaxy" type address.

Also, one could argue that Palpatine was kind of like a galactic lawyer: "I have the Senate bogged down in procedures..."

 

[crookeddy]

The ST was terrified of politics because of the PT outcry, just like they wanted to avoid clones, and basically they avoided a lot of the PT altogether, seemingly out of fear of association.

 

[fireproof78]

The ST was terrified of politics because of the PT outcry, just like they wanted to avoid clones, and basically they avoided a lot of the PT altogether, seemingly out of fear of association.

Yup. I stand by my assertion that Hollywood is ruled by fear.

 

[Owain Taggart]

The ST was terrified of politics because of the PT outcry, just like they wanted to avoid clones, and basically they avoided a lot of the PT altogether, seemingly out of fear of association.

And I don't blame them for being out of their way to avoid it. When the ST was announced, part of me wondered if they would touch on it or completely avoid it for fear of making the same mistake. But at the same time, I think on completely avoiding the politics side of things, they lost out on some texture that needed to be there.

Also, one could argue that Palpatine was kind of like a galactic lawyer: "I have the Senate bogged down in procedures..."

New Disney+ Series: Young Palpatine: Galaxy Lawyer

 

[Captaindemotion]

New Disney+ Series: Young Palpatine: Galaxy Lawyer

Coruscant Legal: with James Spader as Palpatine and William Shatner as Darth Plagueis.

 

[fireproof78]

And I don't blame them for being out of their way to avoid it. When the ST was announced, part of me wondered if they would touch on it or completely avoid it for fear of making the same mistake. But at the same time, I think on completely avoiding the politics side of things, they lost out on some texture that needed to be there.

I think so too, but what I gleaned from context clues was supported by book material so I'm OK with it now.

 

[Owain Taggart]

supported by book material

When a major portion of your viewing public likely never reads any of the EU, I think it's a problem though. It's not solely a SW problem, as it's something that's been happening more and more in movies to shove some of the explanations and details off onto novels or accompanying materials, where in the past this very kind of thing would have had a place on screen. And I think it's due to a changing mentality in moviemaking that's all too easy to fall back on.

 

[fireproof78]

When a major portion of your viewing public likely never reads any of the EU, I think it's a problem though. It's not solely a SW problem, as it's something that's been happening more and more in movies to shove some of the explanations and details off onto novels or accompanying materials, where in the past this very kind of thing would have had a place on screen. And I think it's due to a changing mentality in moviemaking that's all too easy to fall back on.

Oh, I completely agree. It's a frustrating aspect for me with a lot of SW but I became accustom to it with the PT. It isn't ideal, but it is the nature of the beast. For me, more SW is preferable so I go with it. But, I totally understand if others don't want to make that effort because a film ought to be self-contained.

 

[plynch]

Up through ep 8, it added that things fall apart, fair-haired heroes get old and jaded, and have things not work out; but they can be redeemed (esp. if someone believes in them) and do something great again. Oh, and "nobodies" can do great things.

Then in 9 I learned that's not true, one must be from an elite family.

 

[fireproof78]

Up through ep 8, it added that things fall apart, fair-haired heroes get old and jaded, and have things not work out; but they can be redeemed (esp. if someone believes in them) and do something great again. Oh, and "nobodies" can do great things.

That is still true, even in 9.

 

[plynch]

First chunk (Luke) is still true, but alas, it really seems like you have to be from a major house to be THE hero. I was really, really disappointed in the Rey reveal (is it a spoiler yet?). It became just another meh, defeat the creepy-looking bad guy again (again!) movie. The more I think, the worse this movie gets in its lost potential, not any objective badness.

 

[Scherazade]

First chunk (Luke) is still true, but alas, it really seems like you have to be from a major house to be THE hero. I was really, really disappointed in the Rey reveal (is it a spoiler yet?). It became just another meh, defeat the creepy-looking bad guy again (again!) movie. The more I think, the worse this movie gets in its lost potential, not any objective badness.

This sums up my issue with the whole trilogy, not just episode 9. While I have seen the OT and PT, the reason I consider myself a Star Wars fan today is the Clone Wars TV show. It did such a fantastic job of making the galaxy and story grow. So when the ST was announced I was more excited for what stories they could tell between and around the movies than the movies themselves. But the way the trilogy was constructed pretty much killed that for me, with so many zig-zags and contradictions present.

 

[fireproof78]

First chunk (Luke) is still true, but alas, it really seems like you have to be from a major house to be THE hero. I was really, really disappointed in the Rey reveal (is it a spoiler yet?). It became just another meh, defeat the creepy-looking bad guy again (again!) movie.

What else was it going to be? If Snoke survived it would have been creepy looking bad guy. If Kylo is the villain it would be emo looking bad guy.

Regardless, I disagree that you must be from a major house to be THE hero. I think that there are plenty of hero characters throughout the Saga that exemplify that fact. The story just happens to be about the Skywalkers, their impact, the demons, and their legacy.

The more I think, the worse this movie gets in its lost potential, not any objective badness.

Same here. I love these movies but there is more that could have been done. I both appreciate the films and recognize potential for more.

 

[DigificWriter]

one must be from an elite family.

This is a demonstrably inaccurate statement as proven by all of Star Wars, including The Rise of Skywalker itself.

 

[Xerxes82]

Regardless, I disagree that you must be from a major house to be THE hero. I think that there are plenty of hero characters throughout the Saga that exemplify that fact. The story just happens to be about the Skywalkers, their impact, the demons, and their legacy.

While I'm not a fan of the Rey Palpatine reveal in general terms, I'm a lot less bothered by it considering how well the film utilized it thematically at the climax.

This is most obvious in Rey's literal choice of who to be. She rejects the Emperor, and instead chooses to honor the path of her mentors. In this way she is not defined by who she is supposed to be but chooses for herself who she will become. The movie had been building that thematically almost from her first scene. And it fits quite well, in many ways, with her journey in TLJ as well. But Rise goes further than that with the ending.

The Emperor is the guy who cheats, defies, and generally finds ways to defeat death. Given the evidence of the PT, and in particular RotS, we might even be able to argue that the entire purpose of the Sith is to accumulate enough power to defy death and live forever. Immortality is effectively his endgame, in an oblique kind of way. (I have a whole essay I could write on this subject, and how it relates to the Sith unbalancing the Force, but I won't get into it.)

And yet the way most people achieve immortality is through legacy. Not living forever themselves but passing who they are, what they stand for, and what they have learned on to the next generation. In this way Rey, being Palpatine's granddaughter, is his natural legacy, as opposed to the unnatural one he tries to carve out as a Sith. So, on the one had you have the natural progression of life standing against the unnatural perversion of it.

But in rejecting her Palpatine heritage for the path of Luke and Leia, in embracing the ideals of the Skywalkers rather than her grandfather, Rey isn't a furthering of Palpatine's legacy at all. She's the destruction of it. Even with Ben Solo dead, Rey has chosen to pass on the ideals and teachings of the Skywalkers rather than the Palpatines. Though she is his literal and biological legacy, she has become the heir to the legacy of Skywalker. Nature rejects Palpatine. Rey's victory utterly destroys the Emperor's legacy. He truly, in every possibly way, dies. Not even the natural path to immortality remains open to him.

It is, in this way, that Rey's final line is so significant and so monumental. It's true that she defeats the Emperor, and destroys his physical form. But her true and most absolute victory is eradicating his legacy. And preserving that of the Skywalkers.

So, even though I'm not necessarily happy with them reaching back to the Palpatine well for either the villain or Rey's family identity, I did think Rise at least used what it set up well.

 

[fireproof78]

t is, in this way, that Rey's final line is so significant and so monumental. It's true that she defeats the Emperor, and destroys his physical form. But her true and most absolute victory is eradicating his legacy. And preserving that of the Skywalkers.

Quite right, on all counts. She completely validates the Skywalker legacy and sacrifice by emulating it to the last.

 

[Owain Taggart]

Oh, I completely agree. It's a frustrating aspect for me with a lot of SW but I became accustom to it with the PT. It isn't ideal, but it is the nature of the beast. For me, more SW is preferable so I go with it. But, I totally understand if others don't want to make that effort because a film ought to be self-contained.

Yeah, it's SWs, so I think in many ways, I think it's to be expected given the type of movie it is. I mean, I wasn't expecting large amounts of people standing around explaining things, but I felt that even then, the ST seriously dropped the ball for the kind of movie it is. Personally, I just don't have the time or inclination to chase down and read every bit of material just so I can get the full grasp. At most, all I've done is read the Thrawn novels because I've felt those were more directly relevant following ROTJ and I've recently picked up the 2nd prequel. Other than that I haven't touched any other part of the EU.

 

[fireproof78]

Yeah, it's SWs, so I think in many ways, I think it's to be expected given the type of movie it is. I mean, I wasn't expecting large amounts of people standing around explaining things, but I felt that even then, the ST seriously dropped the ball for the kind of movie it is. Personally, I just don't have the time or inclination to chase down and read every bit of material just so I can get the full grasp. At most, all I've done is read the Thrawn novels because I've felt those were more directly relevant following ROTJ and I've recently picked up the 2nd prequel. Other than that I haven't touched any other part of the EU.

I haven't read the novels either. The Visual Dictionaries are probably my best resource to this end.