Would you be OK with a remake of The Cage?

[Amasov]

After watching the two most recent Short Treks, I got to wondering about a possible Captain Pike series again.

I was thinking if a Pike series came to be, I'd be interested in seeing the show pick up from where the Short Trek Q&A ended. If this were to be the case, at some point down the road we'd get to see what happened when the Enterprise visits Rigel VII and then, eventually, bringing us to Talos IV and the events of The Cage.

That being the case, would you want to see a Pike series tell that story again utilizing the current cast? Personally, I think it'd be pretty sweet.

Spoiler

Given that they depicted flashbacks from The Cage in If Memory Serves utilizing footage from the actual episode rather than remake flashback sequences, I'm not sure I can totally visualize this happening.

But, just pure speculation.

 

[Lord Garth]

I don't know what I'd think until I'd see it. I love "The Cage". So I think a remake of "The Cage" could be well-made but would still suffer in comparison. It's like re-making an old movie. Sometimes it works, and sometimes...

I'd like to see an episode about the fight on Rigel VII.

 

[NCC-73515]

I wouldn't want any episode or movie remade. Sequels, prequels, fine. But how often are remakes any better than the original? If it's different enough it's ok, like the Robocop remake that I liked, cause they're still separate stories.

 

[Lord Garth]

Some things would need to be changed to be acceptable by today's social standards. But those things would also impact the script.

I think Vina would need a new motivation for staying behind. "I can't go with you because I'm deformed and I think I'm ugly" wouldn't fly anymore. First because we now know Federation doctors can fix that. And, much more importantly, because "I can't go with you because I'm ugly" just sends the wrong message to people. Vina's motivation for remaining on Talos IV would have to change or at least be added to. She can be vain. But there would have to be more to it.

Boyce offering Pike a martini so he'll talk about what's on his mind doesn't look too good through a 2019 lens either.

Obviously "I can't get used to having a woman on the bridge" would have to go.

The rest of the story could probably still work today.

 

[The Wormhole]

It might be fun to watch, but in the event they do get Anson Mount, Rebecca Romijn and Ethan Peck involved again, I'd much rather seem something new rather than just a remake of The Cage.

 

[fireproof78]

I'd be OK with it. Why not?

 

[Timo]

Some things would need to be changed to be acceptable by today's social standards.

Or the opposite, as being controversial might be mandatory. More mindless sex and degradation would certainly match the basic concept of "wish fulfillment as a trap".

I think Vina would need a new motivation for staying behind. "I can't go with you because I'm deformed and I think I'm ugly" wouldn't fly anymore. First because we now know Federation doctors can fix that.

How? Nothing of the sort was indicated when we last saw Vina, in DSC "If Memory Serves".

And, much more importantly, because "I can't go with you because I'm ugly" just sends the wrong message to people.

So perhaps "I can't go because out there, I'd be a deformed cripple even with machine assistance, and here I am not. How about you come stay here instead? I don't need no fucking saving from random male-presumeds."?

Boyce offering Pike a martini so he'll talk about what's on his mind doesn't look too good through a 2019 lens either.

Wanna bet the next James Bond will drink like a sponge in the name of political correctness? After all, it would be wussy of her not to, and nobody would have the guts to do wussy.

Obviously "I can't get used to having a woman on the bridge" would have to go.

Again, why? People with issues are the big thing nowadays. If Pike is mentally ill or fit for the execution squad, all the better. And perhaps he won't even get better in the end, so that it's edgy?

The rest of the story could probably still work today.

I doubt that. How could we have a hero who sleepwalks through the adventure, achieving less than nothing even when he releases his inner ape, and only surviving through the mercy of his enemies? That went out of the fashion with Blade Runner already...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Lord Garth]

How? Nothing of the sort was indicated when we last saw Vina, in DSC "If Memory Serves".

It was never touched in "If Memory Serves", which means that it would be compatible with any changes made to a new version of "The Cage" if it were made.

Wanna bet the next James Bond will drink like a sponge in the name of political correctness? After all, it would be wussy of her not to, and nobody would have the guts to do wussy.

James Bond, as a character, is permanently stuck in the Mid-20th Century even though the films always take place in the Present Day of the time they're released.

Stories featuring Pike take place in the 23rd Century. The 23rd Century should be more socially advanced than the 21st. Otherwise it's showing the exact opposite of an optimistic future. It's a pessimistic future to assume things become even worse than they are today. That runs directly counter to fans who want Pike to represent a positive vision of the future. They want Pike to represent Traditional Star Trek. And traditional Star Trek means an Optimistic Future.

Again, why? People with issues are the big thing nowadays. If Pike is mentally ill or fit for the execution squad, all the better. And perhaps he won't even get better in the end, so that it's edgy?

First, because it runs counter to his portrayal in Discovery. And second, being a sexist isn't edgy. Edgy means you're cutting edge. This would be the exact opposite. It's not edgy at all. It's a reaction to progress being made toward equality among the sexes that they can't stand. Such people should not be catered to. Some people confuse "offensive" with "edgy". They can overlap but they're not the same.

 

[Timo]

It was never touched in "If Memory Serves", which means that it would be compatible with any changes made to a new version of "The Cage" if it were made.

Hmh? Vina gives Mike Burnham the exact same show-and-tell she gave Pike. The reaction is the same as well. So it was touched - and no contrary evidence exists of UFP medicine somehow being more advanced in the putative "new timeline".

James Bond, as a character, is permanently stuck in the Mid-20th Century even though the films always place in the Present Day of the time they're released.

True enough. But Trek has never been much different. Soldiers as heroes is as much a dinosaur conceit as violent womanizers as heroes...

Bond is done, redone and re-redone for nostalgia. So is King Kong, or Marvel, or <insert name>. How could a remake of "The Cage" be any different?

First, because it runs counter to his portrayal in Discovery. And second, being a sexist isn't edgy. Edgy means you're cutting edge.

Which today is defined as taking a look at problems rather than away from them. What would be unacceptably 1960s would be a squeaky-clean character, a rubber doll like the DSC Pike, a dilution of character I would not have thought possible with somebody as bland as the Pike of "The Cage".

Such people should not be catered to.

So why cater? Tackle is the thing a decent remake would strive for.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Lord Garth]

Hmh? Vina gives Mike Burnham the exact same show-and-tell she gave Pike. The reaction is the same as well. So it was touched - and no contrary evidence exists of UFP medicine somehow being more advanced in the putative "new timeline".

Yes, I know. What I'm saying is she didn't say this is why she stayed behind. It can be inferred but it's not outright said. Vina showed Burnham her true appearance to let Burnham know the Talosians weren't ill-intentioned. She can have other reasons for wanting to stay on Talos IV and still be disfigured. Maybe she feels an obligation or desire to help them.

 

[Lord Garth]

Which today is defined as taking a look at problems rather than away from them. What would be unacceptably 1960s would be a squeaky-clean character, a rubber doll like the DSC Pike, a dilution of character I would not have thought possible with somebody as bland as the Pike of "The Cage".

The Pike in a Pike Series would be based off the Pike from Discovery. A remake of "The Cage" would also be brought in line with Discovery if it were to be made in the Kurtzman Era. Maybe another creative regime might have a different idea, but the Pike we'll see in the Kurtzman Era will be the version we've seen in DSC.

 

[Qonundrum]

Before movies, television, and home video, people either make new stories or retold old ones. Like Shakespeare plays being performed time and again ad nauseum. Or re-reading the novels every so often, at least after novels were first invented.

Remakes can be good, but proverbial lighting strikes are rare.

Reimaginings are also hit or miss, depending on how much is done to what parts of the story. But the best such reimagining, by a very long shot, is easily "Airplane!" -- which is basically 1957's "Zero Hour" done so much as a lampoon they even changed the name. To good effect, anyone seeing the 1957 original might give a pass. And maybe that's the issue people have - changing something iconic into something else... why not make Romeo a sexpest and Juliet telling him "no" and finally telling him to go to either a public bathroom or street corner. It may not be as exciting but it would be more comparatively modern that modern audiences could more easily understand, apparently...

In other words, how is "The Cage" perceived to not work, how is "The Cage" perceived to work, what changes would keep it true to its original spirit while being more mindful of whatever things a remake would change (or to change those whatever things as well) - and whatever the changes being made is up to those making it and nobody else, since audiences only get to like or dislike the product. Rarely is one asked "How can we make it for you?" which seems like pandering. Then we whine about people not being open-minded to try out new things, is pandering leading to audiences being closed-minded? But are remakes new as such?

For me, IMHO, I'm not for a remake. Seems better to be influenced by the previous works but make anything new its own self and let audiences like or dislike it, without being spoonfed. After all, nobody expected Luke to be Darth's son... yet nobody cared when the next movie (which is all but remake in spirit) later when Leia's revealed to be Luke sibling - which then only added more questions than being an audience thriller moment. People loved the first revelation so they'll love it more if everyone around the protagonist is part of one big happy family, and not the song by The Ramones...

 

[Timo]

The Pike in a Pike Series would be based off the Pike from Discovery. A remake of "The Cage" would also be brought line with Discovery if it were to be made in the Kurtzman Era. Maybe another creative regime might have a different idea, but the Pike we'll see in the Kurtzman Era will be the version we've seen in DSC.

Trek's first-ever remakes, the Abrams movies, did not use either original or recently recast characters as their starting points, but reinvented their own takes. Were there to be a "The Cage" telemovie in 2023, it might sever all ties with DSC. Were there to be a "The Cage" Long Trek standalone episode six months from now, they would of course cast Mount and retain much of the character - but no doubt introduce a few bits so as not to make it overtly dull. Abrams had the conceit of an alternate timeline and a prequel; the makers of a DSC-related "The Cage" would still have the conceit of this being a prequel.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Noname Given]

I rather they NOT remake anything. Go ahead and do Pike and Spock on the 1701 with Mount and Peck, but do something totally new. No need to bother redoing a good story that's already been told.

 

[Butters]

I don’t see any pressing need for it. Not averse to some new flashbacks to it, along with flashbacks to some of Pike’s adventures referenced in The Cage.

 

[Yes Man the Great]

Personally I think a Cage remake wouldn’t work unless it was set in an alternate timeline.

 

[fireproof78]

If the questions do I need it, the answer is no. Frankly I don't need anything for Star Trek.

But, the OP was "Would I be OK with it?" and the answer is sure, why not?

 

[Galileo7]

Definitely with ST Discovery's Pike, Spock and Number One.

 

[F. King Daniel]

I wasn't a big fan of "The Cage", but the basic idea is sound and has been done a million times (recently-ish on The Orville), and I'm sure they could put a fresh twist on the story.

Just no scene-for-scene remake with the new actors, that would be a waste of time.

They'd never do it though, they're too stuck in their own weird version of TOS continuity which is very strict in some ways (no Spock/Sarek confrontation) but not others (the scope of the battle at the end of the season begs many questions as to why fleets of fighters are never launched again, it's okay to give Spock a sister)

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

No.