Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x03 - "Point of Light"

[Tuskin38]

may sound a bit nOObish, but this stuff about women can't be captains eluded me so far somebody got a link, please?

From the TOS Series finale

JANICE: The year we were together at Starfleet is the only time in my life I was alive.
KIRK: I never stopped you from going on with your space work.
JANICE: Your world of starship captains doesn't admit women. It isn't fair.
KIRK: No, it isn't. And you punished and tortured me because of it.
JANICE: I loved you. We could've roamed among the stars.

But that could easily be interpreted in many ways. It could mean he can't be in a relationship while as captain.

 

[oberth]

Turnabout Intuder has the distinction of being the final episode of The original series to air.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turnabout_Intruder

There is a line in the episode about how women can't command starships, but it was completely ignored thereafter. So, it's nothing but a throwaway line from the final episode that was never taken seriously by anyone.

From the TOS Series finale

JANICE: The year we were together at Starfleet is the only time in my life I was alive.
KIRK: I never stopped you from going on with your space work.
JANICE: Your world of starship captains doesn't admit women. It isn't fair.
KIRK: No, it isn't. And you punished and tortured me because of it.
JANICE: I loved you. We could've roamed among the stars.

But that could easily be interpreted in many ways. It could mean he can't be in a relationship while as captain.

i never understood it like that. to me it always meant:

you guys will always conspire towards no woman getting a starship - no matter what's in the books​

it still does - if i'm right there was never a canon violation of that sort

 

[Turtletrekker]

Also keep in mind that Janice Lester was Looney tunes, and quite possibly didn't have the greatest grip on reality.

 

[oberth]

Also keep in mind that Janice Lester was Looney tunes, and quite possibly didn't have the greatest grip on reality.

that's the reason she came up with that conspiracy theory in the first place

 

[137th Gebirg]

In fairness, you could have both ships as 'D-7's' The Sech class could be a 'D-7 Mark 1' and the ship seen in 'Point of Light' as a 'D-7 Mark 2'. Especially if 'D-7' is a generic name that Starfleet uses for Klingon destroyers.

Up until this last episode it could have been easily explained away as a generic SF designation, but since the Klingons themselves referred to this “new” ship as a D-7, it once again muddies those waters. Russians don’t refer to their own subs as “boomers”. The Soviet-era “Alfa” sub was what they called a “Lyra”-class. They should have stuck with assigning full tlhIngan Hol words to the ship instead of saying “Dee-Seven”. Is the “D” character even called “dee” in their alphabet?

 

[thribs]

So the Columbia wasn’t a starship?
The Shenzhou wasn’t a starship?

But remember, the Enterprise back then was referring to be a “Starship Class” vessel. Since that was later change to be a Constitution Class, you can take the line to mean a woman can’t comnand a Constitution Class vessel, which is what that episode of Star Trek Continues deals with.

 

[oberth]

But remember, the Enterprise back then was referring to be a “Starship Class” vessel. Since that was later change to be a Constitution Class, you can take the line to mean a woman can’t comnand a Constitution Class vessel, which is what that episode of Star Trek Continues deals with.

how on earth is that to work? what's the reason for it. there is a reason why only a naval aviator gets to command a carrier group, but what have ovaries to do with a class of heavy cruisers

there's no ounce of sense in that

 

[DaveyNY]

Turnabout Intuder has the distinction of being the final episode of The original series to air.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turnabout_Intruder

There is a line in the episode about how women can't command starships, but it was completely ignored thereafter. So, it's nothing but a throwaway line from the final episode that was never taken seriously by anyone.

.. and was also stated by a character in the show, who was so completely off the deep end that she used an alien machine to switch her personality with her ex-lover/boyfriend, Captain Kirk in revenge for leaving her.

Even her current boyfriend at the time knew she was bonkers but went along with her plan.

 

[Campe]

how on earth is that to work? what's the reason for it. there is a reason why only a naval aviator gets to command a carrier group, but what have ovaries to do with a class of heavy cruisers

there's no ounce of sense in that

Yeah, it’s been quite awhile since I’ve seen the STC episode in question (not that it matters because it’s just a possibility of what MIGHT have happened), but the idea of a woman not being able to Captain any starship is still rather sexist, an artifact of a much different time, coming from one line delivered by a crazy person that is easily dismissed.

 

[ScottJ85]

i never understood it like that. to me it always meant:

you guys will always always conspire towards no woman getting a starship - no matter what's in the books​

​

That's pretty close to how I interpreted it, ie. "we may have equality according to the regulations but it's still a man's world"

 

[DaveyNY]

Janice Lester would never have qualified to be a candidate for a Captaincy anyway.
Her psychosis was not something that just popped up overnight.
I got the impression that it's one of the reason why Kirk left her, she'd been 'out-to-lunch' for a very long time.

 

[Agony_Boothb]

So the Columbia wasn’t a starship?
The Shenzhou wasn’t a starship?

They are classified as sedans

 

[Lord Garth]

The Excelsior must be an SUV.

 

[oberth]

The Excelsior must be an SUV.

according to one cpt scott more of a trainwreck

 

[Turtletrekker]

I remember when the Enterprise-D was constantly being called a cruise ship by detractors.

 

[Guy Gardener]

How many times did Kirk (or Spock, or that one time with McCoy/Scotty) only win because there was a dropkick on the other side who betrayed her species and ship and friends?

15? 20?

It's a moron problem not a woman problem, yet still in the TOS era, week after week the same story of a woman flipping out and wrecking the obvious logical outcome to any given adventure is repeated again and again.

(These scripts were mostly written by men born in the 1920s, trying to identify with what they assumed were an audience of exclusively boys under the age of 14.)

 

[Tuskin38]

I remember when the Enterprise-D was constantly being called a cruise ship by detractors.

Wasn’t it described that in an episode or two as well?

 

[Timo]

Janice Lester would never have qualified to be a candidate for a Captaincy anyway. Her psychosis was not something that just popped up overnight. I got the impression that it's one of the reason why Kirk left her, she'd been 'out-to-lunch' for a very long time.

Actually, becoming a starship captain wasn't even on Lester's agenda - she didn't want to command a starship, she wanted to get James T. Kirk. Or at least we never learned otherwise.

When Jim Kirk became a starship captain, he closed the door on being Lester's trophy, because he entered this different world. And it's only due to this career move of Jim's that Janice suddenly starts to scheme to become starship captain. Not a starship captain, though, but starship captain James T. Kirk specifically, in a single-minded quest to ruin the man.

Kirk does try and tell Lester that she could have continued her "space work", which clearly meant her work in Starfleet because that's what came to an end after the year they spent together. Kirk continued in Starfleet, Lester opted not to. So we lose our one TOS chance to observe whether a woman at that time could have become a starship captain or not; it's only later (that is, with DSC and its female starship captains right before TOS, and the movies a bit after TOS) that we learn that the answer would have been a simple yes.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Phoenix219]

Women can't be captains of STARSHIPS. Which at one point meant only the 12 Constitution Class ships. Other ships were open game.

Damn those Tellarites....

 

[Phoenix219]

So the Columbia wasn’t a starship?
The Shenzhou wasn’t a starship?

They were ships that sail the stars, but not one of the 12 STARSHIP class space cruisers......