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Case dismissed! Discovery and Tardigrade game "not similar"

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You're talking about something that is largely subjective so there's no basis to say I'm "completely wrong". But I think you'll find your opinion is in the minority. Whether Orville is legally in the clear is one thing but from the public opinion perspective it is derivative to the point of openly plagiaristic. The only thing The Orville chose not to bring over are the transporters. I mean, I like the show but I don't respect its filing off of the serial numbers anymore than I do the filing off that Renegades did last-minute after the guidelines were issued. If Seth wanted to do Star Trek he should have pitched CBS. Consider that the animated Trek is going to be comedic so that wasn't out of the question in retrospect.

BTW, the criteria used here as to whether something is a copy or not is way too specific. Who gives a crap if the tardigrade is blue or gray? It's still a tardigrade. Every minute surface detail does not have to be identical for something to be a ripoff. Changing a name of something that is, underneath it all, the same thing, is by definition a ripoff.

mrrock.jpg

A Spock by any other name, is still a Spock.
Except Abdin didn't create the concept of a Tardigrade, it's an Actual Living Organism discovered by Scientists and as such can not be Trademarked or Copyrighted.
And he wasn't the first to use it in a Sci-Fi way.
(as seen by several examples from posts earlier in this very thread)
 
BTW, the criteria used here as to whether something is a copy or not is way too specific. Who gives a crap if the tardigrade is blue or gray? It's still a tardigrade. Every minute surface detail does not have to be identical for something to be a ripoff. Changing a name of something that is, underneath it all, the same thing, is by definition a ripoff.

Nobody said the color by itself means anything. The reason it keeps being discussed is because people keep throwing it out there as 'proof' that Discovery's tardigrade is almost exactly the same as the game's. Which is obviously laughable because the two obviously aren't the same color at all.

And the fact that it's a tardigrade is incidentally also completely worthless in this discussion because tardigrades are real animals. No one gets to claim credit for the idea of using a tardigrade, anymore than for the idea of using a dog or an elephant.

The only relevant discussion here is the combination of "Man-sized" + "FTL travel". And it is fair enough to say that that combination seems possibly suspicious, raises an eyebrow, etc. But it is patently ridiculous to claim that that combination by itself proves anything whatsoever. Especially in light of the fact that the first half has clear, documented provenance (the giant sized tardigrade was conceived as a full-time crew member of the ship - so it would obviously have to be giant sized) and is a direct outgrowth of the decades old sci-fi trope of enlarging tiny creatures anyway (see Them!, Honey I shrunk the Kids franchise, Ant-man, Arachnophobia, and, you know, that *Star Trek* episode with the giant amoeba, and also the Star Trek movie with the super-evolved microbes, etc).

And the same documentation also logically leads to the second half of that equation, too. Because the Tardigrade was too expensive to keep around as a permanent crew member, they had to reconfigure its role in the show but wished to keep it in the same thematic role. So if it couldn't be the actual navigator, then it obviously had to be involved in the mechanical process of navigation. And in order for that to be necessary, it had to have unique capabilities that were relevant to the special drive system.

At the end of the day it is only the *expression* of the idea that is protected at all, and even then only if there is clear evidence that CBS probably didn't come up with the idea separately from the guy who made the game. Comparing the expression between the two, you have enlarged tardigrades with a significantly different appearance (clearly different features and a clearly different color), one is floating in space and teleports itself away (Seriously, that's the only time in DSC when we ever see the Tardigrade actually use FTL travel) and the other is floating in space, grabs a dude, makes him disappear using a transporter effect and then just floats off through space.

That is not a case of Mr. Spock vs Mr Rock. And even if we all agreed it was that close, the actual evidence we've seen strongly suggests that CBS was working towards the idea naturally to begin with and likely didn't even know this game existed, anyway.
 
From that article, the applicable methodology for "The Shows That Brought Us Together in 2017," which is the category that DISCO ranked in:

"5 Based on more than 60,000 survey responses from Netflix members between October 24-30, 2017. The sample is representative of an adult population who watch TV shows with their family in 32 countries. The survey included new show or new season launches of Netflix originals from November 1, 2016 - November 1, 2017 only."​

The "average daily viewing hours per member" was part of the data used to rank "The Shows We Devoured in 2017" and "The Shows We Savored in 2017" only, and DISCO did not rank in the top ten of either of those, so we have no idea how much it was viewed. More info on how those categories are determined is at https://media.netflix.com/en/press-...eals-tv-series-we-devour-and-those-we-savor-1. The short version is that it's based on how fast one binges the whole series/season, faster or slower; incomplete viewing doesn't trigger a tally.

Just a big thanks for citing the whole facts, not just cherry-picking the ones most useful for one's perceived "side" of the argument!
 
I actually would have liked to see more of the Tardigrade - it was an interesting idea - but at the same time, they should have re-imbursed the guy originally coming up with the idea. At least a little.

Or maybe CBS could sue the game creator over ripping off their "Equinox" episodes of VGR, re the nucleogenic lifeforms to improve warp speed?
 
Or maybe CBS could sue the game creator over ripping off their "Equinox" episodes of VGR, re the nucleogenic lifeforms to improve warp speed?

The Tardigrade to the Nucleogenic Lifeform is what the Nucleogenic Lifeform is to "Dune's" pilots:

At least they changed both the creature AND it's use in a way that can be described as "transformative" of the original material!

I really wish they would have done that with the Disco-Tardigrade vs. the Game-Tardigrade as well...
 
The Tardigrade to the Nucleogenic Lifeform is what the Nucleogenic Lifeform is to "Dune's" pilots:

At least they changed both the creature AND it's use in a way that can be described as "transformative" of the original material!

I really wish they would have done that with the Disco-Tardigrade vs. the Game-Tardigrade as well...
How does one do that if one doesn't know of the existence of the other?

Abdin still has to PROVE to the Court without a doubt, that someone working on DISCOVERY actually saw his stuff online.
If he's unable to do so, then your worry/argument is moot.

Whatever happened to "Innocent till Proven Guilty"?
:(
 
How does one do that if one doesn't know of the existence of the other?

Abdin still has to PROVE to the Court without a doubt, that someone working on DISCOVERY actually saw his stuff online.
If he's unable to do so, then your worry/argument is moot.

Whatever happened to "Innocent till Proven Guilty"?
:(
Presumption of Innocence died a long time ago. Corporations deserve no such consideration under the law as they are evil.

:sigh:
 
Presumption of Innocence died a long time ago. Corporations deserve no such consideration under the law as they are evil.

:sigh:
Well, many of them are :evil: .... but that doesn't change one of the basic tenets of our system of laws.

And it's not dead ... Yet.
(though with our current Leaders it has certainly come close to being beaten down almost to capitulation)
:eek:
 
I’ll defer to your knowledge. I myself have never seen a single episode of The Orville, but based on all the commercials I saw for it, it seemed to be a parody of TNG with stupid annoying jokes that were masquerading as actual humor. And this comes from someone who loved Family Guy and American Dad.

The trailers for season one were misleading. For me personally it feels more like an homage to TOS with an extra dose of humor. It looks like TNG but feels more like TOS in terms of it's storytelling style. It has a nice variety of comedy and drama sometimes leaning more on comedy or more on drama. Several of it's episodes are quite serious with very little comedy. It does have groaner jokes but I think most of the humor lands. I can't recommend it enough.
 
Like it as much as you want (I certainly like it for what it is) but don't pretend it's anything but a TNG clone

I just think there is a coy cat and mouse game that always takes place when something becomes popular that clearly imitates the past, whether it's The Orville with Star Trek or Greta van Fleet with Led Zeppelin. True originality is impossible, or at least very rare. How much something feels like a ripoff is mostly due to how few ingredients get thrown into the blender, as everything's a remix. For instance, Star Trek itself is largely a riff on Forbidden Planet. It's just that because Star Trek became much more popular than Forbidden Planet that we think of Star Trek as tabula rasa.
 
Except Abdin didn't create the concept of a Tardigrade

You don't have a very firm grasp on plagiarism lawsuits, do you. You don't have to invent new species to be guilty of copying. Here are a couple of note:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buchwald_v._Paramount
https://ew.com/music/2018/12/13/blurred-lines-copyright-lawsuit-robin-thicke-pharrell-williams-pay/

It's not about claiming copyright on a species, it's the basic structure, the premise/plot.

Most screenplays don't involve tardigrades or other fantasy elements. Those screenplays are still protected by copyright, because you can compare the plot elements.
 
How does one do that if one doesn't know of the existence of the other?

Abdin still has to PROVE to the Court without a doubt, that someone working on DISCOVERY actually saw his stuff online.
If he's unable to do so, then your worry/argument is moot.

Whatever happened to "Innocent till Proven Guilty"?
:(

Oh, legally CBS definitely still counts as "innocent", and just comparing the level of legal representation, you can pretty much count on them being exonerated soon as well.

In a similar matter, legally you have to presume that Ajit Pai - the head of the FCC - made the decision to abolish net neutrality rules is completely uncorrelated to him being a former Verizon lobbyist, still getting money from them, and getting the position at FCC because of these connection in the first place.

It's pretty obvious what the deal here is. But unless it's proven in court, you have to presume "innocence". At least in any official capacity. But COME ON.
 
You don't have a very firm grasp on plagiarism lawsuits, do you. You don't have to invent new species to be guilty of copying. Here are a couple of note:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buchwald_v._Paramount
https://ew.com/music/2018/12/13/blurred-lines-copyright-lawsuit-robin-thicke-pharrell-williams-pay/

It's not about claiming copyright on a species, it's the basic structure, the premise/plot.

Most screenplays don't involve tardigrades or other fantasy elements. Those screenplays are still protected by copyright, because you can compare the plot elements.
Well DSC’s story is nothing like the games.

For one it doesn’t involve ancient Egypt.
 
The trailers for season one were misleading. For me personally it feels more like an homage to TOS with an extra dose of humor. It looks like TNG but feels more like TOS in terms of it's storytelling style. It has a nice variety of comedy and drama sometimes leaning more on comedy or more on drama. Several of it's episodes are quite serious with very little comedy. It does have groaner jokes but I think most of the humor lands. I can't recommend it enough.

Man, Kirk looks good in Union Fleet blue!
 
I think the Dennis the Menace example is quite instructive (thanks, to whomever posted about it upthread, IIRC): exactly the same name, arrived at independently in the same medium, at the very same time, both originally published on exactly the same date, though in two different countries, but it's two different, though similar, characters, both of whose signature weapon is the slingshot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_the_Menace_(U.S._comics)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_the_Menace_and_Gnasher

Come on, indeed!
 
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