Based on the loud (but small) reactions to TLJ and Disney's continued work with Rian Johnson, I'm far more inclined to believe #1 or #2 and agree that its more likely #2.
#3 just doesn't sit right based on the situation at hand.
News Benioff and Weiss Leave Star Wars
- Thread starter Campe
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Based on the loud (but small) reactions to TLJ and Disney's continued work with Rian Johnson, I'm far more inclined to believe #1 or #2 and agree that its more likely #2.
#3 just doesn't sit right based on the situation at hand.
David and Dan didn't give two shits about the GoT backlash, but they also didn't have the balls to face it.
They had a job, they did their job, they made money for HBO.
Their job is not appease the customers (that's HBO's job) it's to make TV and earn money.
Who gives a dingo's kidneys over the internets "backlash"?
Despite all the complaints about agenda-driven diversity in the Disney Star Wars franchise (as if that's a bad thing), Kathleen Kennedy has not actually used her bully pulpit to push for more women in showrunner or directing roles, like she could/should. I'd like to see the following women get a shot on a SW project:
Phoebe Waller-Bridge - Already has a connection with the SW production staff after playing L3-37 in Solo, who kind of stole the show, and is an accomplished writer, producer, and show creator in her own right (Fleabag, Killing Eve, co-writing the next Bond film).
Ava DuVerney - More well-known for her historical films and documentaries, she also worked in the genre on DCs upcoming New Gods film and has a Disney connection from making A Wrinkle in Time.
Dee Rees - Also not typically thought of as a genre director, but she did write and direct several episodes of Philip K. Dick's Electric Dreams,
The Wachowskis - If you want directors with major skiffy cred who can make something batshit crazy (like Jupiter Descending) and unique (in a good way, hopefully).
I'd also like to see Patty Jenkins, Kathryn Bigelow, Mimi Leder, and Jodie Foster get a shot at directing a SW film or being a showrunner.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patty_Jenkins
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathryn_Bigelow
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mimi_Leder
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jodie_Foster
On the male side, if you want to get the Game of Thrones cred without all the baggage of D&D, then director Miguel Sapochnik is the guy to go-to for epic episodes and battles.
The Russo Bros. are already in-house, bring in bank, love Star Wars, can deliver a quality genre film with a huge ensemble cast, and are apparently responsible and easy for the studio to work with.
Rounding out the list are Ryan Coogler and Steve McQueen.
Phoebe Waller-Bridge - Already has a connection with the SW production staff after playing L3-37 in Solo, who kind of stole the show, and is an accomplished writer, producer, and show creator in her own right (Fleabag, Killing Eve, co-writing the next Bond film).
Ava DuVerney - More well-known for her historical films and documentaries, she also worked in the genre on DCs upcoming New Gods film and has a Disney connection from making A Wrinkle in Time.
Dee Rees - Also not typically thought of as a genre director, but she did write and direct several episodes of Philip K. Dick's Electric Dreams,
The Wachowskis - If you want directors with major skiffy cred who can make something batshit crazy (like Jupiter Descending) and unique (in a good way, hopefully).
I'd also like to see Patty Jenkins, Kathryn Bigelow, Mimi Leder, and Jodie Foster get a shot at directing a SW film or being a showrunner.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patty_Jenkins
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathryn_Bigelow
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mimi_Leder
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jodie_Foster
On the male side, if you want to get the Game of Thrones cred without all the baggage of D&D, then director Miguel Sapochnik is the guy to go-to for epic episodes and battles.
The Russo Bros. are already in-house, bring in bank, love Star Wars, can deliver a quality genre film with a huge ensemble cast, and are apparently responsible and easy for the studio to work with.
Rounding out the list are Ryan Coogler and Steve McQueen.
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They knew there was going to be backlash to the finale of Game of Thrones, and openly admitted this; they also openly admitted that they were going to be hiding from said backlash by going on vacation to places where Internet access was limited.... and they said this while there were still 3 episodes left of the season to air.
Hence why I said that they didn't care about the backlash, but they also didn't have the balls to face it.
Listening to people whine about whatever decision I made would see me going on vacation as well. Or, I'd go all Bob Orci and tell them to fuck off.
Full disclosure on the following link: The article to which it pertains was written by someone who did not like the final season of Game of Thrones, but that's not the important part of it; what is important is that it documents and summarizes David and Dan's open, forthright, and repeated comments about the GoT finale and their plans during and after its airing.
https://www.cinemablend.com/televis...e-hiding-from-angry-fans-until-finale-is-over
As the article demonstrates, they knew there was going to be backlash and they openly admitted that they were going to be hiding from said backlash, which betrays their true feelings on the whole situation.
If you're truly confident in what you've done, you don't admit that you're not going to be watching to see the audience's reaction to it.
That's a load of horseshit. Lots of people move on from projects as soon as their part in it is over. They're already on to the next thing. This isn't the life-and-death that it is to fandom.
Hiding from the backlash isn't 'moving on after something ends'; it's hiding from the backlash because you know that people aren't going to be happy with what you did.
An example of individuals whose behavior in the days following the release of their series finale - which caused a bunch of controversy - is the polar opposite of what Benioff and Weiss had decided to do is Voltron Legendary Defender showrunners Lauren Montgomery and Joaquim Dos Santos.
The pair not only faced the backlash head-on, they acknowledged the reasoning behind it while also still standing by their own creative decisions and explaining the reasons those decisions had been made, and were even brave enough to admit that the backlash caught them off-guard because they genuinely believed in the story they had chosen to tell.
They have both since moved on to other projects, but they were willing to face the backlash before they moved on.
Benioff and Weiss, by contrast, pre-planned a drunken vacation without Internet access because they couldn't handle angry fans - whom they knew were going to be angry - coming after them, and announced said vacation significantly in advance of the finale (I had said it was made while 3 episodes of the season had aired, but had my timeline slightly off, as the statements were made before the season had actually even debuted).
I'm not seeing the big deal here? Do you think these folks should hang around and be proverbial pinatas for fan rage?
Yes, because it shows that they truly own their creative decisions and aren't afraid to face and accept the consequences of them.
I personally didn't find the conclusion of Voltron Legendary Defender objectionable, problematic, or controversial, but if I had, I would still respect Lauren and Joaquim because of the way they handled the backlash generated by the creative decisions they had made.
Agreed. Just look at all of the whining that went on in the GOT thread on this board... because their team lost. And it continues to this day. I don't blame B&W at all for not wanting to put up with that nonsense.
What consequences? It is entertainment, and you got a story you didn't like? Grow up and realize there's more to life than the finale of "insert show/movie here". I wish a lot of these folks got as worked up over real world issues like hunger, homelessness, illiteracy and gun violence as they do over a TV show ending in a way they didn't like.
You keep making comments that demonstrate just how ignorant you are as to what caused fans to turn on Benioff and Weiss, so let me give you a little education: the backlash was a result of David and Dan 'fridging' certain characters, having other characters behave in ways that were contradictory to their previously-established characterization, resolving certain characters' stories in ways that were not 'earned', and/or ignoring previously-set-up storylines entirely.
This was on top of production decisions and gaffes that shouldn't have happened.
So they were hired to write the show, and they wrote it. Doesn't sound like anything worth a "backlash" over.
I wasn't going to get this specific, but now I am: when you repeatedly portray and verbally set up a certain character - Danaerys Targaryen - as both a role model for women and young girls and then turn around and completely destroy her established characterization by having her become a raving mad despot and murderer over the course of two episodes and do so after first forcing her to watch the death of a friend - who also happens to be a person of color whose death wasn't needed narratively - you're not just "writing a show".
And that is just a single example of why people were angry.
It is a TV show. Turn it off.
I respect and appreciate a passion in regards to the entertainment we consume. We all have it, particularly here. We're on a Star Trek board, after all. At the same time, I agree that there are times it goes way too far.
There's passion, then there's stupidity like the above. Holding creators accountable is non-sense.
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