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News Next Arrowverse Crossover to Include Batwoman

I have this feeling that the Monitor was being confrontational with Oliver "just because" because there is no way that Barry and Kara were actually going to die despite Clark's assertion that it was inevitable that they would, and that whatever "deal" Oliver made was what was going to happen anyway.

BTW, Mark Pedowitz has said that there are no plans to end any of the Arrowverse series any time in the near future, so the CoIE event is being done because it's a story that the writers and producers have had "baked" into their universe for 4 years, not as a way to end a series or kill off characters.
 
My wish for next year: cut down all the regular show's seasons to 16 episodes and do Crisis as a 10 episode event series! :D

Same workload for actors, tighter arcs on single show, and we get ten whole episodes of awesomeness where everyone from across all casts gets a chance to shine and interact with each other.

It's truly a win-win-win scenario. :techman:

Do it CW, I dare ya to defy! ;)
 
Come on, the Superman thing made all kinds of story sense for these shows.

  • The viewers will have to shut up about "Where's Superman?" every time something really big goes down in National City. Well, Superman's changing diapers in Argo. The show's called Supergirl.
  • Superman, being the guy he is, is not leaving Earth for an extended period unless he's absolutely confident that he will not be letting people down. Therefore, he's only going to go if he knows that someone better than him is patrolling.
 
Romulan_spy said:
It's more likely that Oliver offered his life in exchange for saving Barry and Kara's life. That's usually how these types of bargains work: a life for a life. So presumably, Oliver agreed to have his destiny changed where he will die at some point in the future instead of living. If I am right, this will have big repercussions for Arrow going forward depending on when they decide to end the show. We could get a scene where Felicity protests but Oliver says "I am so so sorry. I made a deal with the Monitor. I have to give my life now".
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So...that's one life. Oliver can't volunteer anyone else's, so... (And to be honest, that was my theory, too, but I can't make it work out in my head. Maybe he pulled a Peter Parker and traded in his relationship with Felicity? Because two people would lose the best parts of their lives in that deal. But damn, that sort of thing is getting tedious.)
 
Romulan_spy said:
Maybe we will get answers in the Crisis on Infinite Earths crossover, but I still want to know why the Monitor even bothered with Deegan. I mentioned this before but if the Monitor was testing Earths to prepare them for the upcoming Crisis, why use a mad scientist who did not even know how to use the Book of Destiny? Why did the Monitor not just use the Book himself to do the test properly?
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Maybe that was part of the test. I'd like more info as to why there is no Superman on Earth 1. Is there even a Krypton? I would think there would be, but if so, did it explode? I still like the idea that it did, but that version of Superman is too young to debut. Maybe HE is in his early 20s, and hasn't had his chance to save the plane yet. And Kara is a young teen in her pod on the way to Earth.

Ryan Thomas Riddle said:
My prediction as well. But maybe they'll surprise us and it'll create a new multiverse...
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Or one universe. One Earth. New histories.

And maybe, just maybe, John Diggle's life is altered and we now know him as John Stewart. I would love that.

Happy Harleydays said:
My wish for next year: cut down all the regular show's seasons to 16 episodes and do Crisis as a 10 episode event series! :D

Same workload for actors, tighter arcs on single show, and we get ten whole episodes of awesomeness where everyone from across all casts gets a chance to shine and interact with each other.

thribs said:
They seemed to be going way faster than Mach 7. Looked more like Ludicrous speed to me.
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Didn't quite get that fast. More like Ridiculous Speed. I don't know if they could have survived Ludicrous. Besides, they would have gone plaid.

It's truly a win-win-win scenario.
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That's a terrific idea actually. It would give lots of characters time to shine. Maybe we can even introduce some new heroes, like Wonder Woman or Batman. And maybe Superman can actually be Superman.

Serveaux said:
The viewers will have to shut up about "Where's Superman?" every time something really big goes down in National City. Well, Superman's changing diapers in Argo. The show's called Supergirl.
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Having him leave for an extended period isn't so much the problem as having him bow to Kara as his superior and emasculating him in the process. That said, he still wouldn't do that. He just was a part of a massive crisis that could span universes. He knows above all that there are things that no hero can handle alone. The idea of him leaving Metropolis unprotected is out of character. He doesn't delegate.

He didn't even say to Kara that he would be there for her if needed.

That wasn't Superman. That was Superwimp.
 
To keep Kara and Barry, he got the Monitor to return Malcolm and the Reverse Flash (or two other baddies? Darhk?) to life for the good/evil balance. (And to allow the actors for those characters to appear more. ;) )
 
Kirk Prime said:
And Kara is a young teen in her pod on the way to Earth.
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Or maybe Kara arrived when she was supposed to, is older than Clark, and hasn't revealed herself and her powers to the world yet because she hasn't been inspired by Superman to do so. But when she does, she'll reveal more of herself than our Supergirl does, as Powergirl. (Because, you know, the boobie window in the costume. ;) )
 
thribs said:
They seemed to be going way faster than Mach 7. Looked more like Ludicrous speed to me.
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Mach 7 would mean going around the Earth once every four and a half hours. So yeah, Barry was going way faster than Mach 7 based on what we saw on screen considering that we saw him and Kara spin around the Earth many times per minute. Just chalk it up to the writers goofing on the speed. Some writer just picked a number that sounded fast without thinking about how slow it really is compared to Barry's max speed. The fact is that the writers have never been very consistent with Barry's speed. This episode made it appear as if going Mach 7 would kill Barry yet we've seen him go much faster. Also, Barry can time travel which would require going at near the speed of light which is 874,000 times faster than the speed of sound. So presumably, Barry can go like 100,000 times faster than Mach 7 and not die. So yeah, the speed thing does not make sense if you try to think about it too hard.
 
USS Triumphant said:
To keep Kara and Barry, he got the Monitor to return Malcolm and the Reverse Flash (or two other baddies? Darhk?) to life for the good/evil balance. (And to allow the actors for those characters to appear more. ;) )
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wouldn't that be something?

Team Arrow: "What?! What are Damien Dhark and Merlyn doing here. Aren't they supposed to be dead?"
Oliver: "Yeah, about that guys... uh... I made a deal with the Monitor and brought them back."
Team Arrow gives Oliver death glares with their eyes.
 
USS Triumphant said:
Or maybe Kara arrived when she was supposed to, is older than Clark, and hasn't revealed herself and her powers to the world yet because she hasn't been inspired by Superman to do so. But when she does, she'll reveal more of herself than our Supergirl does, as Powergirl. (Because, you know, the boobie window in the costume. ;) )
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I don't think that's the case. If Kara was present on Earth 1, Deegan would have said so. They kind of established there was no record of any Kryptonians on Earth 1. My thinking though is that it's possible Deegan wasn't looking at the future--just the past and present. So it's possible that if Clark is living pre-debut, he wouldn't catch any attention.

I love the idea of a Powergirl storyline, but that should be introduced on Supergirl. And would they do something about the boobs?
 
Romulan_spy said:
Also, Barry can time travel which would require going at near the speed of light which is 874,000 times faster than the speed of sound.
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Not really. Approaching the speed of light would only cause time dilation -- your subjective clock would advance more slowly than that of an outside observer (although it would seem to you as if they were the ones slowed down, because from your POV they're the ones moving near the speed of light), but it would still be moving forward. It's only if you go above the speed of light, essentially turning your matter into tachyons, that you'd go backward in time. And you can't go faster than light just by accelerating, because it would take infinite energy and time to accelerate to the speed of light.

So Flash time travel must be something else, something tied to the Speed Force. As it's been portrayed in the show, it's basically a form of breaching, except it's breaching forward or backward in time instead of sideways in time to parallel worlds. And when we've seen the Flash open a time travel breach, he's been running immensely slower than the speed of light. At c, you could circle the entire Earth 8 times in one second, but the Flash didn't even get out of Central City before creating a temporal breach. (Of course, if you ran faster than about 11 kilometers per second, you'd achieve escape velocity and go shooting off into space, although what we saw last night with the Flash circling the Earth at far beyond that speed shows that that bit of physics doesn't apply in the Arrowverse.)
 
I imagine that the reason Superman never intervenes is because he trusts Kara to get the job done. He’s constantly supportive of her, believing in her when she sometimes doesn’t in herself. He really only comes in when it comes down to things he personally knows or can do because of experience. He and Kara seem to be equal in power, he just has a few more years of experience. That’s why I think he steps away and leaves her to protect Earth. If something happened to him, she’s Earth’s only protector and he wants her to be fully capable and not stressing over what he would do. Her only real issue is living in the shadow on his cape, him stepping away allows her to realize that she doesn’t need him.
 
COIE seems like too big of an event to be confined to 3 episodes next year, I'm hoping they'll sprinkle some of it through otu the first half of each of the show's seasons.
 
The last episode was easily the weakest, but overall it was still a good crossover and I'm hyped for next year's event.

All the stuff with Kara and alternate Alex was annoying and went on way too long. Plus, I'd have liked to see Doctor Destiny in part 3, not the guy cosplaying as Superman. Also, Superman would never put away his cape like that. It makes sense that Lois has to go somewhere, but Superman isn't going to leave the world to Supergirl by herself for potentially years, that ridiculous and obviously only done because the show 1) wants you to know just how super special awesome Supergirl is and 2) wants to write Superman away fro some big thing Supergirl will be dealing with in the future. I like the character of Supergirl, but you don't have to knock Superman down to raise her up, or have her treated like she's the best thing ever.

Supergirl is a great hero, but neither her nor Superman can do literally everything themselves, so it just feels like a cheap ploy that actually accomplishes the opposite of what they want, since I'm a bit annoyed by Supergirl being treated like god's gift to the world by the writers.

Still, despite that the stuff related to the main crossover story was decent, and overall it was a fun crossover, and one I'm glad didn't get the Legends of BL involved. Hopefully next year goes really crazy with its crossover.
 
Just for fun I did some rough back of the envelope calculations and based on the fact that Barry & Kara seem to complete a circuit of the Earth about three and a half times per second, they were indeed *not* going mach 7, but something closer to mach 393,000. Or more helpfully: a little over 0.4C. Ironically, at the speed shown they would indeed both experience some time dilation...and also probably ignite the atmosphere, vaporise the oceans, split the crust in two and level every surface within 1000 miles of wherever they ran...

But who cares? It's a goofy concept anyway, just go with it! ;)
 
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