In Generations, Kirk's ultimate fantasy is chopping wood, cooking eggs, riding horses and proposing to some flame we've never heard of and have zero emotional connection to. We can all do better. At the very least, by swapping out Antonia with Carol, who we know from Wrath of Khan (and perhaps passing mention in "Where No Man Has Gone Before") Another thread got me thinking of Kirk's Nexus fantasy being him living with Edith Keeler in the 1950's, both brining him personal happiness and righting a necessary evil from 25 years before. What other Kirk Nexus fantasies would have worked better than the Generations one?
Definitely David Marcus still alive in the Nexus. Kirk gets to know him better. David finally has the chance to see all the facets of his father and Kirk might see more of David's career or childhood. Not necessarily reconnecting with the Nexus version of Carol, but developing a friendship with her as they have a son together.
Is it just a little unsettling that neither Kirk nor Picard's greatest fantasies apparently involve them on the bridges of their ships? But yeah, seeing Carol or Edith alive again would have been great. David as well. And hey, since in the Nexus you apparentlyy can have it all, there's no reason we couldn't have gone from one to the other (and back, to avoid any evident favoritism).
Having the Nexus itself pop up in the form of Grand Nagus Gint and say: "Don't blame me for your limited imagination. "
since Kirks ultimate desire at the start of the film was to be in the chair of (an) Enterprise again itd would've made perfect sense for Picard to appear on the bridge of the Enterprise A or the refit 1701..(TOS Ent would've looked too cheap for big screen and Relics did that. and they already had the 'movie bridge' with the EntB just redress it back to VI or II style)..or maybe he appears in a corridor (he and the audience dont know which ship it is at this point) and makes his way to the bridge to see Kirk in the chair (in full uniform) instead of chopping wood. then instead of cooking eggs/going upstairs they have their debate around the bridge and maybe explore some of the ship (redressing the TNG sets Trek VI style) ... and then instead of riding horses (a Shatner suggestion?) maybe have Kirk and Picard witness some key Kirk history that would connect to themes in Generations like something out of Christmas Carol (which would sort of tie in with Picards Dickens Christmas fantasy) e.g. seeing his younger self at the Academy meeting Carol or 'winning' the Kobiashi Maru, or taking over command of Enterprise from Pike/the start of the 5y mission taking the Ent out of spacedock for 1st time, or reclaiming the Ent in TMP ... and/or revisiting some key TOS Trek movie moments (recreated sets or actual footage with Shatner and Stewart in them) like BTTF2 & the DS9 Tribbles/VOY Sulu episodes e.g. Kirks II/III San Fran apartment (Picard in place of Bones), or maybe Kirk would revisit certain traumas explained by his mind going to dark places (that would foreshadow of Kirk eventual fate) like the death of Spock, Davids death, Ent destruction, V campfire. Basically sort of a quick Kirk version of All Good Things..
I was confused about the whole Nexus wonderland realm; watching the movie I suspected what I saw from Kirk was through the perspective of Picard. Meaning what I saw was Picard's interpretation of what he thought would be Kirk's ultimate fantasy since everything seen in the Nexus about Kirk was completely wrong. I agree with Bry_Sinclair, Kirk's ultimate fantasy would be back on the Bridge of the Enterprise but I can't say which version. Would it be him recollecting the totally out of character event he made on 1701-B where he decided to play engineer and ended up losing his life? Kirk was the most experience CO on that ship and he should've taken command on the bridge, no question, and in a life and death situation where the new Captain is unsure of himself. He seemed quite fond of 1701- A, and the refit thing, maybe would have liked to return to those ships since those ships kind of reflected his age. Another thing, wouldn't Kirk like to appear how he was during his youth? Handsome, strong, and athletic? If so, and if his youth was returned to him, I would think he would like to be back on the real Enterprise, Starship Class, no Constitution retcon, the one from TOS.
And he was happy chopping wood and cooking eggs for 80 years until Picard came along and spoiled it all.
Wouldn't that world be one where the US doesn't enter WWII? I shudder to think what that would be like.
Let's be fair, almost anything is a better Nexus fantasy for Kirk than chopping wood outside a cabin stocked with Katarian eggs and dill weed.
Here's the thing about Generations: the opening scene flat out slaps the audience in the face that Kirk hates retirement and wants to command a ship again. That's his ultimate fantasy. But what fantasy does the Nexus give him? Retirement. The one thing he hated more than anything. And even taking into account the idea that what we saw might have been from Picard's point of view, it still makes no sense because Picard doesn't seem to recognize his surroundings or even who Antonia is. He was clearly jealous of Harriman, and also frustrated because Harriman didn't seem to know what he was doing. It also didn't help that Harriman made him feel like an old man. At that point, I'd think Kirk would have liked to have gone back to when he was Harriman's age in command of the original Enterprise. Just imagine seeing Kirk back at the bridge of the Enterprise, with all the crew back (played by younger actors of course), engaged in a battle against the TOS Klingons. But the problem with that, of course, is that that's a fantasy Kirk would never want to leave. So they had to give him the thing he hated most, which was the exact opposite of how the Nexus was described.
More like he hates retirement to loneliness, he's not glad his Starfleet career is behind him but also that he put too much into Starfleet and now after it he doesn't have much else. I think the film sets up plausibly enough that he would, in the middle of the film, most regret having an empty house and want to change that (but then come to realize that's not what he most regrets). It was a difficult challenge to try to write two heroic leads coming together (especially without having either one look bad), the idea that his fantasy should have been always being a heroic captain would have meant no arc or struggle for him, he was a hero before, now he still wants to be one and thinks as one, then Picard asks him to help and so he does ...
Picard finds Kirk sitting in a formless void, with a scene from "Requiem For Methuselah" repeatedly trying to form around him but failing. In the conversation, he says that the few other people who have come across him since he arrived have told him that the place is supposed to show him his dreams come true, but he thinks something an old Vulcan friend did to him is stopping it from working on him. Which makes it perfectly understandable that he'd be willing to leave, all the way around.
Kirk is afraid of death, and becoming old and useless. He wants to make a difference. He wants to be a young man back on the bridge of the Enterprise. They should have had him young, back on NCC-1701 (maybe CGI his face and his waistline, or re-use classic footage?). Imagine Picard walking on to that classic bridge like in Relics, but this time being the one to tell Kirk it's all a fantasy.
I agree but he also has to be riding a horse on the bridge because the horse angle is the only way to get Shatner to sign on board for the movie. Jason
But if the movie had been done in the '80s, the fantasy life would've looked more like jet skis, speedboats and yachts. The '80s were all about that. "Captain's prerogative," as Picard said. It's easy (and unpleasant) to imagine him on a yacht named the Enterprise.
Unfortunately, Merritt Butrick passed away in 1989, so unless we got a recast David that would have been a non-starter.