Continuity of TNG

[lazarus+]

Re Klingon forehead changes: I've decided that Kor, Koloth and Kang (for their appearance in DS9) had plastic surgery to add ridges, because it was now shameful to be descended from the augment-virus generation.

I think that's as good a seamless reason as we'd ever expect by now.

 

[Herbert]

Why do people never run into walls on the holodeck? They say that it "uses the space well," but you can only go so far in one room.

Maybe the holodeck is in reality a pocket dimension where the insides are much larger than they appear to be.

Spoiler

No, not serious but easily as plausible as many of the batshit crazy theories proffered in this board.

 

[Kor]

I remember reading that one of the classic Klingon actors who returned in "Blood Oath" asked the makeup people why they had to wear these forehead getups, when that's not they way they looked before. The possibly tongue-in-cheek response was that now they were playing old Klingons, and their appearance had changed with age.

Edit: I found more details here at Memory Alpha: https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Depicting_Klingons#.22Blood_Oath.22

Kor

 

[Herbert]

Here's mine: Somebody explain to me why there is so little running aboard ship, during crises on TNG? Ship's got minutes left before catastrophe, & our heroes are just trotting down the corridors

I noticed that as well. There's some medical emergency and Dr Beverly is casually strolling down the corridor.

 

[Christopher]

I remember reading that one of the classic Klingon actors who returned in "Blood Oath" asked the makeup people why they had to wear these forehead getups, when that's not they way they looked before. The possibly tongue-in-cheek response was that now they were playing old Klingons, and their appearance had changed with age.

Edit: I found more details here at Memory Alpha: https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Depicting_Klingons#.22Blood_Oath.22

I always figured they were still going by the "They always looked that way" theory at that time, and the article confirms it. Although the excuse they gave the actors, that the Klingons naturally grew ridges as they aged, was my personal theory for a while -- that the TOS Klingons were some kind of hybrid race (I was thinking of Klingons and Sargon's people) that looked human in their youth and gradually developed ridges with age (so General Chang would be early in that process).

 

[Prax]

TOS was actually a series of Starfleet training videos shown to cadets, and they used human actors to portray the Klingons.

 

[WildManWizard]

TOS was actually a series of Starfleet training videos shown to cadets, and they used human actors to portray the Klingons.

i would love a huge mind fornication like that if they used that idea in the new picard show. even though I love TOS I would enjoy the tizzy it would send us in!

 

[Iamnotspock]

As for Ten Forward - we don't know it wasn't already there during season one and we just didn't get to see it, but that could have been done a this time as well coinciding with Guinan's arrival.

We do, per dialogue in "All Good Things." Troi recalls that when Picard first boarded the Enterprise seven years earlier, there was "a reception in Ten Forward" where she introduced him to Worf and the other senior officers. Perhaps the bar itself wasn't built until Season 2 and there were replicators there before that, like Voyager's Mess Hall in "Caretaker," or it was simply a function room during Season 1, but it seems that the room itself was always there.

 

[Christopher]

We do, per dialogue in "All Good Things." Troi recalls that when Picard first boarded the Enterprise seven years earlier, there was "a reception in Ten Forward" where she introduced him to Worf and the other senior officers. Perhaps the bar itself wasn't built until Season 2 and there were replicators there before that, like Voyager's Mess Hall in "Caretaker," or it was simply a function room during Season 1, but it seems that the room itself was always there.

I think the intent was that Ten Forward was always there, that people were going there offscreen even if it never showed up in an episode. When it was first introduced in "The Child," it's talked about as an established place; Picard remarks that Pulaski has "already found Ten Forward" after only hours aboard, and Wesley tells Guinan that he likes to stand at the window looking out, implying it's a longstanding habit.

 

[diankra]

I always figured they were still going by the "They always looked that way" theory at that time, and the article confirms it. Although the excuse they gave the actors, that the Klingons naturally grew ridges as they aged, was my personal theory for a while -- that the TOS Klingons were some kind of hybrid race (I was thinking of Klingons and Sargon's people) that looked human in their youth and gradually developed ridges with age (so General Chang would be early in that process).

The John Ford Klingon hybrids approach, vaguely. Always liked that idea, the notion of the State owning your genome and by default your ability to reproduce.

 

[Lance]

We do, per dialogue in "All Good Things." Troi recalls that when Picard first boarded the Enterprise seven years earlier, there was "a reception in Ten Forward" where she introduced him to Worf and the other senior officers. Perhaps the bar itself wasn't built until Season 2 and there were replicators there before that, like Voyager's Mess Hall in "Caretaker," or it was simply a function room during Season 1, but it seems that the room itself was always there.

I like the idea that ala Voyager it may have been a mess hall or similar in season one, and converted to a bar in season two after Guinan's arrival (one thing we know factually is that Guinan didn't arrive until after "Skin of Evil" at the very earliest, as per dialogue in "Yesterday's Enterprise").

 

[Silvercrest]

Why do people never run into walls on the holodeck? They say that it "uses the space well," but you can only go so far in one room.

"Treadmill" force fields in the floor, according to the TNG Tech Manual. Also, if you walk away from someone else who stands still, the holodeck generates false images to make it look to both of you like you're getting further apart when you're actually still close together.

I always thought it'd be easier to justify if the holodeck was spherical instead of cubical. With altered gravity control and a few false images, you wouldn't even need treadmill force fields ... any number of people could walk for as far as they wanted and never hit a wall.

Sadly, I can't even use that idea in "head-canon" considering that every single view of the holodeck is of an obviously cubical room. But it would've been cool.

 

[Prax]

Well, the holosuites are octogonal(erm...octahedron? Hexagonal prism?) That's close to spherical, but I don't see how they play baseball in it.

If you're running Sherlock Holmes, Data is upstairs in a house, and Geordi down on the street, and Geordi says "Computer, end program," does data fall 10 feet to the ground?

 

[Christopher]

If you're running Sherlock Holmes, Data is upstairs in a house, and Geordi down on the street, and Geordi says "Computer, end program," does data fall 10 feet to the ground?

They're probably both still on the same level, with the "treadmill" force fields and holographic illusions making it look and feel to Data like he climbed a staircase.

My big question is about "Take Me Out to the Holosuite." Between the teams, the managers, the umpire, etc., there were probably around two dozen real people participating in the ball game, but when we've seen Quark's bare holosuite, it was nowhere near large enough to hold such a crowd and give them any room to move, no matter how elaborate the force fields. So were they networking from different suites? Or does Quark have a larger holosuite we never saw?

 

[Damian]

Re Klingon forehead changes: I've decided that Kor, Koloth and Kang (for their appearance in DS9) had plastic surgery to add ridges, because it was now shameful to be descended from the augment-virus generation.

The Excelsior novel "Forged In Fire" does offer up an explanation that a cure had been found for the augment virus--which was presented as the reason no human looking Klingons were seen by the time of the movies and beyond.

I figured that made sense. Eventually they'd come up with some cure if it was that important to them.

On the flip side some early novels offered differing explanations. I think "The Final Reflection" actually presented a genetic engineering idea (which is what I always assumed would be the best explanation). I think one or two novels may have mentioned plastic surgery as well to help them in their dealings with 'Earthers'.

As far as the overall continuity of TNG---well I am a continuity junkie as my complaints about Discovery can attest to. However I never much sweated the small stuff. O'Brien's carrying a Lt rank before being a CPO is one of those. Perhaps it could be explained in universe that he was an acting lieutenant (like Wesley being acting Ensign) until their crew was filled out. It's probably a stretch (I mean, they probably could have had a chief petty office work a bridge station without the rank).

Worf's cranial ridges? Well, I think as Christopher noted earlier, that's probably best left unexplained. Show producers finesse things all the time and sometimes you just have to let a square be a circle and leave it at that.

My big question is about "Take Me Out to the Holosuite." Between the teams, the managers, the umpire, etc., there were probably around two dozen real people participating in the ball game, but when we've seen Quark's bare holosuite, it was nowhere near large enough to hold such a crowd and give them any room to move, no matter how elaborate the force fields. So were they networking from different suites? Or does Quark have a larger holosuite we never saw?

Hmm, good question. And we know Quark didn't have top of the line holoquites since it was held together by spatulas and forks (and probably some duct tape as well--that's good for anything ). Like Worf's cranial ridge changes I guess they just want us to accept it. Perhaps it involves something like we have today with holographic goggle games we see along with the force field style treadmills. Maybe they are all still really close together but see an illusion of distance.

 

[ThankQ]

"Treadmill" force fields in the floor, according to the TNG Tech Manual. Also, if you walk away from someone else who stands still, the holodeck generates false images to make it look to both of you like you're getting further apart when you're actually still close together.

On the holodeck, we're in a meadow of ankle-high grass. In Kansas. As we all know, Kansas is perfectly flat and has no features whatsoever.
We start back-to-back. You walk east, I walk west. Tell me, how is that thing gonna fool us?

 

[lazarus+]

Tell me, how is that thing gonna fool us?

Very effectively and very carefully is how. Uh, forcefield lensing of the light between each persons eyes?

Complicated but the computer could do it.

 

[Christopher]

We start back-to-back. You walk east, I walk west. Tell me, how is that thing gonna fool us?

Didn't I already answer that? Treadmill force fields in the floor to make you feel like you're walking while you're standing still (maybe only kicking in once you near a wall), and holographic projections distorting your visual perception so you think you're getting farther from your friend. (Sounds and such would have to be interfered with too, but force fields could probably suppress sounds from the other side.)

 

[Prax]

It could be that Quark has a larger holosuite for working out, and the small ones we see are for his brothel business.

People really shouldn't sit on the floors in those things(Sisko, Jadzia). You never know what kind of gonasyphaherpalades might still be crawling around

 

[Lance]

Why do people never run into walls on the holodeck? They say that it "uses the space well," but you can only go so far in one room.

"Treadmill" force fields in the floor, according to the TNG Tech Manual.

Yeah, the concept is that it's a kind of optical illusion. When you step onto those grid lines and activate the program, you're 'locked' into place and effectively no matter how much you move, you're really just running on the spot while the simulation moves 'around' you convincingly.