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News Next Arrowverse Crossover to Include Batwoman

Great finale, especially the tease for the next crossover.

Random thought, worlds colliding could be that Earth-1 and Earth-38 get combined since they already established that there was no Superman or Supergirl in Earth-1's universe. I don't want Barry to die though.
 
Kara is the one who should be worried. People seem to forget about her fate in it as well.
 
mickmike said:
Why is supergirl not on the same earth as the others?
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Because her history includes a public, active Superman, a world full of alien immigrants, and a world conspiculously absent of metahumans for the most part. The Arrowverse began in a very grounded place with very little that wasn't real life, groud level stuff. If Superman had been active the entire time, that would not have been the case.

Untitled Hallmark Movie said:
Great finale, especially the tease for the next crossover.

Random thought, worlds colliding could be that Earth-1 and Earth-38 get combined since they already established that there was no Superman or Supergirl in Earth-1's universe. I don't want Barry to die though.
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If they are smart, they will have Nora take Barry's place, since she shoudln't be there anyways, and the Tornado Twins can be born in the new timeline.
 
Professor Zoom said:
Exactly. And if the problem he's facing can't be paused to stop a threat to mankind, wouldn't that mean it's ALSO a threat to mankind? Wouldn't that be important to know?
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To any other version of Superman, perhaps, but on the CW version, he--more often than not--is never able to fully involve himself in global threats.
 
Tuskin38 said:
Flash, Arrow and Legends of Tomorrow are on the same earth. Supergirl isn’t, Black Lightening is unknown.
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Black Lightning all but screams that its set in the real world, with references to real U.S. presidents, authors, cultural events, etc., and Supergirl was only mentioned as a character, not a real person.
 
TREK_GOD_1 said:
Black Lightning all but screams that its set in the real world, with references to real U.S. presidents, authors, cultural events, etc., and Supergirl was only mentioned as a character, not a real person.
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I’m going with that BL is set on Earth-77. Our world is Earth-Prime.
 
I'm so glad I waited to watch all three parts in one sitting. That was so much fun! I had a grin on my face from the very beginning to end. I literally clapped and cheered a few times. And I even squeed when the Remy Zero cued.

The thing is, though, said pretty much the same thing the last two years. And I'm kind of bothered by it because I see what the creators are capable of. But then you go back to the shows proper only to find them still mired in nonsensical exposition, puerile melodrama, and villains that I just can't be bothered to care about, with only fleeting moments of the same fun found in these crossovers. And I know they can still manage it on a week-to-week basis because they did so in early Flash and they're doing so now every week in Legends. Seriously, I think every single episode of Legends this season has been a home run - because the writing has been on the same "wavelength" as these crossovers.
 
You know, Barry’s and Oliver’s plan could be used to solve almost every problem.

Diggle: Diaz has escaped and has an army heading to Star City. What do we do?

Oliver: I’ll go to Earth-38 and get Superman. He’ll handle it. I'm going to Tahiti.
 
Overall, I think the crossover was terrific, but it was marred once again by writers who should not be writing for the Superman character. It seems that they are just determined to have Superman be Kara's submissive.

He can't seem to win a fight or even get the upper hand. And then he once again bows to Kara, and essentially claiming she is his superior in every way, and finally, figures that because Kara exists, the world doesn't need Superman, so he will abandon his adopted planet, because after all, there are no threats that the great Kara can't handle.

It was pretty sad and insecure on the part of the writers, who don't seem to understand that they can't make Supergirl better by making Superman worse.

The role may be well cast, but this isn't Superman. This is Superwimp.

A shame, because this took away from the rest of the crossover and hurt Supergirl once more.
 
Putting aside the ridiculous physics of slowing the Earth's rotation leading to time slowing down: how did slowing time help them defeat Deegan?
 
Snaploud said:
Putting aside the ridiculous physics of slowing the Earth's rotation leading to time slowing down: how did slowing time help them defeat Deegan?
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It would have made sense if Superman was immune to the effects of slowing down time, and could grab the book and save Lois while time was slowed. Of course, that would require Superman being useful, which these writers are determined not to allow.
 
Untitled Hallmark Movie said:
Random thought, worlds colliding could be that Earth-1 and Earth-38 get combined since they already established that there was no Superman or Supergirl in Earth-1's universe.
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I really hope not. Earth-38's different, more alien-centric history is a core element of Supergirl's identity as a show, and it would lose something if its reality were homogenized with the reality of the other shows.

Besides, eliminating the multiverse in Crisis on Infinite Earths was a mistake, one that DC eventually reversed. There's no logic in slavishly copying a bad idea from the past. Frankly, CoIE was a bad story, an incoherent mess serving a purpose that didn't work. I read yesterday that its own writer, Marv Wolfman, has said that the only good thing about CoIE was the massive paycheck he got for it.

If the Arrowverse does something called CoIE, my hope is that they do it differently, that they improve on the original and give it a different outcome. I think we got a hint last night that that's already the plan. Part 3 alluded to the fact that Barry Allen and Kara Zor-El were "destined" to die in the Crisis (as they did in the comics), but Oliver made a deal with the Monitor to change that destiny. I think that's already an expression of their intent to tell the story in their own way, to allude to the outcome in the comics but have the Arrowverse characters change that outcome. (Which is similar to how The Flash justified giving the villain Cicada a different identity than he has in the comics -- they alluded to his comics identity being his "usual" one across the multiverse, but said that Nora's time travel into the past had changed history so that someone else became Cicada.)
 
Actually, Kara and Barry were destined to die in the Elseworld's crossover, and that's what Oliver helped prevent somehow.

I think it's pretty safe to bet that they aren't going to kill Barry and Kara.

But it would be interesting if they use this crisis to completely reset their continuity, and go in new directions.
 
Kirk Prime said:
Overall, I think the crossover was terrific, but it was marred once again by writers who should not be writing for the Superman character. It seems that they are just determined to have Superman be Kara's submissive.

He can't seem to win a fight or even get the upper hand. And then he once again bows to Kara, and essentially claiming she is his superior in every way, and finally, figures that because Kara exists, the world doesn't need Superman, so he will abandon his adopted planet, because after all, there are no threats that the great Kara can't handle.

It was pretty sad and insecure on the part of the writers, who don't seem to understand that they can't make Supergirl better by making Superman worse.

The role may be well cast, but this isn't Superman. This is Superwimp.

A shame, because this took away from the rest of the crossover and hurt Supergirl once more.
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I was actually expecting more of this kind of thing, but at least Kirk Prime came through. Never change.

I'm afraid I found this event rather underwhelming overall. Last year's crossover was a home run, but this one mostly felt like an unfocused jumble. It had its moments -- I love that Kara and Alex's bond extends across Earths -- but in the end I mostly regret that Supergirl had to sacrifice an episode of its excellent season for this digression. For all the crossover's hype, last night's Black Lightning was the best CW DC entry this week.
 
Kirk Prime said:
Overall, I think the crossover was terrific, but it was marred once again by writers who should not be writing for the Superman character. It seems that they are just determined to have Superman be Kara's submissive.

He can't seem to win a fight or even get the upper hand. And then he once again bows to Kara, and essentially claiming she is his superior in every way, and finally, figures that because Kara exists, the world doesn't need Superman, so he will abandon his adopted planet, because after all, there are no threats that the great Kara can't handle.

It was pretty sad and insecure on the part of the writers, who don't seem to understand that they can't make Supergirl better by making Superman worse.

The role may be well cast, but this isn't Superman. This is Superwimp.

A shame, because this took away from the rest of the crossover and hurt Supergirl once more.
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I didn't mind too much that evil superman bested Superman in their first fight. After all, Keegan might have made himself a slightly more powerful version of our Superman. Plus, Superman may have underestimated him since it was their first fight. And there are plenty of times in the comics and movies that Superman appears to lose his first fight but then ultimately comes back and wins in the end! And Superman did contribute to the success of the team. He was instrumental in opening the book and giving Barry and Oliver their powers back. But the speech at the end where he tells Kara that she is stronger than him and Earth does not need a Superman when they have Supergirl, really irked me. It was so unnecessary. Clark could still encourage Kara without putting himself down. He could have said "I believe in you and I am confident our Earth is in good hands while I am gone!" That's expressing confidence in Kara without putting himself down in the process.

Overall, I loved part 3 because I loved the premise. Seeing a world governed by an evil superman was cool. The character moments were great. The scenes with the Monitor were excellent. The action sequences were a lot of fun to watch as always. And I have no problem with the decision to send Superman and Lois off to Argos to start a family. But the 2 lines about Supergirl being better than him were totally unnecessary IMO.
 
Romulan_spy said:
But the speech at the end where he tells Kara that she is stronger than him and Earth does not need a Superman when they have Supergirl, really irked me. It was so unnecessary. Clark could still encourage Kara without putting himself down. He could have said "I believe in you and I am confident our Earth is in good hands while I am gone!" That's expressing confidence in Kara without putting himself down in the process.
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It's not "putting himself down," it's just being characteristically humble and selfless. Look at the writings of the finest people in history, like Gandhi, and they rarely have anything positive to say about themselves; all their praise is reserved for others, while they freely admit their own flaws and imperfections and their struggle to improve. The people who praise themselves the most are the egotistical jerks, the narcissists, the villains. Superman was completely in character here. His greatest power is the way he builds other people up, sees the best in them and helps them see the best in themselves.

Heck, if anything, Super-Deegan was a textbook example of how dangerous Superman would be if he weren't humble and selfless, if he didn't always elevate others above himself. And someone as powerful as Superman has no reason to feel the insecurity that goads men in our society to be afraid to admit weakness. He embodies a healthier masculinity, the kind that's about using your strength to lift up others rather than to feed your own pride and self-importance.
 
Some more thoughts on the crossover as a whole now that it is over.

Part 1: B-
Lots of individual good moments. The fight with Amazo was great. But the first part with Barry and Oliver switching places was a bit clunky. I don't think it quite worked as the writers intended. And Stephen Amell just looked weird in the Flash costume. I agree with a youtube review that perhaps it would have been better to have the rest of the world change and Barry and Oliver remain the same instead. The Kent farm scenes were great.

Part 2: B
Loved seeing Gotham City. Batwoman was great. The big action scene with Arkham Asylum was well done as always. We got some great scenes with Batwoman and Supergirl.

Part 3: A+
Great premise with an evil Superman. Great world building. Some really good character moments with the Oliver and the Monitor and Kara and Alex. Great action scene with all heroes doing their part. The only nitpick I have is Superman saying that Earth does not need him because they have Supergirl and that she is stronger than him. Just a bit unnecessary. It puts down Superman for no reason. Otherwise, fantastic conclusion to the crossover. Really psyched for the upcoming Crisis on Infinite Earths.

Overall a really good crossover with lots of good moments but a weak start. I do wonder if this crossover suffered a bit from overhype. The invasion crossover was truly epic because it was the first time we got all our heroes from all 4 shows on the same screen together. And of course, the Earth X crossover was also really epic with all our superheroes again from all 4 shows and their doppelgangers. When you set the bar so high, it is hard to surpass it.
 
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