A better Kirk Nexus fantasy?

[F. King Daniel]

The issue with Kirk being on the Enterprise bridge saving the universe as his fantasy, it makes him look like a dangerous glory seeker - which he absolutely was, but it's a dangerous image of an unstable person and not a heroic one.

 

[Jayson1]

The issue with Kirk being on the Enterprise bridge saving the universe as his fantasy, it makes him look like a dangerous glory seeker - which he absolutely was, but it's a dangerous image of an unstable person and not a heroic one.

I don't know. I kind of liked how he put it in "Generations" of "Making a Difference." That is where he felt he was at his best in being able to do that. He never took to being a Admiral sitting behind a desk. Granted I think he does get a kick out of the adventure stuff but he also knew how to command and and how to handle the responsbilities that come with it.

Granted I think he would have even find that scenario bland as well inside the Nexus because just like the horse leap it wouldn't be real and he would kind of figure that out. The ship wouldn't be his ship. His friends would be illusions. None of it would be real.

Jason

 

[Khan 2.0]

I agree but he also has to be riding a horse on the bridge because the horse angle is the only way to get Shatner to sign on board for the movie.

Jason

Picard wakes up in movie era corridor .goes into in turbolift ..steps out on the bridge to find Kirk in cowboy hat, check shirt, jeans organising a charity horse show event

 

[Jayson1]

Picard wakes up in movie era corridor .goes into in turbolift ..steps out on the bridge to find Kirk in cowboy hat, check shirt, jeans organising a charity horse show event

Or maybe they go all in on Kirkisms. He is on the TOS bridge riding a horse with Edith Keeler on back. Spock and McCoy are trading barbs. Everyone else at their post. Gary Mitchell is still alive as is both Carol and David Marcus. Tribbles are raining from the skiy meanwhile KIrk while riding is using human logic to make a computer self destruct.


Jason

 

[Dukhat]

The issue with Kirk being on the Enterprise bridge saving the universe as his fantasy, it makes him look like a dangerous glory seeker - which he absolutely was, but it's a dangerous image of an unstable person and not a heroic one.

I’m not sure I agree with that. By that point, it was all about how legendary Kirk was (or wanted to be again). Kirk even said it himself: he wanted to make a difference one more time. In his mind, making a difference is being in that center seat and not letting anyone remove you from it. Having a fantasy of constantly saving the universe doesn’t seem like the image of an unstable person, considering that he’d saved Earth on more than one occasion and the only person who thought he was a reckless deviant was the Klingon ambassador

 

[Kilana2]

Unfortunately, Merritt Butrick passed away in 1989, so unless we got a recast David that would have been a non-starter.

That wouldn't be the first recast Trek character in history. They considered to recast Saavik another time, invented Valeris instead. Not really a problem for me. Leonard Nimoy is dead, Spock is very much alive!

 

[Jayson1]

If they did recast David they could just go with a child actor and have Kirk interact with the David he never really got to know or be a father to. Kirk getting to be a dad and raising David with Carol could I think be a very good Nexus fantasy.

Jason

 

[F. King Daniel]

Or maybe they go all in on Kirkisms. He is on the TOS bridge riding a horse with Edith Keeler on back. Spock and McCoy are trading barbs. Everyone else at their post. Gary Mitchell is still alive as is both Carol and David Marcus. Tribbles are raining from the skiy meanwhile KIrk while riding is using human logic to make a computer self destruct.


Jason

It's the final battle of Avengers: Endgame in Kirk form.

 

[Kor]

A happy life with Carol or Edith, or both.

Kor

 

[Tom]

Or maybe they go all in on Kirkisms. He is on the TOS bridge riding a horse with Edith Keeler on back. Spock and McCoy are trading barbs. Everyone else at their post. Gary Mitchell is still alive as is both Carol and David Marcus. Tribbles are raining from the skiy meanwhile KIrk while riding is using human logic to make a computer self destruct.


Jason

This, have Kirk and young David ride horses together, go fishing and do something other bonding activities. Kirk gets to live his fantasy as a dad.

 

[Silvercrest]

I think Kirk's ultimate fantasy would to still be on the bridge of the Enterprise.

Then his conversation with Picard would've gone a lot differently, because it would've been a heck of a lot harder to break him out of it. Even if Picard convinced him the threat was real: His first instinct wouldn't be to leave, but to order his ship to the Veridian system!

And if Picard failed to convince him, all he'd have to do was order some security guards to get the bald guy off his bridge.

Picard finds Kirk sitting in a formless void, with a scene from "Requiem For Methuselah" repeatedly trying to form around him but failing. In the conversation, he says that the few other people who have come across him since he arrived have told him that the place is supposed to show him his dreams come true, but he thinks something an old Vulcan friend did to him is stopping it from working on him. Which makes it perfectly understandable that he'd be willing to leave, all the way around.

I like this.

 

[Scout101]

Been a while, but didn't the book have him basically reliving all of his career (at first), doing things better, saving all the crewmembers he lost, etc? But then got a bit disillusioned with it/bored when he realized it wasn't real and wouldn't change anything? thought that was when he started living through his personal mistakes and found himself in the cabin deciding to go back to Starfleet or not...

 

[Kor]

Or Kirk sitting there in Flint's parlor with the piano, but nobody else is there, and there's something nagging at the corner of his brain but he can't quite put his finger on it.

Kor

 

[Dukhat]

This, have Kirk and young David ride horses together, go fishing and do something other bonding activities. Kirk gets to live his fantasy as a dad.

But Kirk never wanted to be a dad, therefore that wouldn’t have been his ultimate fantasy. And the horses thing was Shatner, not Kirk. He flat out states what he wants while in the Nexus: don’t let them promote you, etc. Don’t let them take you away from that center seat, because that’s where you’ll make a difference.

Now it’s possible that the Nexus needed to start his illusion by showing him how wrong retirement was, and had he stayed longer perhaps the fantasy of returning to captain a ship would have happened. But in both Kirk’s and Picard’s immediate fantasies, both men quickly saw through the illusion (which, again, was not how the Nexus was described by Guinan.)

 

[Tom]

But Kirk never wanted to be a dad, therefore that wouldn’t have been his ultimate fantasy. And the horses thing was Shatner, not Kirk. He flat out states what he wants while in the Nexus: don’t let them promote you, etc. Don’t let them take you away from that center seat, because that’s where you’ll make a difference.

Now it’s possible that the Nexus needed to start his illusion by showing him how wrong retirement was, and had he stayed longer perhaps the fantasy of returning to captain a ship would have happened. But in both Kirk’s and Picard’s immediate fantasies, both men quickly saw through the illusion (which, again, was not how the Nexus was described by Guinan.)

Well I'm sure part of Kirk always wanted to be a father for David. Those feeling would have been amplified after David's death, thinking what could have been... Picard's Nexus fantasy was having a family, we know at the time, he been contemplating not having a family (during his talk with Troi) after his nephew dies, so it's fresh in his mind. Before that, there was the whole thing with Jason Vigo, that made him contemplate being a dad. You would also think Picard's fantasy would be Starfleet related, like being on the Stargazer again.

I think we an conclude that Kirk's fantasy should have been either, being with David (being the dad he never was), or going back to the Tos enterprise (his true love) . The fantasy we got made no sense.

 

[DonIago]

Indeed, it seems like what the Nexus most shows you isn't what you actually most want, but what opportunities you most regret. But if you can maintain your sobriety long enough you realize that you may regret these things but (assuming they're based on your own choices at least) you wouldn't change them.

 

[Jayson1]

One thing you notice is you can make changes to your fantasy so what you fantasy going in might be simply be what is on your mind at that moment. Though I still haven't figured out what Guinan meant by "From his perspective, he has just got here." I think also their is some memory loss connected to being in the Nexus or mental fog that impacts people's minds though as we can see you are able to sort of snap out of it if triggered like Picard seeing the ornament and Kirk encountering Picard.


Jason

 

[publiusr]

A good "last" trek story would be--near the universes death as some howling Lovecraftian threat wants to kill off the timeline--the Nexus saves all who ever lived, and forms its own cosmos.

 

[Laura Cynthia Chambers]

Kirk could have had any number of fantasies which he played out prior to the one Picard sees. He plays them to the end and tries another, hoping to find the combination of things which will make him happy.

Or in true Trek fashion, the power behind it all tries and fails to guess what Kirk truly wants.

Wonder if the Talosians are behind the Nexus? Too bad Kirk didn't run into Pike in there.

 

[DonIago]

Kirk could have had any number of fantasies which he played out prior to the one Picard sees. He plays them to the end and tries another, hoping to find the combination of things which will make him happy.

Except that Guinan specifically states that from Kirk's perspective he's just arrived there as well.